Poll

Can you reproduce the Freeze-up Bug as described in this thread?

Yes, can reproduce the freezing.
42 (39.6%)
No, can't reproduce the freezing.
64 (60.4%)

Total Members Voted: 101

Author Topic: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??  (Read 143730 times)

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Offline alsetalokin4017

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #350 on: November 06, 2015, 03:51:29 pm »
Yes, the saving of screenshots to the USB stick is very slow, sometimes taking several minutes if you have several channels turned on or other complex setups happening! I've found that if you Stop the scope with the RUN/STOP button, it helps to make the saving of the screenshots to USB stick much faster.

This is just another problem with the scope's software that should not exist. How long, really, does it take to save a  40-80 kb .png or .jpg file to external storage? Especially when the scope suspends response to most controls during the save. It should only take a few seconds or less!

The video demonstrates that there is really no overriding reason for the saves to USB stick to take so long. The scope clearly has the data in the right format and can transfer it instantly to the computer... so why does it take so long to write it to the USB stick? Poor programming seems to be the only reason for this.

On the other hand, I have not experienced the "LAN freeze" when using Telnet or DSRemote from my Linux computers. DSRemote saves a complete screenshot very fast too, and shows a "partial" display of the scope's screen and controls in near-real-time over the LAN.


ETA: I just realized I have not tried the DSRemote LAN connection since "upgrading" to SP2. I hope the "upgrade" didn't break this remote-control and screensave capability.

« Last Edit: November 06, 2015, 03:53:10 pm by alsetalokin4017 »
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Offline alsetalokin4017

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #351 on: November 06, 2015, 04:18:07 pm »
Scott, the reason you do not have the Pulses or Edges measurements in the Horizontal Measurements is because you are still running "Software Version" 00.04.03.SP1 instead of the most recent "update" version which identifies itself as SP2. If you install the latest firmware you'll have your "pluses". But beware... it may slow down the scope, and you'll have no way to roll back to the earlier software version if you don't like the resulting performance. I wish I had _not_ installed this "update", frankly, as I am perfectly capable of counting pulses myself and _getting the count correct_. The slowing of the scope, the fact that the freezing and math errors are still there, by far offset the "Pluses" feature. But there's no way that I can find to roll back to earlier firmware!

Also your attempt to reproduce the Math error is not using the specific settings that have been listed several times. The Math error occurs at 500 _nano_seconds per division, not 500 microseconds as in your video test. Please try again with 500 ns/div set in the horizontal scale, Average acquire mode and Auto mem depth.
 
It is unlikely that you have the Freeze Bug since you have the Boot Version 0.0.1.3.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2015, 04:22:33 pm by alsetalokin4017 »
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Offline alsetalokin4017

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #352 on: November 06, 2015, 04:26:49 pm »


But FWIW, the DS1000Z series just got another page of measurements added to that particular menu in the latest firmware release. So it may get added in the near future.  :-//

It didn't really get "another page of measurements", it got 4 added measurements: +Pulses, -Pulses, +Edges, and -Edges. This made the total page count go from 3 to 4, but it's not really another whole page.  And let's hope that Rigol gets the spelling and the counting right, if they should add this "feature" to other scope series.
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Offline c4757p

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #353 on: November 06, 2015, 04:31:56 pm »
The comments about saving to a USB stick are interesting. Minutes? Mine takes about three seconds in 'stop' and five-six in 'run'. Are your USB sticks actually vegetables with USB ports glued on?
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Offline Scottjd

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #354 on: November 06, 2015, 05:21:05 pm »
Well I guess it may be the conditions you have set when you save the image. How many channels running and so on. I also noticed JPG or bitmap it takes longer then png. I made the mistake of changing the format and it took longer to print the screen. A faste USB vegetable does make a difference a little, not much.

I've actually have not tried to produce the math error, I thought the pulses were only associated with the math since I've never seen it before and don't use the math much at all. I was going to just download the  file import for the math error. But I guess now I know it better, I might not need the file.

Now that I know the pulses are only a SP2 beta feature, wait I'll cal that more an Alfa feature, no thanks on the update. I've only had the scope a couple months, but years of working network tech, firewalls and stuff I know better then to not apply a change without a back out option. In the company I worked for your change wouldn't even be approved if you didn't have a way to back it out incase something went wrong.
Is this "SP2" even officially released? I don't think I will be trying it until it's officially released. I already stated in the thread its not happening on my scope because of the slow down alone.

As for the Lam freeze its not the first time, now I remember why I don't use it. I onky plug in LaN if I need to connect on port 5555 for running some CLI options. But then I usually unplug it.
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Offline Karel

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #355 on: November 06, 2015, 06:05:18 pm »
On the other hand, I have not experienced the "LAN freeze" when using Telnet or DSRemote from my Linux computers. DSRemote saves a complete screenshot very fast too, and shows a "partial" display of the scope's screen and controls in near-real-time over the LAN.

ETA: I just realized I have not tried the DSRemote LAN connection since "upgrading" to SP2. I hope the "upgrade" didn't break this remote-control and screensave capability.

DSRemote seems to work fine with SP2. My impression is, however, that the waveform update rate dropped somewhat.
I shouldn't have updated to SP2...
 

Offline alsetalokin4017

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #356 on: November 06, 2015, 06:49:40 pm »
The comments about saving to a USB stick are interesting. Minutes? Mine takes about three seconds in 'stop' and five-six in 'run'. Are your USB sticks actually vegetables with USB ports glued on?

Yes, I've seen it take over two minutes, during testing. I've tried both an 8GB carrot USB and a 4GB celery stalk USB and they are both pretty slow. Other people have also noticed and complained about this slowness, but I don't know what vegetables they are using.

Sometimes I can get fast saves too, like with just one channel on, and nothing else happening. But in the general case it takes longer.
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Offline alsetalokin4017

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #357 on: November 07, 2015, 06:38:08 pm »
Hah... I am ROFLing all over the place this morning. Check this out:     :-DD     :wtf:      :palm:     |O

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Offline John Coloccia

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #358 on: November 07, 2015, 09:03:06 pm »
To be fair, it seems like you're constantly trying to download firmware, testing lockups and things like that. I'm really not surprised that something minor like a startup counter may not be 100% accurate.
 

Offline alsetalokin4017

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #359 on: November 07, 2015, 10:43:22 pm »
To be fair, it seems like you're constantly trying to download firmware, testing lockups and things like that. I'm really not surprised that something minor like a startup counter may not be 100% accurate.

Well, _to be fair_ you really should try to get your facts straight. I am not _constantly trying to download firmware_, I am not constantly testing lockups and things like that. I am actually using my scope on a daily basis for ordinary benchwork. I am also in the process of _documenting_ bugs in the scope, for the benefit of anyone who may benefit and for the benefit of Rigol, who just may have been finally cajoled into sending me a replacement. I _regret_ having installed the latest SP2 firmware, I only installed it because I was told BY RIGOL USA SUPPORT that it would cure the math and freeze bugs, but it did not. That makes 3 -- count them carefully -- three whole firmware updates I have downloaded and installed in the 7 months I have owned this scope. Wow! I have only made and checked the full System Information screenshots because I was ASKED to do so by RIGOL USA support.  You will just have to forgive me if I expect a measuring instrument to give me accurate measurements when I ask it to do so. Your mileage may vary of course. If you think something +easy to implement+ like a startup counter is "minor" when it doesn't give an accurate count.... all I can say is ...   :palm: You probably don't care that the "Pluses" counter miscounts, either.
To be fair.
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Offline John Coloccia

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #360 on: November 07, 2015, 11:28:22 pm »
Uhm, I didn't mean to get you riled up. I wasn't saying it like you did something wrong or weird. I think you've probably locked up, reset, upgraded, tried to downgrade and otherwise fiddled with their scope more than anyone, so I have to think you're exercising paths in the software that no one ever considered and you're probably going to see some funkiness that no one else will. I don't know why you see that as some sort of insult or slight.  :-// Damn, just making conversation.
 

Offline GonzoTheGreat

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #361 on: November 08, 2015, 11:16:02 pm »
I think you've probably locked up, reset, upgraded, tried to downgrade and otherwise fiddled with their scope more than anyone, so I have to think you're exercising paths in the software that no one ever considered and you're probably going to see some funkiness that no one else will.
Normally employees or subcontractors (a.k.a. beta testers) get paid good money for exercising all of the paths in a software, so the programmers can get their act together and users get a usable product without surprises.

Misimplementing such simple functions as counters is an indication of slipshod programming practices that is likely to have serious consequences down the line in other areas.  I am speaking from experience as I am an experienced low-level programmer who does his taxes in hex.

We (users) would probably be better off with open-source firmware that we could debug and perfect ourselves.
 

Offline Marcos

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #362 on: November 08, 2015, 11:41:03 pm »
Not sure if observed by others but noticed that playing with Mem Depth to anything lower than 12M will freeze the scope using the same setup as before.
Also, randomly, board version is changed from 0.1.1 to 0.2.3 (once 100MHz option is enabled) with previous firmware SP1.
I would like to ask you guys if after unlocking your scope to 100MHz are you able to see that option as Official in "Installed Option" ?

EDIT : Well, playing a little more with it the "randomly" board version change is not quite as random as it looks. I can reproduce this fault easily, first freezing the scope with the previous setup, reboot and voila, board version changed from 0.1.1. to 0.2.3 !
Corrupted data ?
Have no idea what's going on here  :palm:
« Last Edit: November 09, 2015, 12:39:44 am by Marcos »
 

Offline kalvenk

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #363 on: November 11, 2015, 10:08:14 am »
By following the guide lines, I have tested my ds1054z scope and the results are as below:

My Scope sys info:
Software version 00.04.03.00.01
Board version: 0.1.1
Boot version 0.0.1.3
Firmware version: 0.2.3.11
CPLD version 1.1

(A) Freezing test:
Unable to repeat with many tries and never occur luckily ;D.

(B) Math error: yes and it does occur with the below conditions: :(
1)   Scope Must be set to 500ns/div (otherwise, No error)
2)   Acquire-->mode must be set to “Averages” (otherwise, No error)
3)   It must have at least three channels or more to be turning on. (I used A and B for the math (A+B) and C/D just connected to nothing.). If only turning on A and B, the error won’t occur.
(NOTE: the above three conditions MUST be met at the same time in order to have the math error occurred)

BTW, input frequency, voltage and waveform do NOT contribute to the error.
 

Offline kalvenk

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #364 on: November 12, 2015, 02:49:40 pm »
By following the guide lines, I have tested my ds1054z scope and the results are as below:

My Scope sys info:
Software version 00.04.03.00.01
Board version: 0.1.1
Boot version 0.0.1.3
Firmware version: 0.2.3.11
CPLD version 1.1

(A) Freezing test:
Unable to repeat with many tries and never occur luckily ;D.

(B) Math error: yes and it does occur with the below conditions: :(
1)   Scope Must be set to 500ns/div (otherwise, No error)
2)   Acquire-->mode must be set to “Averages” (otherwise, No error)
3)   It must have at least three channels or more to be turning on. (I used A and B for the math (A+B) and C/D just connected to nothing.). If only turning on A and B, the error won’t occur.
(NOTE: the above three conditions MUST be met at the same time in order to have the math error occurred)

BTW, input frequency, voltage and waveform do NOT contribute to the error.

Retest after upgrading to 04.03.02.03
(A)   Freezing test: never occur.
(B)   Math Error: still existing as before upgrade
(C)   Spelling issue that displaying ‘Pulses’ incorrectly as ‘Pluses’ at the bottom of screen when any pulse count function is selected.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2015, 02:51:40 pm by kalvenk »
 

Offline kalvenk

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #365 on: November 12, 2015, 03:27:59 pm »
Finally, I could experience the freezing issue :( but only when printing/dumping screen to USB storage. The steps are:
1)   start the scope as usual and connect any signal waveform to A channel
2)   Must set the memDepth to be Auto.
3)   Must set the persisTime to be 100ms or more
4)   Press the zoom (doesn’t matter which time base is used)
5)   insert the formatted USB storage
6)   Press the “print” button and screen should display saving progress and then it just freezes somewhere during the progress and all the buttons are non responding and requires power recycling to resume the scope.

Suggest trying the above steps for those who could not reproduce freezing bug by simply engaging the horizontal zoom mode and see if this could trigger the bug.
 

Offline Marcos

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #366 on: November 13, 2015, 12:14:21 am »
Let's hope they will rebuild everything from scratch, otherwise, wasted money.
I regret buying this scope. Only bugs. Their software is unstable (or maybe hardware too).
You get what you pay. Cheap price, crappy stuff.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2015, 12:17:36 am by Marcos »
 

Offline Fennec

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #367 on: November 13, 2015, 10:13:29 am »
You get what you pay. Cheap price, crappy stuff.

aw, come on, play fair. Of course this Scope is really cheap, but it is a really good scope too. Where you find a DSO like this for under $US 1000 ? And an Aglient, Gould, Tek. also have those bugs if you search long enough. And the bugs found here does not make the Scope useless.
K, it's a cheap Scope for hobbyists, but not Crap.
 

Offline Wirehead

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #368 on: November 13, 2015, 11:28:44 am »
Yeah, some replies sound a bit exaggerated.. At least they could send their scopes for free to me if they're that bad, I'll happily pay shipping..  :-DD

If they're that unhappy, why haven't they sent them back to the dealer as a malfunctioning product?  :-// Get a refund or pick another scope.. My 0.02$.
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Offline c4757p

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #369 on: November 13, 2015, 12:03:13 pm »
Even I had to soften up on it after getting one and seeing how nice it was. ::)

Really, it's very functional, and I really like Rigol's UI design (I find it even more intuitive to use than the Agilents I've interacted with). It's got a few quirks - I could have some fun with the source code! - but overall it's an excellent scope, and IMNSHO, not even just "for the money".
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Offline John Coloccia

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #370 on: November 13, 2015, 12:46:52 pm »
Even I had to soften up on it after getting one and seeing how nice it was. ::)

Really, it's very functional, and I really like Rigol's UI design (I find it even more intuitive to use than the Agilents I've interacted with). It's got a few quirks - I could have some fun with the source code! - but overall it's an excellent scope, and IMNSHO, not even just "for the money".

It's way more than just functional, too. Most of the bugs are pretty obscure. I've been an engineer for 20 years, and I've had access to FAR more expensive gear than this cheap little scope, and probably far more expensive gear than most engineers because of what I used to do, for that matter. This is nothing compared to the bugs you often find in expensive gear. Of course, that doesn't really excuse Rigol for not aggressively killing this stupid bug. Sounds like they DID do what I was suggesting and try to swap scopes with the OP (presumably for debugging on an actual failing unit), but what a short sighted, stupid way to do it. Just send a new scope, and he'll put the old one in the box and send it back. Sheesh, how difficult is this??
 

Offline madires

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #371 on: November 13, 2015, 01:03:51 pm »
Even I had to soften up on it after getting one and seeing how nice it was. ::)

Really, it's very functional, and I really like Rigol's UI design (I find it even more intuitive to use than the Agilents I've interacted with). It's got a few quirks - I could have some fun with the source code! - but overall it's an excellent scope, and IMNSHO, not even just "for the money".

I haven't used my DS1054Z much yet, but the last few days I had to debug some I/O level shifting and SPI issues. Yes, the UI is quite good. I've found all settings without consulting the manual and spent my time with debugging and not figuring out how the scope works. When I bought the scope half a year ago I went through the manual for a quick overview, but that's all. In my opinion the DS1054Z is the best bargain at the moment. The only thing which annoys me is the probe's 1x/10x switch. It likes to switch to 1x each time I look at it. Maybe I should put some tape over it.
 

Offline c4757p

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #372 on: November 13, 2015, 01:37:46 pm »
Switchable probes are the devil. I'll probably do that with mine, or even just remove the plastic switch actuator entirely. I have enough fixed x1 probes.

TBH though, having had so many used scopes, I've never really considered the probes to be part of it - I was pleasantly surprised to get a set of four, having completely forgotten they were typically included. :P So I'll be okay if they're a bit crap..
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Offline John Coloccia

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #373 on: November 13, 2015, 01:38:19 pm »
Set it to 10x, grab a mini flat blade screwdriver and pop off the orange switch cap. It's just pressed in. You can always put it back in if you want or just use a screwdriver to switch it. That's one of the first things I did.
 

Offline ebastler

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Re: Rigol DS1054Z Freeze-up Bug Confirmed ??
« Reply #374 on: November 13, 2015, 01:43:02 pm »
The only thing which annoys me is the probe's 1x/10x switch. It likes to switch to 1x each time I look at it. Maybe I should put some tape over it.

This has been discussed in another Rigol-related thread (can't find it right now). There is a burr -- a "flash" from the injection molding process -- on either the yellow switch lever or the window in the probe's body. While this did affect my probes, I forgot which part it was... Anyway, this burr prevents the switch from fully reaching the end position. After popping out the yellow bit and removing the burr with a sharp blade, reliability of the switch has much improved for me.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2015, 01:44:46 pm by ebastler »
 


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