Author Topic: R&S Cryptic Acronyms  (Read 2467 times)

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Offline PixieDustTopic starter

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R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« on: November 11, 2022, 11:30:27 am »
I’m trying to figure out what the RTC, RTM, RTB acronyms stand for on their oscilloscope names.

And their FPC Spectrum Analyzer.

Any ideas?
« Last Edit: November 11, 2022, 11:44:39 am by PixieDust »
 

Offline Rich@RohdeScopesUSA

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2022, 01:49:10 pm »
RTO is real-time oscilloscope.  For the others, I don't believe there was a "true" name behind them.  Meaning they didn't necessarily get their lettering with a specific intent.  With that said, we sometimes call them (in the US at least):

RTC = Compact
RTB = Basic
RTM = Mid
RTA = Advanced
RTH = Handheld

-Rich
 
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Offline TimFox

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2022, 04:59:36 pm »
In careful usage, an "acronym" is a pronounceable word formed from an abbreviation:  e.g., "NASA", "laser", "mosfet".
The etymology of "acronym" is analogous to "synonym", where "onym" comes from the Ancient Greek ὄνυμα (ónuma) for "name".
Non-pronounceable abbreviations are just abbreviations:  e.g., "RTC", "RTB", "RTO", "DVM".
 

Offline pdenisowski

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2022, 07:21:58 pm »
The first letter generally denotes the type of instrument:

RTx - real time (scopes), but note new MXO series of scopes
Fxx - frequency (spec ans)
Sxx - signal generator
Zxx - network analyzer (Z -> complex impedance)
Exx - EMC receivers
Cxx - communications testers
Nxx - power supplies (but note, NRPxx is RF power sensors).  I'm told "N" stands for "Netzgerät"

Numbers sometimes (but not always) indicate maximum frequency (FSW85 - 85 GHz).

"Similar" classes and generations of instruments may have similar names, e.g. the older SMU and FSU versus the newer SMW and FSW.  Many handhelds end in "H" - FSH, FPH, ZNH, ZPH, RTH, etc.  But beyond that there's no universal naming scheme that I'm aware of. 
« Last Edit: November 11, 2022, 07:30:19 pm by pdenisowski »
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Offline pdenisowski

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2022, 07:29:36 pm »
And their FPC Spectrum Analyzer.

Note that there are two versions of the FPC, the FPC1000 and the FPC1500.  The difference is the FPC1500 has a tracking generator and therefore supports the network analysis option.  Both have the same maximum frequency of 3 GHz (not 1500 MHz / GHz ....:))
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Offline MJF

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2022, 08:05:43 pm »
Quote from: Rich@RohdeScopesUSA link=topic=351617.msg4516031#msg4516031 date :-+=1668174550
RTO is real-time oscilloscope.  For the others, I don't believe there was a "true" name behind them.  Meaning they didn't necessarily get their lettering with a specific intent.  With that said, we sometimes call them (in the US at least):

RTC = Compact
RTB = Basic
RTM = Mid
RTA = Advanced
RTH = Handheld

-Rich

 :-+ Markus F.

 

Offline PixieDustTopic starter

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2022, 03:32:59 am »
RTO is real-time oscilloscope.  For the others, I don't believe there was a "true" name behind them.  Meaning they didn't necessarily get their lettering with a specific intent.  With that said, we sometimes call them (in the US at least):

RTC = Compact
RTB = Basic
RTM = Mid
RTA = Advanced
RTH = Handheld

-Rich

Thanks Richard  :-+ I'm guessing going off that that FPC is Frequency Processor Compact? (referring to the spectrum analyser).

In careful usage, an "acronym" is a pronounceable word formed from an abbreviation:  e.g., "NASA", "laser", "mosfet".
The etymology of "acronym" is analogous to "synonym", where "onym" comes from the Ancient Greek ὄνυμα (ónuma) for "name".
Non-pronounceable abbreviations are just abbreviations:  e.g., "RTC", "RTB", "RTO", "DVM".

Didn't know that, I am now more educated.

Note that there are two versions of the FPC, the FPC1000 and the FPC1500.  The difference is the FPC1500 has a tracking generator and therefore supports the network analysis option.  Both have the same maximum frequency of 3 GHz (not 1500 MHz / GHz ....:))

Yep, I figured that out :-+
« Last Edit: November 12, 2022, 03:40:31 am by PixieDust »
 

Offline zitoune

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2022, 03:57:29 am »
Thanks Rich ! I also always wondered :)
 

Offline tv84

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2022, 10:10:56 am »
Now that those are done we can start wondering what means "MXO"?
 

Offline pcprogrammer

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2022, 10:15:22 am »
I guess the M stands for "mixed", and the O for "oscilloscope", but the X that is the stranger in town :-DD

Offline Kean

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2022, 12:51:32 pm »
And of course there are the ex-Hameg products

HMO = Oscilloscopes (7xx, 1xxx, 2xxx, 3xxx)
HMP = PSU (2020, 2030, 4030,4040)
HMC = Compact... PSU (804x), DMM (8012), Power Analyser (8015)
 

Offline rf-messkopf

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2022, 09:12:30 pm »
The first letter generally denotes the type of instrument:

RTx - real time (scopes), but note new MXO series of scopes
Fxx - frequency (spec ans)
Sxx - signal generator
Zxx - network analyzer (Z -> complex impedance)
Exx - EMC receivers
Cxx - communications testers
Nxx - power supplies (but note, NRPxx is RF power sensors).  I'm told "N" stands for "Netzgerät"

Numbers sometimes (but not always) indicate maximum frequency (FSW85 - 85 GHz).

"Similar" classes and generations of instruments may have similar names, e.g. the older SMU and FSU versus the newer SMW and FSW.  Many handhelds end in "H" - FSH, FPH, ZNH, ZPH, RTH, etc.  But beyond that there's no universal naming scheme that I'm aware of.

The classic R&S instruments had a quite stringent naming scheme, often with an obvious German origin. Today this has become somewhat blurry. But still, all receivers (not just EMC receivers) start with an E, for "Empfänger". For example EB200, ESMD, EK07, EK070, etc.

Signal generating instruments start start with an S, and lab RF signal generators still are SMx, for "Mess-Sender", others had a different second letter (e.g. the SNF video level generator, or the SPD pulse generator, SUB audio generator, etc.).

The classic R&S power supplies were all NGxx, for "Netzgerät", whereas power and SWR meters were Nxx or Uxx, when considered a voltage indicating instrument. This went as far as that the URV5 was also available as NRV, the only difference being that the NRV would start up in power indicating mode, where the URV5 would start up indicating voltages. Audio analyzers are UPx. This was of course spoiled by the addition of the former Hameg products (power supplies HMPxxx).

Frequency domain instruments (in a broad sense) are Fxx, e.g. spectrum analyzers, modulation meters (FAM, FMAB, FAB, etc.), but also counters (FEI, FET, etc.).

The classic attenuators were Dxxx, for "Dämpfungsglied".

Frequency sweepers were SWxx, the most well known are the classic SWOB series: SWOB, SWOB1, SWOB3, SWOB5.

Communication radios are Xnnn, but some old frequency standards also had designations starting with X. I don't know about broadcast transmitters and antennas, but they sometimes also have talking designations.

Instruments that were manufactured to the specifications of the German armed forces sometimes had an Y in the designation, for example URY, which is an URV5, or the radio tester CMS42y, which is a version of the CMS54. This is probably due to the fact that the license plates of vehicles of the German Federal Armed Forces begin with a Y.

Sometimes there was a little humor in the designations, for example the noise generator SUF and SUF2 ("Rauschgenerator SUF"). Difficult to get that across in English.  :)

See here for an incomplete list of old R&S gear and datasheets.

Edit: The classic R&S scopes are Oxxx, e.g. OBF, OKF, OMF, or special purpose gear like ODFA.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2022, 09:18:23 pm by rf-messkopf »
 
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Offline pdenisowski

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #12 on: November 13, 2022, 02:54:57 am »
@rf-messkopf 
First, thank you very much for that explanation!  Quite a bit of history there!

But still, all receivers (not just EMC receivers) start with an E, for "Empfänger". For example EB200, ESMD ....

Except of course for the portable receivers like the PR100 (instead of the TE100) :)

I guess products like the ETL (broadcast) and EVSx/EDS (avionics) analyzers could still be considered "receivers" in the larger sense of the word.

Any idea why antennas start with H?  That's always been a mystery to me.  (Hochfrequenz?  Hörer?  :))

« Last Edit: November 13, 2022, 03:13:04 am by pdenisowski »
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Offline pdenisowski

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2022, 03:02:15 am »
Sometimes there was a little humor in the designations, for example the noise generator SUF and SUF2 ("Rauschgenerator SUF"). Difficult to get that across in English.  :)

I'm assuming that's a play on "Rausch" (noise, but also intoxication / drunkenness) and "Suff" ("boozing / alcoholism", related to "saufen")  :-DD 
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Online egonotto

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2022, 04:40:51 am »
Hello,

NF-Geräuschspannungsmesser Psophometer UPGS 248.0019.02
Rohde & Schwarz, PTE; München.

For people from Munich, Psophometer sounds like a measuring device that measures a person's state of intoxication (noise floor).
Because if you drink a lot of alcohol you have a "Rausch" (= intoxication and "rauschen" == noise) and are "bsoffen" (=drunken).

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egonotto
 
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Offline RBBVNL9

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #15 on: November 14, 2022, 07:46:22 pm »
Thanks, rf-messkopf, for the very interesting explanations!

Would you, by any chance, know what the "W" as the first letter stands for in R&S devices? This letter seems to be used for frequency meters of various types. These include two of my favorite oldies in my lab (WAL and WAM), but there were also other models (WAC, WAT, WEN, WFC, WID, WIK, and WIP).

I myself had guessed wellenmesser (if that is a proper word in German)...

 

Online egonotto

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #16 on: November 14, 2022, 09:35:36 pm »
Hello,

Probably you are right.

http://www.museum-nt.de/objekte/rs_wip.html:
"Die Darstellungen der Rohde & Schwarz Firmengeschichte  nennen den „Allwellen-Frequenzmesser Type WIP“ eine der ersten Entwicklungen des Unternehmens zu Beginn der  1930er Jahre. Gerät und Messprinzip findet sich bereits in einem Aufsatz von Lothar Rohde und Herrmann Schwarz "Interferenzwellenmesser mit großem Wellenbereich für das Laboratorium" in der Zeitschrift "Hochfrequenztechnik und Elektrodynamik" aus dem Jahr 1932 (Band 40, Seite 117 -120) beschrieben, also noch vor Gründung des Unternehmenes im Jahr 1933."

And in https://www.radiomuseum-bocket.de/wiki/index.php/Rohde_u_Schwarz:
"1935: Die erste Auslandsvertretung
Bereits 1935 übernahm die Firma REMA Leo Haag S.A. in Spanien den Vertrieb von Geräten des „Physikalisch-technischen Entwicklungslabors Dr. L. Rohde und Dr. H. Schwarz“ (PTE). Das erste Projekt war der Verkauf des Interferenzwellenmessgeräts WIP an die Dirección General de Correos y Telecomunicaciones (Generaldirektion für Post und Telekommunikation). Damit ist die REMA als älteste Auslandsvertretung zu sehen."

Best regards
egonotto
« Last Edit: November 14, 2022, 09:40:43 pm by egonotto »
 
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Offline TimFox

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #17 on: November 14, 2022, 10:03:27 pm »
The cognate in technical English, "wavemeter" or "absorption wavemeter", is an obsolescent test device comprising a solenoid in parallel with a variable capacitor, where the capacitor dial is calibrated in the resonant frequency.
One places the coil in the vicinity of the machine being tested, then adjusts the capacitor to get a reaction from the machine.
See  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absorption_wavemeter
 
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Offline pdenisowski

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #18 on: November 15, 2022, 03:32:32 pm »
I myself had guessed wellenmesser (if that is a proper word in German)...

I think either "Wellenmesser" or "Wellenmessgerät" are both fine, although be aware that a "Wellenmesser" is also a special kind of knife used to cut wavy (get it?) patterns in vegetables. :)
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Offline Bud

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #19 on: November 15, 2022, 05:28:13 pm »
For people from Munich, Psophometer sounds like a measuring device that measures a person's state of intoxication (noise floor).
Because if you drink a lot of alcohol you have a "Rausch" (= intoxication and "rauschen" == noise) and are "bsoffen" (=drunken).
So it looks like when you are drunk, your Rausch intoxication noise is High, so when you are Not drunk, your Rausch is Low, meaning we are always in some state of intoxication  ;D
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Offline RBBVNL9

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Re: R&S Cryptic Acronyms
« Reply #20 on: November 16, 2022, 07:22:47 am »
Quote
The cognate in technical English, "wavemeter" or "absorption wavemeter", is an obsolescent test device comprising a solenoid in parallel with a variable capacitor, where the capacitor dial is calibrated in the resonant frequency.

This comes actually pretty close. The WAM and WAL use different principles (an LC circuit and a Tuneable λ/4 line tuned cavity, respectively). And both methods are obsolete, I'd say ;-)

I made a video reviewing them both and repairing one of them: https://youtu.be/EuDcRPdHJE0
 
 
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