Author Topic: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?  (Read 54860 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #250 on: September 02, 2018, 11:40:24 am »
Yeah you get that if you're in too much of a hurry capturing screenshots. A USB stick with an LED can let you know when the Save has finished.

BTW, the channel tab for the screenshot of the 100x probe earlier shows input attenuation set to 1x as you hadn't set that up before saving however it won't make any difference to the displayed overshoot.

Haha, yeah, I hadn't found that setting yet. I did retry after finding it but, as you said, the results were the same.

I'm not worried about the screenshot thing; it's a good thing. On the Rigol it took 3 to 5 seconds to record the screenshot and you couldn't do anything while it was doing it. The Siglent is basically instant and you can still use the scope while it's doing it anyway.
"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #251 on: September 02, 2018, 11:41:49 am »
The Rigol does the exact same thing.  :-//

(push the horizontal timebase knob and you get zoom mode)

Cool! I dunno why I never pressed that button on the Rigol. lol
"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 

Online Fungus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11389
  • Country: 00
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #252 on: September 02, 2018, 11:44:13 am »
I didn't even realize it captured anything yet, so I hit the button again and captured two images. Oops.
Yeah you get that if you're in too much of a hurry capturing screenshots. A USB stick with an LED can let you know when the Save has finished.

Or ... a good user interface would show a popup confirmation message on screen.
 

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #253 on: September 02, 2018, 11:45:53 am »
Or ... a good user interface would show a popup confirmation message on screen.

It does, but it's fast and I looked away. Speed is good.
"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 

Online Fungus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11389
  • Country: 00
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #254 on: September 02, 2018, 11:46:20 am »
The Rigol does the exact same thing.  :-//

(push the horizontal timebase knob and you get zoom mode)

Cool! I dunno why I never pressed that button on the Rigol. lol

OK, I think I can see where this is heading.

You were too repulsed by the Rigol's ugly case to actually learn how to use it.

« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 11:50:42 am by Fungus »
 

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #255 on: September 02, 2018, 11:53:15 am »
OK, I think I can see where this is heading.

You were too repulsed by the Rigols ugly case to actually learn how to use it.

Psshhh. You're going to turn ad hominem because I missed one button? I've been very fair regarding the pros and cons of both units. You're far too defensive of a product you didn't design. The Rigol is an inferior product. Get over it. It still has its place.


...in the dumpster.
"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 
The following users thanked this post: egonotto

Offline StillTrying

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2596
  • Country: dk
  • Country: Broken Britain
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #256 on: September 02, 2018, 11:55:44 am »
Have you tried viewing the X100 trace at the same time as a X10 trace on the same 1kHz signal.

I can imagine(guess!) that the scopes 1kHz is expectiing to be driving a 15-20pF scope probe, rather than just the 5pF of the X100. And of course 3V pp is very low signal for a X100 probe, keeping square waves perfect over a very large dynamic range is very difficult.
CML+  That took much longer than I thought it would.
 
The following users thanked this post: KungFuJosh

Online Fungus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11389
  • Country: 00
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #257 on: September 02, 2018, 11:56:17 am »
Hey! The Rigol has an overshoot measurement, pretty handy while calibrating probes! I got it under 1%, don't remember the exact number, but that suggests about 1 LSB, which seems good enough for me.

Oh, dear. It looks like the Siglent is missing that one!

Edit: My bad, it's there, Siglent calls it "FOV" instead of "Overshoot"



FWIW: I just counted the number of measurements on the Rigol. It has 37 compared to the Siglent's 28.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 02:13:23 pm by Fungus »
 

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #258 on: September 02, 2018, 12:04:25 pm »
FWIW: I just counted the number of measurements on the Rigol. It has 37 compared to the Siglent's 28.

Well they do both have their pros and cons. ;) Point for the Rigol if you need more measurements. Does the Rigol do standard deviation also?
"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 

Offline JPortici

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2688
  • Country: it
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #259 on: September 02, 2018, 12:12:10 pm »
Translation for simple people like me:

Hi Res: Scope lowers bandwidth and averages some crap to pretend to be better quality.

Average: Scope removes data and averages some other crap to pretend to be better quality.
Despite how you translate it at some time each of these tools will be found to be indispensable !  ;)

Maybe, but you gotta admit it's a pretty good translation. :-DD

Hi, i use hi-res also as a digital filter :)
This is when i don't want to be bothered to do "good" probing because i want to probe several signals at a time and i don't have four hands, so i can get rid of high frequency noise.
high frequency noise can come from MCU programmer during debug, laptop power supply or some bastard here with an FM repeater that is messing up all my measurements, just to make an example.

First i make sure that with good probing the signal is indeed as it should be, then i resort to lazy probing and enable high-res.

PS: a friendly advice, fungus has been in my ignore list for a long time
 
The following users thanked this post: rf-loop, KungFuJosh

Online Fungus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11389
  • Country: 00
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #260 on: September 02, 2018, 12:13:42 pm »
Does the Rigol do standard deviation also?

Doesn't look like it, it shows max/min instead.



(Stats mode shows the box at the bottom of the screen)
« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 12:16:01 pm by Fungus »
 

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #261 on: September 02, 2018, 12:17:46 pm »
Does the Rigol do standard deviation also?

Doesn't look like it, it shows max/min instead.

(Stats mode shows the box at the bottom of the screen)

That's all good. I'm sure both companies can add more math functions if they want to. ;)
"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #262 on: September 02, 2018, 12:20:51 pm »
Hi, i use hi-res also as a digital filter :)
This is when i don't want to be bothered to do "good" probing because i want to probe several signals at a time and i don't have four hands, so i can get rid of high frequency noise.
high frequency noise can come from MCU programmer during debug, laptop power supply or some bastard here with an FM repeater that is messing up all my measurements, just to make an example.

First i make sure that with good probing the signal is indeed as it should be, then i resort to lazy probing and enable high-res.

PS: a friendly advice, fungus has been in my ignore list for a long time

Lazy probing, now you're speaking my language! :-DD
"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 

Online Fungus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11389
  • Country: 00
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #263 on: September 02, 2018, 12:23:06 pm »
Does the Rigol do standard deviation also?

Doesn't look like it, it shows max/min instead.

Oh, wait... it has it. You have to select the type of statistics.  :popcorn:


« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 12:28:03 pm by Fungus »
 

Online Fungus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11389
  • Country: 00
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #264 on: September 02, 2018, 12:51:21 pm »
I haven't really delved much into the statistics before. There's a lot in there, you can actually enable a rolling graphical display of measurements over time to go with the stats.



(they aren't changing much there because it's just the probe compensation signal but the yellow lines are advancing across the screen)
« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 12:58:21 pm by Fungus »
 

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #265 on: September 02, 2018, 01:04:38 pm »
That's all cute, but with the Siglent, there's more usable screen space, a useful 1M FFT, and you can view all of that with measurements and statistics on screen all at once...

"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #266 on: September 02, 2018, 01:14:31 pm »
...but holy crap does it annoy me every time I see "Curr" on screen instead of Mem for memory depth. Morons.
"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 

Offline rf-loop

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3344
  • Country: cn
  • Born with DLL21 in hand
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #267 on: September 02, 2018, 01:30:49 pm »
Hey! The Rigol has an overshoot measurement, pretty handy while calibrating probes! I got it under 1%, don't remember the exact number, but that suggests about 1 LSB, which seems good enough for me.

Oh, dear. It looks like the Siglent is missing that one!



FWIW: I just counted the number of measurements on the Rigol. It has 37 compared to the Siglent's 28.

You know that lies do not walk long... so why. Or is it just only fun.

Siglent 38.

And WHAT "one" is Siglent missing?  |O |O |O

FOV  Overshoot after a falling edge
ROV  Overshoot after a rising edge
RPRE Overshoot before a rising edge
FPRE Overshoot before a falling edge
If practice and theory is not equal it tells that used application of theory is wrong or the theory itself is wrong.
-
Harmony OS
 

Online Fungus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11389
  • Country: 00
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #268 on: September 02, 2018, 01:37:19 pm »
FFT+stats+measurements in a more sensible layout:



OK, it's only 16kpoints FFT. Siglent wins there.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 01:42:38 pm by Fungus »
 

Online Fungus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11389
  • Country: 00
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #269 on: September 02, 2018, 01:40:47 pm »
 

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #270 on: September 02, 2018, 01:42:26 pm »
FFT+stats+measurements in a more sensible layout:

That's a matter of opinion. I checked the thesaurus, ugly isn't anywhere under "sensible." The FFT on the Rigol still isn't 1M or very useful. Look how small that usable screen area is by comparison. You need a screen magnifier with the thing.
"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 

Online Fungus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11389
  • Country: 00
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #271 on: September 02, 2018, 01:50:55 pm »
FFT+stats+measurements in a more sensible layout:
That's a matter of opinion. I checked the thesaurus, ugly isn't anywhere under "sensible." The FFT on the Rigol still isn't 1M or very useful. Look how small that usable screen area is by comparison. You need a screen magnifier with the thing.

I didn't buy my Rigol for the FFT, I'm just comparing the two for fun ... :-//

FFTs need detail so all 8-bit ADCs are inadequate, IMHO. 1Mpts helps but it's only a band-aid compared to having more bits.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 01:54:04 pm by Fungus »
 

Offline rf-loop

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3344
  • Country: cn
  • Born with DLL21 in hand
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #272 on: September 02, 2018, 01:57:58 pm »

Siglent 38.

Try counting again...

No, I know but it is not my head ache if you can not read and count. Where is your blind spot.

Rigol do not have Stdev measurement. (I do not mean measurements statistics dev but signal data Stdev what is very useful feature. If know where and how to use it.

You can start lesson one here, page 14,  and count: Take your fingers for help. Oh but wait...how you count to 38 using fingers. Perhaps you can mark every 10 so that instead of 28 you finally get 38... exercise...exercise...
« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 02:01:28 pm by rf-loop »
If practice and theory is not equal it tells that used application of theory is wrong or the theory itself is wrong.
-
Harmony OS
 
The following users thanked this post: KungFuJosh

Online Fungus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 11389
  • Country: 00
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #273 on: September 02, 2018, 02:05:05 pm »
FOV  Overshoot after a falling edge
ROV  Overshoot after a rising edge
RPRE Overshoot before a rising edge
FPRE Overshoot before a falling edge

Sorry. My band for not looking "FOV" up in the Siglent dictionary. I guess I'm just used to "Overshoot" being labelled, um, "Overshoot".

(Is there a reason they call it that? There's obviously enough room in that menu to just write "Overshoot". Rigol managed to squeeze it onto a tiny button.)

« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 02:06:40 pm by Fungus »
 

Offline KungFuJosh

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 266
  • Country: us
Re: Siglent SDS1104X-E vs. Rigol DS1054Z Advice?
« Reply #274 on: September 02, 2018, 02:10:14 pm »
Rigol do not have Stdev measurement. (I do not mean measurements statistics dev but signal data Stdev what is very useful feature. If know where and how to use it.

You can start lesson one here, page 14,  and count: Take your fingers for help. Oh but wait...how you count to 38 using fingers. Perhaps you can mark every 10 so that instead of 28 you finally get 38... exercise...exercise...

Oh, snap! Looks like Siglent gets the math point too. 38 math functions for Siglent, and only 37 for Rigol. :box:
"I installed a skylight in my apartment yesterday... The people who live above me are furious." - Steven Wright
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf