EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
Products => Test Equipment => Topic started by: nowlan on May 29, 2014, 03:03:10 pm
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This looks like a new HMC model. Other was the HMC8012 (http://value.rohde-schwarz.com/vi/value/meters-counters/hmc8012-digital-multimeter.html) Digital Multimeter
Link (http://value.rohde-schwarz.com/vi/value/power-supplies/r-s-hm-c8041-8042-8043-power-supply.html)
New Compact Power Supply
• Realtime voltage, current and power values
• High setting and readback resolution
• Low residual ripple due to linear postregulation
• High energy efficiency, low heat dissipation and quiet fans
• Convenient parallel and serial operation via V/I tracking
• Overvoltage and overpower protection (OVP, OPP) for all outputs
• FuseLink: individual channel combination of electronic fuses
• EasyArb function for user-definable V/I curves
• EasyRamp for simulating a start-up curve
• Sequencing (sequenced start of channels)
• Energy meter (measurement of energy output)
• Data logging to USB flash drive in CSV format
broschure dated 14 May 2014.
(http://value.rohde-schwarz.com/media/wysiwyg/VI-Microsite/HMC8043_front.jpg)
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Just what I'm looking for. Well, if the price is "compact series" :)
Looks like a lower powered HMP2020/HMP2030, with all the features but without sensing.
Any idea of the price ?
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Ooooooo, I like that. :-+
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Eyewatering.
http://webstore.rohde-schwarz.com/us/hmc8041.html (http://webstore.rohde-schwarz.com/us/hmc8041.html)
$1,337.00 us
They dont make it easy to find.
edit: 1337 on au site too. very odd.
having said that, the hmp2020 is like $1,442 (2 channels).
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Might have been a release Ooops, product link is now dead.
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Cached datasheet highlights:
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Here you go.
http://value.rohde-schwarz.com/media/wysiwyg/VI-Microsite/Datasheet/Brochures/Brochure_HMCSeries_V00_01_EN.pdf (http://value.rohde-schwarz.com/media/wysiwyg/VI-Microsite/Datasheet/Brochures/Brochure_HMCSeries_V00_01_EN.pdf)
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Eyewatering.
http://webstore.rohde-schwarz.com/us/hmc8041.html (http://webstore.rohde-schwarz.com/us/hmc8041.html)
$1,337.00 us
At $1337, that's no more so eyewatering :)
HMP2030 = around 1400 euros
HMP2020 = around 1200 euros
Would be great if the two outputs version HMC8042 is around 800 euros or much less :)
Otherwise just get the HMPs.
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Just checked the de site, and comes up 1337 euro. Wondering is some cute (leet speak) place holder value.
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Damn, I failed to notice the l33t indeed :)
I guess they'll make an announcement on Hameg's blog, let's wait.
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Interesting. I won't be paying l33t though.
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Just checked the de site, and comes up 1337 euro. Wondering is some cute (leet speak) place holder value.
The SKU is also a bit special. 123456666
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for 1337 Euro you can build decent lab for a hobbyist :D
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Just got a quote back from R&S, 3-channel version, $1297USD, Ouch, :palm:
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They do say on their web site that one of their promises is "Unexpected Price" ...
Anthony
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As a hobbyist I would buy a 300+ Watts power supply even without a color LCD.
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As a hobbyist I would buy a 300+ Watts power supply even without a color LCD.
What!!?? A power supply without a color display? But how could you possibly use it?
Seriously, I like that supply.
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Well, buy it if you need that advanced analysis features.
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new datasheet on their blog i see.
http://blog.hameg.com/?p=1912 (http://blog.hameg.com/?p=1912)
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Now the question is : What is the pricing ?
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Product seems to be already available on german R&S webshop :
http://webstore.rohde-schwarz.com/de/hameg/netzgerate/netzgerate.html (http://webstore.rohde-schwarz.com/de/hameg/netzgerate/netzgerate.html)
Pricing is not very good HMC8042 = 898 euros whereas HMP2020 = 1028 euros.
That's a bit better for HMC8043 = 948 euros whereas HMP2030 = 1238 euros.
It's been a long time I wanted to buy a quality programmable PSU.
I haven't checked the HMC's manual yet, but except for power, they have same capabilities as the HMP.
But HMP have a bit more power and they are not that much more expensive.
So I think I'm gonna get an HMP.
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I thought I'd bring this back to life and see if anyone has picked up one of these. I like the looks and specs. US is ~$1300. It's a little low on the power, the new Keysight U8031A is 375W at around $1400 US but it doesn't have the resolution:
https://d3fdwrtpsinh7j.cloudfront.net/Docs/document/5990-9083EN.pdf
But Keysight makes really good supplies along with meters that I've been using for years. I see they still sell the 6632B which I've had on the bench for quite some time now. Really tight resolution and one of the best supplies I've ever owned.
Thing is I want to consolidate all the supplies on my bench to just one or two and the R&S looks good on paper anyway. Sure I could buy the DP832 with the higher resolution but I have these snigling little quirks about overshoot and life expectancy (MBTF) and the DP832 won't make my bench room much smaller, in fact it's about 17 or 18" deep.
Rob
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I thought I'd bring this back to life and see if anyone has picked up one of these.
I ordered one a couple weeks ago, shows shipping ~ Dec 30th.
More to come when it gets here.
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I thought I'd bring this back to life and see if anyone has picked up one of these.
I ordered one a couple weeks ago, shows shipping ~ Dec 30th.
More to come when it gets here.
Great! Can't wait to hear about it!
Rob
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I thought I'd bring this back to life and see if anyone has picked up one of these. I like the looks and specs. US is ~$1300. It's a little low on the power, the new Keysight U8031A is 375W at around $1400 US but it doesn't have the resolution:
If I'm not wrong, the Keysight isn't programmable, and it is an older design.
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I think it has front panel automation but I'm not sure if it has LXI or USB programability through a PC. It may be linear also, although switching supplies done right don't trouble me the way they did 10 years ago.
It's pretty rare that I need the programming option but it is nice to have. I like the size of the R&S along with the resolution so I'm leaning toward it. Elektor did a review and found overshoot on power down but I thought it was basically a silly test. They shut off the mains to simulate a power failure. Well, gee it had a 1.1 volt overshoot! The "soft" off button didn't show any overshoot.
I guess if you leave it in a remote location powered up for months mains failures might be a problem but I still think it's a stretch.
Rob
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WooHoo
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OK, that's it! I'm getting one!
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Peak inside.
Power supply caps are Nippon Chemi-Con, main board caps are Matsushita/Panasonic. :-+
Build quality is top notch.
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And one last pict with the PS removed:
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Ok, one more, PS is an off the shelf unit:
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OK, could be built to Hameg's specs. but could be a game changer depending on how well the unit functions and build quality.
Rob
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I guess the 48V switch mode supply is so they can replace a bulky and heavy 200VA transformer.
In the end, the supply outputs are linearly regulated, so I don't think that's much of problem.
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OK, could be built to Hameg's specs. but could be a game changer depending on how well the unit functions and build quality.
Yeah, this doesn't bother me at all, standard practice with just about any manufacture these days, and it's well built.
I guess the 48V switch mode supply is so they can replace a bulky and heavy 200VA transformer.
In the end, the supply outputs are linearly regulated, so I don't think that's much of problem.
It appears to be 48V SMPS > Variable SMPS > Linear Reg > Output.
I pretty much took it apart yesterday and had to leave, more paying today. If this performs well I will replace my other random supplies with more of these.
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If this performs well I will replace my other random supplies with more of these.
That's my problem too, I just counted 7 supplies here. I'll leave the old 24V, 20A brute force HP, the HV supply and the HP 6632B super accurate supply but I really need bench space.
Rob
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Not much of a test, but I am seeing about 1mVpp ripple on the 8043, vs about 20uVpp on my trusty E3610A, as read by a DMM7510. (Instrument spec is 450uVrms/4mVpp)
I don't expect perfection with an upstream SMPS, but FYI for potential buyers.
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Not much of a test, but I am seeing about 1mVpp ripple on the 8043, vs about 20uVpp on my trusty E3610A, as read by a DMM7510. (Instrument spec is 450uVrms/4mVpp)
I don't expect perfection with an upstream SMPS, but FYI for potential buyers.
I have a 3610A too. I think it has a bad cap, the current set does go to zero until it warms up, maybe noise somewhere in the settting circuit.
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I just compared specs with the Keysight U8031A and the R&S are just as good or better. First, it's a real triple supply not like the Siglent(which I wouldn't buy regardless) or the Keysight.
I'm still thinking it might work for me. How noisy is the fan? Loud fans kill me, I sold a 34410A because I hated the fan noise. Fortunately they fixed it on the 34465A.
Rob
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Loud fans kill me, I sold a 34410A because I hated the fan noise.
The fan is thermo controlled, you can briefly hear it spin up on boot, then it shuts off. So far I've only seen it cycle on low, I didn't even hear it, just noticed it spinning cause the cover was off.
I'll try and load up all 3 channels, see what happens.
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So it's been sitting on 65 watts total for about 20 min now, fan is running constantly on what I'd guess is low, which is not audible.
I was also navigating the setup menu and somehow managed to reboot it, came back up defaulted. I've not been able to repeat since.
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After having put my new R&S HMC 8043 lab psu through its paces
over the last few days, here now some remarks:
To start with, I am absolutely satisfied with the unit.
Even so, there is some room for improvement.
1. The manual is not particularly clear as to invoking of
the overvoltage protection adjustment menu. Specifically
the ADV (Advanced) button is not mentioned in this context.
2.) The virtual COM port settings 7,N,N,1 and the default
LAN port (I think the default was 5026 which I changed to 5025)
are not mentioned in the manual. I found out the virtual COM port
settings by running the HM Explorer and detecting HMC 8043 though
a virtual COM port.
3.) Since the 3 outputs can be connected in series, I would have
been pleased to find 2 bridging plugs with a tap socket in the box.
4.) Instead of only displaying “OVP” when it is on, I would be
nicer, if the actual OVP voltage setting would be displayed.
5.) When wanting to remotely control the unit using a potentiometer
(analogue control) you will need an external 10 V source. A built-in
fixed 10 V output (on the rear) would simplify such an arrangement.
Also did a bit of programming with “Profilab”. You can find a current
logging example here:
http://forum.abacom-online.de/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=96&t=4482 (http://forum.abacom-online.de/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=96&t=4482)
Agreed, the unit is expensive, but it is well designed and operation is very
user friendly. It comes with a calibration certificate. And it fits – frog style –
without the risk of slipping on top of my 33465A. See pic.
Yours Messtechniker
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Has anyone with one of these power supplies observed that the supply outputs are temporarily enabled when you turn off the power supply from the front panel?
From my observations on channel 1 of my HMC8042 I see that when I turn it off ~2/3 of the set voltage appears on the output, the waveform looks like its the output capacitors discharging.
This is concerning behavior as if you change what is connected to the power supply and then turn off the supply without changing the set voltage it could fry something. I wonder (hope) this can be fixed in software. The front power button is in software, so it should be something as simple as sequencing the internal supplies to 0V before actually shutting off.
Attached are waveforms of the unloaded, and loaded with a 22 ohm resistor, when the supply is set for 5V and 32V.
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My HMC 8043 with "MASTER OFF" and upon powering down with "POWER" it produces a peak:
No load:
Voltage setting/Power down peak
+32 V /8V
+15 V /+3.5 V
+9 V/+1.6 V
+3 V/+0,1 V
And with a 22 Ohm load:
+32 V /+0.4V
+15 V /+38 mV
+9 V/+48 mV
+3 V/-7 mV
Measured using the trend display function of my 34465A.
Basically nothing to grumble about.
The scope shows more:
[attachimg=2]
[attachimg=3]
PS. Not many users here have a HMC 803X power supply. So you will not get much of a response.
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I am a bit confused by your listed values of the power down peak given the scope screenshots you posted. The picture you posted that is titled "32V 22 Ohm.jpg" shows a 13.7V peak based on the cursors, which is pretty much in line with the measurements I have taken.
If I connect some 5V or 3V3 logic circuit to the output, set the max voltage of 32V, and shut down the power supply without ever enabling the output, I would not be surprised if the output spike damages what is connected.
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Of course you are right. This 13 V spike might certainly damage 3.3 V or 5 V powered circuits. If you can confirm this by damaging a 3.3 V powered test circuit you should inform R&S. I have a good contact there.
Since I don't usually use 3.3 V powered circuits, I have none at hand at the moment. However, my next order, probably by the end of November, will include some.
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The scope shows higher values because it samples faster.
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:)