Siglent SDS1000X HD 12bit 2GSa/s Oscilloscope Unboxing & Test

[hpw]

In addition as for noise measurements as required to "scale for noise" as 1/rtHz normalization and
Y Axis as may dB related (dB / rtHz) or linear related (V / rtHz ... nV / rtHz as Log Y Scaled).

Otherwise we compare spectrum's, with reduced FFT bins, caused by the larger FFT size 

May easier to export the sampled data & all required averaged sample data to process them on the PC.

Or does one SDS1000x HD, SDS2000x HD or SDS7000A HD support such rtHz measurements /scalings?

[maxspb69]

The SDS2000X Plus (which I have) and the SDS2000X HD (which I saw on the video) have a rather slow response to the rotation of the encoders. I would not call their interface pleasant to use. You can rotate the encoder quickly, but most of the "steps" will simply be skipped by the device.
How does the 1000X HD deal with this? If the owner doesn’t mind, it would be very interesting to look at a video where the oscilloscope screen and a hand, rotating the horizontal and vertical movement knobs, trigger level knob, etc. would be visible. So that we can evaluate the responsiveness of the device to external controls.

[Martin72]

SDS2000X HD (which I saw on the video)

In "real life" I didn't notice any major delays when turning the encoder.
But I'm also not someone who turns like crazy and expects a 1:1 conversion.
The encoders on the HD are "better" in terms of mechanics/feel.
It's quite possible that the same ones are also used in the 1000X HD - why stop at the housing...

[tautech]

The SDS2000X Plus (which I have) and the SDS2000X HD (which I saw on the video) have a rather slow response to the rotation of the encoders. I would not call their interface pleasant to use. You can rotate the encoder quickly, but most of the "steps" will simply be skipped by the device.
How does the 1000X HD deal with this? If the owner doesn’t mind, it would be very interesting to look at a video where the oscilloscope screen and a hand, rotating the horizontal and vertical movement knobs, trigger level knob, etc. would be visible. So that we can evaluate the responsiveness of the device to external controls.

SDS1204X HD prototype. (white model)

All encoders are detented types and of a softer/smoother type than SDS2000X Plus.
Responsiveness can be described in just one word, sharp.

[maxspb69]

But I'm also not someone who turns like crazy and expects a 1:1 conversion.

No one expects a digital oscilloscope to respond instantly as analog one. But the latest Rigol models have a much more responsive interface than Siglent. I won’t even talk about Keysight scopes, which are close to analog in response.

[tautech]

But I'm also not someone who turns like crazy and expects a 1:1 conversion.

No one expects a digital oscilloscope to respond instantly as analog one. But the latest Rigol models have a much more responsive interface than Siglent. I won’t even talk about Keysight scopes, which are close to analog in response.

Have you ever wondered how they do that ?
Hint, piss ant memory depth to process.

[maxspb69]

Question for Tautech:

It is now possible to order a new (black, 2GS/s) version of the SDS1204X HD from China . Should I do this now or maybe wait for the official release in Europe?

[skander36]

But I'm also not someone who turns like crazy and expects a 1:1 conversion.

No one expects a digital oscilloscope to respond instantly as analog one. But the latest Rigol models have a much more responsive interface than Siglent. I won’t even talk about Keysight scopes, which are close to analog in response.

Actually, the response of SDS1000X is very slightly better than DHO 1000X. The difference is tiny but it can be feel.

[maxspb69]

I would take the SDS2000X HD to replace the SDS2000X Plus, but the lack of hacking capabilities and the lack of the possibility of even officially purchasing "options keys" in the country, where I am today  are stopping me from such a replacement.
Therefore, I am looking at the SDS1000X HD as a 12-bit addition to the existing one.

[tautech]

Question for Tautech:

It is now possible to order a new (black, 2GS/s) version of the SDS1204X HD from China . Should I do this now or maybe wait for the official release in Europe?

Checks western release date.....is another week too long to wait ?

[maxspb69]

No, 1-2-3 weeks is the normal waiting period. I was not aware of the release date. Thanks for the info.

[KungFuJosh]

lack of hacking capabilities

Lack of what now? Not knowing how doesn't mean the answer isn't available.

[KungFuJosh]

I can totally understand that Siglent wants to keep the lid on the license scheme for the more expensive products, and that those in the know respect that. But the resulting approach of "You first have to show your commitment by buying an SDS2000X HD, and then maybe someone will let you in on the secret" is not for everybody.

The scope is a bargain without hacking it, and prices are supposed to get even better... so people complaining isn't particularly impressive. 🤷

[KungFuJosh]

I am not complaining -- just commenting on your mixed-message response to maxspb69 above.

There was nothing mixed about it. Ignorance doesn't prove or disprove the existence of something. The point was to hint at the fact that a solution does exist.

[Martin72]

You shouldn't make a purchase decision based on whether you can "crack" the device, because then you don't really need it.

[KungFuJosh]

Sorry, but the arguments from the Siglent crew are hypocritical.

You seem to be having your own separate conversation or something. You buy a scope based on whether or not it meets your needs and budget. And if you need to hack it to make it meet those needs, then it's up to you to figure out how. Nobody owes you anything.

None of us work for Siglent, we simply like their products.

[maxspb69]

Has anyone ever talked about the fact that someone owes someone something?

I know that HD hack exists, but it is not public, therefore for me personally it does not exist. And awareness has nothing to do with it.
I bought options keys for my RTB2000, but at the moment I don’t have the opportunity to buy them for Siglent and the problem is not at all a lack of funds. Therefore, when deciding to purchase an oscilloscope, I must understand exactly what I will get in the end. Having purchased the SDS2000X HD, I will not be able to get the capabilities that I need. Therefore, most likely I will not buy it. Unfortunately.

[skander36]

Sorry, but the arguments from the Siglent crew are hypocritical.

... You buy a scope based on whether or not it meets your needs and budget. And if you need to hack it to make it meet those needs, then it's up to you to figure out how. ...

This is your personal opinion. For example I have 4 scopes at 70 MHz , all hacked. I wouldn't buy anyone if were not hackable.
Is not not about someone oweing something to someone but about the scope of this forum - helping/sharing.
Please look at the questions in the threads dedicated to each scope model: "Is still hackable?" sound many of them.
Ethical problem has been discussed many time here but the conlusion was that as long as you don't sell the hack or hacked scope is ok for hoby use.

[KungFuJosh]

This is your personal opinion.

Nah, it's everybody's opinion, including yours. The difference is, hackability is one of your needs, and thus a requirement. 😉

[KungFuJosh]

Has anyone ever talked about the fact that someone owes someone something?

I know that HD hack exists, but it is not public, therefore for me personally it does not exist. And awareness has nothing to do with it.
I bought options keys for my RTB2000, but at the moment I don’t have the opportunity to buy them for Siglent and the problem is not at all a lack of funds. Therefore, when deciding to purchase an oscilloscope, I must understand exactly what I will get in the end. Having purchased the SDS2000X HD, I will not be able to get the capabilities that I need. Therefore, most likely I will not buy it. Unfortunately.

So what are you telling me? You're don't feel like doing your own due diligence before purchasing an excellent product, so you'd rather do nothing? Are you assuming you couldn't return the product if you weren't able to "improve" it as you want to?

Your logic doesn't make any sense to me. You know the "improvement" exists, but you won't put any effort into making it happen? 

[skander36]

Pictures from the inside of SDS1000X-HD.
The ADC's are the same as in SDS2000X-HD which is capable of 2 GSas/s single channel and 1 GSas/s dual channel.
The structure inside is the same as in SDS2000X-HD except the mainboard.

[skander36]

Yes I know I am not a good photographer
You can say it ...

[skander36]

Many thanks for the pictures, and bonus points for removing the heat spreaders and thermal paste to show the key ICs! 

What is the little coax connector in the first picture in post #109 for? Test point, future option, or was it connected to something?

It is present also in 2000X-HD, it links to the backside connector board.  This board is also connected with a FPC cable so I don't know for sure what is his role. Maybe for
external trigger ?
I didn't take the pics from that board so I will use Dave's teardown of SDS2000X-HD which I said that its contruction is identical with the exception of mainboard.

[Martin72]

The ADC's are the same as in SDS2000X-HD which is capable of 2 GSas/s single channel and 1 GSas/s dual channel.

I had already guessed that they were the same - so they're not bad converters...
We already know from the Rigol DHOs that the sample rate can be different with an identical ADC configuration.
Didn't that have something to do with the FPGA?

[skander36]

Didn't that have something to do with the FPGA?

For sure! There is the place where the signals are processed.
The explanation for using the same ADC's maybe is in the price (8-900 E for 10 pieces). So they aquired large quantities to obtain a good price and planned from the beginning to use it also in the future versions.
Also the reason for not being configured in dual 2 GSas/s as in 2000X-HD is probably to not affect sales of this.