Author Topic: Siglent SDS1104X-E and SDS1204X-E Mixed Signal Oscilloscopes  (Read 168015 times)

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Offline JPortici

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #200 on: November 21, 2017, 07:20:51 pm »
hi simone, i just saw the batterfly email. must say i'm very tempted
still no info on the AWG?

i wonder how it will compare to the DSOX-1102G (i mean in the real world, i can compare "datasheets")
especially the FRA part, if you can really change amplitude + offset it's a potential winner :)
« Last Edit: November 21, 2017, 07:29:16 pm by JPortici »
 

Offline simone.pignatti

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #201 on: November 21, 2017, 07:25:16 pm »
Price available online from the 27th, all new PDF material already online.
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Offline simone.pignatti

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #202 on: November 21, 2017, 07:29:16 pm »
hi simone, i just saw the batterfly email. must say i'm very tempted
still no info on the AWG?
pricing online from the 27th ;)
« Last Edit: November 21, 2017, 07:33:01 pm by simone.pignatti »
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Offline SaKhan

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #203 on: November 22, 2017, 09:31:28 am »
Hi guys,
Greetings from Switzerland. I've been following the forum for quite a while and I finally decided to register as I am after a 4 channel oscilloscope and I'm watching this thread very closely. Based on the rumoured prices the difference between the 100 and 200 Mhz models seems to be quite big. Can someone tell me if Siglent have any plans in allowing the upgrade of the bandwidth? It would be pity if all that decent hardware is permanently limited to 100 Mhz without any options for upgrade what so ever. Alex
 

Offline tautech

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #204 on: November 22, 2017, 10:27:21 am »
Hi guys,
Greetings from Switzerland. I've been following the forum for quite a while and I finally decided to register as I am after a 4 channel oscilloscope and I'm watching this thread very closely. Based on the rumoured prices the difference between the 100 and 200 Mhz models seems to be quite big. Can someone tell me if Siglent have any plans in allowing the upgrade of the bandwidth? It would be pity if all that decent hardware is permanently limited to 100 Mhz without any options for upgrade what so ever. Alex
Welcome to the forum.

There will be 2 models, SDS1104X-E (100 MHz) and a 200 MHz version, SDS1204X-E.
To date Siglent have not offered purchasable BW upgrades and for this class of DSO I suspect they won't.

But, this forum is famous for sharing info on hacks and a few of which have been applied to Siglent equipment.
Of course any factory Calibration certificate will not be valid when an instrument is hacked and that will matter to some owners.
However we know some will try, why, because they can.
Avid Rabid Hobbyist
 

Offline simone.pignatti

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #205 on: November 22, 2017, 10:38:41 am »
hi simone, i just saw the batterfly email. must say i'm very tempted
still no info on the AWG?

i wonder how it will compare to the DSOX-1102G (i mean in the real world, i can compare "datasheets")
especially the FRA part, if you can really change amplitude + offset it's a potential winner :)
About AWG, do you mean info about pricing or tech data?
Tech data are available on the data sheet and user manual. Public pricing on the 27th, very limited availability (maybe few pcs) till Xmas.
Not sure if I will be able to make a video with the AWG before Xmas, but Dave may do it.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 11:08:28 am by simone.pignatti »
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Offline SaKhan

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #206 on: November 22, 2017, 06:09:37 pm »
Should we expect any reviews before the NDA is lifted?
 

Online Mr. Scram

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #207 on: November 22, 2017, 06:23:53 pm »
Should we expect any reviews before the NDA is lifted?
Not unless the reviewers want to wait until they are for sale next time.
 

Offline Microcheap

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #208 on: November 22, 2017, 08:32:09 pm »
I just spotted, Batronix is listing the SDS1104X-E at 510 eur and SDS1204X-E 784 eur vat. included

https://www.batronix.com/shop/oscilloscopes/Siglent-SDS1104X-E.html
https://www.batronix.com/shop/oscilloscopes/SDS1204X-E.html

But the rigol 1054z is now cheaper, 379 eur.
 

Offline simone.pignatti

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #209 on: November 22, 2017, 08:37:06 pm »
Wow...launch date is scheduled for November the 27th, they were fast ...
Yes price are correct.
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Online Mr. Scram

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #210 on: November 22, 2017, 08:45:34 pm »
The 100 MHz version is listed as a two channel version, though.

At these prices I guarantee you it's not going to be a DS1054Z killer. The 100 MHz version is over 25% more expensive than an easily upgraded DS1054Z and the 200 MHz model is almost double. Even if it's quicker and has some features the Rigol hasn't, it's going to be a tough sell. There's a reason the Rigol is popular and it's not because it's a flawless oscilloscope.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 08:53:23 pm by Mr. Scram »
 

Offline simone.pignatti

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #211 on: November 22, 2017, 08:51:54 pm »
You maybe right, in fact the most of the request (with us) since yesterday are about the 200Mhz. But if the 100MHz will become hackable then it will be a different story!
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Online Mr. Scram

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #212 on: November 22, 2017, 08:57:44 pm »
You maybe right, in fact the most of the request (with us) since yesterday are about the 200Mhz. But if the 100MHz will become hackable then it will be a different story!
I'm sure there will be a market for them, but I think it won't displace the DS1054Z. If the thing becomes hackable, then yes, it'll much more of a competitor.
 

Offline alreadystarted

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #213 on: November 22, 2017, 08:58:24 pm »
The 100 MHz version is listed as a two channel version, though.

At these prices I guarantee you it's not going to be a DS1054Z killer. The 100 MHz version is over 25% more expensive than an easily upgraded DS1054Z and the 200 MHz model is almost double. Even if it's quicker and has some features the Rigol hasn't, it's going to be a tough sell. There's reason the Rigol is popular and it's not because it's a flawless oscilloscope.

I agree.  Amazon in the US is listing the 100MHz version at $499.  Which is arguably superior to a hacked DS1054Z ($400, current sale $350) based on specs, but with a $150 premium it's not clear the value is there.

Some kind of launch promo for the 200MHz package including the MSO option for like $650 would present some real value though.  I hope they consider something like that.
 

Offline simone.pignatti

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #214 on: November 22, 2017, 09:05:39 pm »
It is almost Xmas and we have a nice oscilloscopes fight in place :)
It is nice to see so many new features in such segment and what will bring Rigol next!!!
Great time to be a electronic lover :)
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Online Mr. Scram

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #215 on: November 22, 2017, 09:09:36 pm »
It is almost Xmas and we have a nice oscilloscopes fight in place :)
It is nice to see so many new features in such segment and what will bring Rigol next!!!
Great time to be a electronic lover :)
Yeah, as stated before, I'm very curious how Rigol will respond to this. They have plenty to lose and should have the funds to pull a rabbit out of the hat.

Let's also not forget that engineers would have killed for one of these tools not too long ago. It's amazing what the progress of technology brings us.
 

Online Old Printer

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #216 on: November 22, 2017, 09:30:17 pm »
Not sure if I am reading this right but Saelig seems to be offering the 1054Z for $349 and adding the Option BND-MSO/DS1000Z - Serial Decode-Record Mode-Long Memory and Advanced Triggering. I think it is the hack, but it would be nice to have it legit.
Tequipment is now showing this as well, no mention of the 100Mhz part. Is this Rigol's response to the Siglet 4ch scope? Or are they lowering stock in advance of something new. If so, they have kept it pretty quiet so far.
Dave
« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 10:18:47 pm by Old Printer »
 

Online nctnico

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #217 on: November 22, 2017, 09:33:50 pm »
It is almost Xmas and we have a nice oscilloscopes fight in place :)
It is nice to see so many new features in such segment and what will bring Rigol next!!!
Great time to be a electronic lover :)
Yeah, as stated before, I'm very curious how Rigol will respond to this. They have plenty to lose and should have the funds to pull a rabbit out of the hat.
I think Rigol can lower the price because they have no engineering expenses anymore. For example: the DS1054Z currently costs $349 at Tequipment.net and they have over 1100 in stock at the moment. They are probably going to do good business during the upcoming holidays.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline Digby

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #218 on: November 22, 2017, 09:39:04 pm »
This will be released in the US on Monday, according to a Siglent rep.
 

Offline Hydron

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #219 on: November 22, 2017, 09:42:25 pm »
Assuming that there aren't any major gotchas, I think that the alleged improvements over the Rigol would be worth the money, even at 100MHz vs a hacked DS1054Z.

The DS1000Z series is really not satisfactory at 100MHz with more than 2 channels enabled, or at low signal levels, or when using the FFT - I especially had issues with the first 2, and they were factors in my decision to upgrade to a (launch-promo) RTB2004. That said, the DS1054Z is still at an amazing price for those with very tight budgets, and will do the job for many - I was never unhappy about buying mine!.

Given the free serial decodes (particularly important for us), I'll be suggesting at work that we grab one of the Siglents (hopefully I can nudge them towards the 200MHz option). As we can't really hack Rigol options when using them commercially, once you add the serial decoding option the price difference basically disappears even if you don't want the 100MHz bandwidth.
 

Online nctnico

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #220 on: November 22, 2017, 09:52:40 pm »
Assuming that there aren't any major gotchas, I think that the alleged improvements over the Rigol would be worth the money, even at 100MHz vs a hacked DS1054Z.

The DS1000Z series is really not satisfactory at 100MHz with more than 2 channels enabled, or at low signal levels, or when using the FFT - I especially had issues with the first 2, and they were factors in my decision to upgrade to a (launch-promo) RTB2004. That said, the DS1054Z is still at an amazing price for those with very tight budgets, and will do the job for many - I was never unhappy about buying mine!.

Given the free serial decodes (particularly important for us), I'll be suggesting at work that we grab one of the Siglents (hopefully I can nudge them towards the 200MHz option). As we can't really hack Rigol options when using them commercially, once you add the serial decoding option the price difference basically disappears even if you don't want the 100MHz bandwidth.
IMHO there is a big difference between the hobbyist market (where the DS1054Z seems to have set the price benchmark) and scopes for commercial use. For commercial use you need a scope which is much better polished, tested and documented than what Rigol or Siglent push out of their factories. Dealing with bugs, measurement errors and unclear documentation will simply cost money in a commercial environment. Been there, done that, lesson learned. A commercial environment puts a lot more demands on a piece of equipment than a hobby lab.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 10:12:16 pm by nctnico »
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline Hydron

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #221 on: November 22, 2017, 10:12:49 pm »
Well, most of the time it's software engineers using them to look at a slow I2C bus without bothering with ground clips! Cheap does the job in that case, as long as the memory depth is enough and there is the decode option.
 
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Offline SaKhan

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #222 on: November 22, 2017, 11:09:12 pm »
Assuming that there aren't any major gotchas, I think that the alleged improvements over the Rigol would be worth the money, even at 100MHz vs a hacked DS1054Z.

The DS1000Z series is really not satisfactory at 100MHz with more than 2 channels enabled, or at low signal levels, or when using the FFT - I especially had issues with the first 2, and they were factors in my decision to upgrade to a (launch-promo) RTB2004. That said, the DS1054Z is still at an amazing price for those with very tight budgets, and will do the job for many - I was never unhappy about buying mine!.

Given the free serial decodes (particularly important for us), I'll be suggesting at work that we grab one of the Siglents (hopefully I can nudge them towards the 200MHz option). As we can't really hack Rigol options when using them commercially, once you add the serial decoding option the price difference basically disappears even if you don't want the 100MHz bandwidth.
IMHO there is a big difference between the hobbyist market (where the DS1054Z seems to have set the price benchmark) and scopes for commercial use. For commercial use you need a scope which is much better polished, tested and documented than what Rigol or Siglent push out of their factories. Dealing with bugs, measurement errors and unclear documentation will simply cost money in a commercial environment. Been there, done that, lesson learned. A commercial environment puts a lot more demands on a piece of equipment than a hobby lab.
As with any other equipment for commercial use, a company should evaluate several different options and choose the most appropriate one without relying on the vendor's reputation. That's valid for both hardware and software. Anyway in this hobbyist price range I don't quite get the business logic behind having the same hardware and selling upgrade keys for half of the device price. In the Siglent's case I find the SDS-1104X-E price quite fair however they are asking somewhat too much for the 200 Mhz model. I think most people will buy the cheaper model because of budget constraints and/or in the hope of it eventually getting hacked. I also don't think that Rigol will come up with a similar hardware for a lot less in the next year.
 

Online Mr. Scram

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #223 on: November 23, 2017, 12:51:01 am »
IMHO there is a big difference between the hobbyist market (where the DS1054Z seems to have set the price benchmark) and scopes for commercial use. For commercial use you need a scope which is much better polished, tested and documented than what Rigol or Siglent push out of their factories. Dealing with bugs, measurement errors and unclear documentation will simply cost money in a commercial environment. Been there, done that, lesson learned. A commercial environment puts a lot more demands on a piece of equipment than a hobby lab.
I know of people who use the DS1054Z in a rather serious lab and development setting. They obviously aren't going to generate vital performance report with the instrument, but if it's enough for doing the odd job, it's enough.
 

Offline Diabolo

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Re: Siglent SDS1204X-E released for domestic markets in China
« Reply #224 on: November 23, 2017, 02:13:30 am »
Hello,

For anyone who knows that Rigol can be hacked he can find the price Siglent 1104X-E and 1204X-E high, but for those who do not know that Rigol can be hacked then for him the price Siglent is correct.
One must think before saying that 1104X-E and 1204X-E Siglent is expensive!
As for hacker Siglent 1104X-E in 1204X-E, you will have to wait a long time if the 2 models are different internally!

In my opinion.
Diabolo
 


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