Siglent SDS2000X HD, 12bit, 2GSa/s high definition oscilloscope serie.

[tv84]

Nice, let´s see how long I have to wait for.

Martin, why not a 6000 Pro?  "Keep your eyes on that little light and listen carefully to what I say: 6000... 6000..."

[Martin72]

...tic-tac, tic-tac, tic-tac, tic-tac.....

Although I like the 12" screen and wish the 2KHD had one, I must say:
No Sir.

They actually look more like father and son... 

It´s crazy which difference the 2" makes - Maybe I get the chance tomorrow and photograph the 3 lecroys side by side.
WS3024 (10"), HDO6034A(12"), WR9054 (15")

[Martin72]

....and my sds2k+ is sold, now there´s no return. 

[Martin72]

So we will be two - let´s start a new thead...
Nice, let´s see how long I have to wait for.

This week 
(They already got them, but aren't allowed to send away until official release)

[rf-loop]

Original post title changed.

Public launch is now, the 9th June 2022

CST is now 0001,  09.06.2022
(Center of Siglent Time  )

[Martin72]

Waiting for a new instrument is like having christmas for elder men...
With a little luck, I can unpack my present in the next days.

[swmcl]

Can I ask what the general history of pricing is with Siglent ?  Do they start out at an oscenely high price and it comes down over time or do they just set it and forget it ?  I realise also that they will have 'specials' every now and then.

[tautech]

Can I ask what the general history of pricing is with Siglent ? 

Generally set and forget however occasionally products are placed on special and sometimes for years like when SDG1032X was reduced to $319 but just recently returned to the release price of $359. 

Obviously they watch sales and if a product could be performing better they offer say free option licenses or reduced pricing on HW/Option packages.
For most of 2021 somewhere in the world had great deals on SDS2000X Plus models.

SDS2000X HD however are in another class of DSO not intended for the normal hobbyist market although if they don't meet sales targets they might have lollies offered with them to lift sales. 
For now we've judged them as too rich for NZ and don't initially intend to stock them while the SDS2000X Plus is as good as it is.

[rf-loop]

Generally set and forget however occasionally products are placed on special and sometimes for years like when SDG1032X was reduced to $319 but just recently returned to the release price of $359. 

As you may know, the prices of many used components have risen and due to problems with the availability of global components, some products may also need to be partially redesign/modify for different components. The situation is now really bad and it is getting worse. We don’t have a reset button that would make this madness back to its senses.

But no matter how it goes ...

The SDS2000X HD is too cheap now.
100 - 350 (opt 2ch 500) MHz thoroughbred 12-bit high resolution little giant.
Starting from 2980 euro. (VAT 0)
Included (all models) with SP5050A  500MHz probes. (Sadly not with SP3050A)

[Martin72]

Now listed on batronix website:

https://www.batronix.com/versand/oszilloskope/Siglent-SDS2104X-hd.html

[tautech]

Now listed on batronix website:

https://www.batronix.com/versand/oszilloskope/Siglent-SDS2104X-hd.html

And Siglent US website:
https://siglentna.com/digital-oscilloscopes/sds2000x-hd-digital-storage-oscilloscope/

And Siglent EU website:
https://www.siglenteu.com/digital-oscilloscopes/sds2000x-hd-digital-storage-oscilloscope/

And HQ Website:
https://int.siglent.com/products-overview/sds2000hd/

[Martin72]

Interesting,
On batronix site, the deliverytime will be up to 3 weeks - but mine should arrive tomorrow or saturday.

The SDS2000X HD is too cheap now.

For the entry-price you can get the SDS5034X.
250Mpts, 5 GSa/s, minimum 500Mhz at all 4 channels (when hacked), additional probe sensors ( don´t know the right description)....

Vs 200Mpts, 2 GSa/s, max 500Mhz on 2 channels, no additional probe sensors...
Do the 12 bit justify everything ?
Or is there more, not so obvious that makes it (a little bit) more expensive than the SDS5000X and too cheap like you said ?
It´s only a question of interest, I´ve already bought the 12 bit beast. 

[tv84]

Do the 12 bit justify everything ?
Or is there more, not so obvious that makes it (a little bit) more expensive than the SDS5000X and too cheap like you said ?

You will tell us. And, you can always later exchange it for a 6000 Pro... tic... tac...

[Martin72]

 

No Sir, this scope will be the absolute maximum I´ll spend money for.
And now fingers crossed that DHL will be my friend tomorrow.

[2N3055]

No Sir, this scope will be the absolute maximum I´ll spend money for.
And now fingers crossed that DHL will be my friend tomorrow.

Do you need me to send you few more photos to carry you trough the night..?
I mean, that is what friends are for...
 

[2N3055]

Do the 12 bit justify everything ?
Or is there more, not so obvious that makes it (a little bit) more expensive than the SDS5000X and too cheap like you said ?

You will tell us. And, you can always later exchange it for a 6000 Pro... tic... tac...

You naughty boy.. Don't feed the Gremlins after the midnight...

[KrzysztofB]

Went throught the thread, didn't see it at first glance.
https://youtu.be/ehajIpHolVk
Very pleasant for the eye that device is.

[Martin72]

And now fingers crossed that DHL will be my friend tomorrow.

They won´t. 

[slugrustle]

One of the chaps has a 12 bit Chinese 6000 on here I believe perhaps we could set up a couple of benchmarks with the 4000HD I still have a couple here.

Any inklings as to whether Siglent might release a 12-bit variant of the SDS5000X or SDS6000A series to western markets?

[Martin72]

They´ve already done this - Indirectly and under a different brand.

[egonotto]

Hello Martin72,

sorry that you have to wait for your new SDS2000X HD.

If you have your scope, can you please post "noise samples"
Perhaps more than 1 MS and different channels ( B and D) and 1 mV/diff and 1 V/diff with open input or short(50 Ohm and 1 MOhm).

It would be also nice if you can post such files from the 12 Bit Lecroy HD4000 I believe.

If this are to great files, than MrAureliusR says "These files can get pretty big, not sure what the file size limit of the forum is, but if you need more space mega.co.nz is decent and free."

He has right.

Best regards
egonotto

[Martin72]

Hi Egonotto,

At work we got a HDO6034A...
And yes, apart from this and at all, tell me what I can measure/compare things for you, I´ll try to do and record it.
At work, we are into making power supplies for several needings - At private, my hobbies are audio electronics/speakers and power supplies (but not so big ), creating test jigs...
So my equipment is likely "bare".
Bodnar-Pulser is here, Siglent Demoboard with several signals, SDG1062X generator...

[rf-loop]

Some simple noise test results and dual tone low frequency tests.
I believe all data is in images so no need explanations.
All channels BNC just open, Internally 50 ohm.
Settings selected so that most oscilloscopes today can follow roughly the same settings for comparable results.
Noise Vrms measured using Stdev which prevents the effect of a possible small DC offset. (also based on true counting all samples)


500MHz (limited to two channel when interleaved for 2GSa/s)


200MHz (limited to two channel when interleaved 2GSa/s)



350MHz


200MHz


20MHz

As can see in mesurements including statistics it can say it is as advertised and as is in specifications (note: typical values!)

[rf-loop]

ETA: (2022-06-13):
I forgot to point out:
The following, which concerns ERES, concerns specifically and only hardware-based ERES (In Acquire menu).

This model also has a separate ERES as a Math. function. (In Math menu)
It has not been used here at all.
------------------------------------------


Also there is noise levels using ERES.
With a suitably set sample rate, it can be used as a digital low-pass filter.
In this scope user have Memory Management: Auto, Fixed memory, Fixed Samplerate.

Note: When ERES is in use Max memory is limited to 10M non interleaved (ADC working 1GSa/s) and 20M in interleaved mode (ADC working 2GSa/s)

ERES acquisition does not require the signal to be periodic, nor does it require stable triggering, but due to the digital filtering, the system bandwidth of the oscilloscope will degrade in ERES mode. The higher the enhanced bits, the lower the bandwidth.


The following table shows the relationship between ERES bits and bandwidth in SDS2000X HD:

Enhanced Bits,   -3dB bandwidth         0.5     0.25*Samplerate         1       0.115*Samplerate         1.5     0.055*Samplerate         2       0.028*Samplerate         2.5     0.014*Samplerate         3       0.007*Samplerate

One example: If user have selected fixed samplerate 40ks/s, (example with 1ms/div) and ERES 3.0, -3dB BW is 280Hz.


For reference, normal 350MHz BW (No ERES)


ERES 0.5



ERES 1.0



ERES 1.5



ERES 2.0



ERES 2.5



ERES 3.0

[rf-loop]

Dual tone tests are made using SDG1032X for generate two signals. Ch1is f1 and Ch2 is f2
After then come resistive 50ohm splitter and then this combination go to SDS2504X HD Channel 2.
Note that different frequency pairs may have different FFT samplerate so also different resolution.
In all measurements FFT in average mode n=4 ¹⁾, and for better level accuracy of course only right FFT window what is FlatTop.
Signal level after splitter is around 0dBm and naturally SDG output levels to splitter are 6dBm.
Because dual tone signals quality is partially unknown result is some amount questinable. The result is indicative.
1) (Sadly)This is not same as pure unweighted last n average (which one I like much more for this kind of technical purpose).



Signal f1 10999kHz and  f2 11001kHz (2kHz gap.)
2*f1-f2 =  10997kHz, marker 1 ~ -69dBc
2*f2-f1 = 11003kHz, marker 4 ~ -69dBc



Signal f1 999.9kHz and  f2 1000.1kHz (200Hz gap.)
2*f1-f2 =  999.7kHz, marker 1 ~ -71dBc
2*f2-f1 = 1000.3kHz, marker 4 ~ -71dBc


Signal f1 99.9kHz and  f2 100.1kHz (200Hz gap.)
2*f1-f2 =  99.7kHz, marker 1,  ~ -80dBc
2*f2-f1 = 100.3kHz, marker 4,  ~ -81dBc



Signal f1 9.9kHz and  f2 10.1kHz (200Hz gap.)
2*f1-f2 =  9.7kHz, marker 1, ~ -83dBc
2*f2-f1 = 10.3kHz, marker 4, ~ -85dBc
 

Well, imho, not bad ... and it's maybe even better, but as stated above, the test signals are as they are, in partially of unknown quality in relation to the requirements of just such a test. But perhaps result tells more better than if there is not any kind of result at all displayed.