Siglent SDS2000X HD, 12bit, 2GSa/s high definition oscilloscope serie.

[Performa01]

How usable is the HD above 350 MHz? Where is the 3dB cutoff? 6dB? Near 500MHz? I didn't see any review trying to use it at the limits.

In full channel mode the sample rate is limited to 1 GSa/s, therefore the absolute limit is about 440 MHz in sin(x)/x vector display mode, because of Nyquist and the limited (yet stunning) reconstruction capabilities of modern sampling systems. In dots display mode we can push it a little higher, but 500 MHz still marks the absolute limit, where we cannot get any meaningful signal representation anymore.

In half channel mode, the sample rate is 2 GSa/s, hence the absolute limit is at 1 GHz.
The opening posting shows the frequency response with -3 dB at about 525 MHz;

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-12bit-(published-for-chinese-domestic-market-only)/

My own measurements in March 2022 show a much better result, -3 dB at about 570 MHz, see attached screenshot.
The ripple in this measurement comes from an accidental cable mismatch (1.5 meters of 75 ohm RG179, about 1 dB loss at 500 MHz, not compensated). So the actual -3 dB bandwidth might be even a little higher.

[rf-loop]

SDS2504X-HD
2 channels on. (1 and 4)

(better quality measurement than this my old (also cable is different without BNC/N anadper)
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-12bit-(published-for-chinese-domestic-market-only)/  )

Ch1 50 Ω input, reference signal 1MHz  ~300 mVpp  (here as 0 dB ref)
Normal acquisition (no any kind of averaging etc)
As can see -3 dB corner is ~540 MHz  and  -6 dB is over ~640 MHz

Generator old HP8642B (with well better level accuracy than specs limits - checked and fine adjusted ~1/2 year ago )
Cable from generator to oscilloscope  80 cm   M17/084  (RG223) with Suhner connectors N in other end and BNC in other end (no any extra adapter than in old measurements and also cable  length is less)



0 dB reference




-3 dB




-6 dB 

[skander36]

Why Pk-Pk value is 1,97 mV, while input is 300 mV@1MHz ?
What I am missing?

[2N3055]

Why Pk-Pk value is 1,97 mV, while input is 300 mV@1MHz ?
What I am missing?
(Attachment Link)

That is statistics for Amplitude measurement. You can also enable small histicons (small histograms) for statistical spread. And touch histicon and get large histogram. Per every measurement.

[rf-loop]

Why Pk-Pk value is 1,97 mV, while input is 300 mV@1MHz ?
What I am missing?
(Attachment Link)

You are missing how it works.

As @2N3055 well explained it is statistics.  Measurement value is Amp. It do not measure here anything else but Amp.
All other values are statistics from this repeated Amp measurements. In this case Amp is measured 236 times. And statistics are (in this case) calculated from these 236 values.
 If there is one time measured 301mV Amp and one time 299mV Amp and all other measured values are between these two values then there read Pk-Pk 2.0mV.   
 

[rf-loop]

Here also freq response curve using osciloscope V level bands I and II.

It have 3 bands:
I:  500uV - 100mV /div 
II: 102mV - 1V  /div
III: 1.02V - 10V /div

(sadly 50 ohm input can set only between 500uV - 1.00V/div (without any real true reasons except "kindergarten" type of reasons))

Sweep starts from 5MHz due to some freq span limits in generator sweep span.
Same cable as previous and same generator.
Note that now reference level for dB is not 1MHz.


V band I: 500uV - 100mV (50mV/div)


V Band II: 102mV - 1V (102mV/div)

Note these some small peaks. This generator "sweep" is frequency hopping (not so small interval steps and in some steps it generate some "glitches" until it stabilize to freq step (good real RF gen but poor sweeping gen)

[skander36]

Why Pk-Pk value is 1,97 mV, while input is 300 mV@1MHz ?
What I am missing?
(Attachment Link)

You are missing how it works.

As @2N3055 well explained it is statistics.  Measurement value is Amp. It do not measure here anything else but Amp.
All other values are statistics from this repeated Amp measurements. In this case Amp is measured 236 times. And statistics are (in this case) calculated from these 236 values.
 If there is one time measured 301mV Amp and one time 299mV Amp and all other measured values are between these two values then there read Pk-Pk 2.0mV.   
 

Yeah, that's make sense. Seeing  Pk-Pk in statistics is not something that can be seen everyday. None of my scopes show this parameter in stats.

[EE4all]

Thank you all for the follow ups to my questions. I'm convinced, and have placed an order for one. Now to find who can help this hobbyist with some feature codes once it arrives. 😀

[6313oscar]

I am the proud owner of a SDS2104X HD, so i guess i could be accepted in the 'owners club'. I must say this a big game changer compared to the Rigol DS1054Z which i have used for the past 7-8 years maybe, and will keep me busy for the next months, got a lot of RTFMing to do.
It only took a day to arrive.

Thanks a lot  Martin72 for the welectron tip, i will be using it in the future for sure.
Now i would have to kindly ask for a PM with the info about the unlocking.

  (Attachment Link)

We are a startup and bought it right when it came out. Almost out time with those 30 days licenses which it came with. Sad to see all those bundles with free stuff

[Martin72]

Didn´t noticed so far that the REF button will change it´s color when you change the trace color in the menu, that´s nice..

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/new-scope-demoboard-from-batronix/msg4895744/#msg4895744

[EE4all]

Mine has been on order for a week. I am waiting for my reseller to get it in.   

[Kevmeister68]

Hello, newbie here.

If I was tossing up between HD and the SDS2000X plus series, what are the key use-cases where the 12-bit resolution is essential? Buying the Plus seems a no-brainer price-wise but double the price for HD takes a bit more consideration, but I can see the advantage of perhaps not buying another scope for 10 years unless it breaks. Is 12-bit becoming the new 8-bit or will it remain niche for many many years still?

[Performa01]

If I was tossing up between HD and the SDS2000X plus series, what are the key use-cases where the 12-bit resolution is essential? Buying the Plus seems a no-brainer price-wise but double the price for HD takes a bit more consideration, but I can see the advantage of perhaps not buying another scope for 10 years unless it breaks. Is 12-bit becoming the new 8-bit or will it remain niche for many many years still?

8 bits have been sufficient for the majority of tasks in the past and I don't think this will change anytime soon – rather the opposite.

It should be obvious where the applications for an HD scope are – it's whenever you want or need high resolution. In the case of an SDS2000X HD you also get high accuracy on top of that. The SDS2000X HD can replace an average DMM for DC measurements, and it performs highly accurate AC measurements up to high frequencies which even high end bench DMMs can't do even at low audio frequencies. And in contrast to a DMM, the DSO does it high speed and on multiple channels simultaneously – and it can link these information together and do measurements and math across the channels.

In this posting I've compiled a number of demonstrations about what to expect from the SDS2000X HD:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sds2000x-hd-12bit-(published-for-chinese-domestic-market-only)/msg4622245/#msg4622245

If none of these topics is of any interest to you, then you'll probably be perfectly happy with the SDS2000X Plus.

[EE4all]

Mine has been on order for a week. I am waiting for my reseller to get it in.   

It shipped! 

[corey]

Where did you order it from? I'm lookign to get some pricing for one of these. And still weighing it up against an MSO5000. 

[EE4all]

Saelig, using a forum provided discount. You can get a code sent to you by asking in the Saelig thread.

[EE4all]

Mine has been on order for a week. I am waiting for my reseller to get it in.   

It shipped! 

It has arrived! 

Very nice...

[teddychn]

I finally went for the 2104X HD as well. My major job and interests are switch power, analog/digital audio, and microcontroller systems. The main reasons for my choice are as follows:

   1. Observing saturation voltage or conduction resistance of power devices.
   2.  Evaluating EMI signals and Class-D amplifier spectrum with FFT.
   3.  Measuring harmonic distortions.
   4.  Measuring clock jitter of digital audio systems.
   5.  Using it as a component analyzer.
   6.  Observing gain/phase characteristics.
   7.  Performing mixed-signal testing.

The reasons I mentioned above kind of convincing myself to choose the HD model. I am aware that the 2000X Plus can satisfy 90% or 95% of my demands. I had purchased an Analog Discovery 2 due to its 14-bit ADC resolution. However, its poor front-end ranges and memory depth impose some limitations.

I had been using the Agilent 54622D for 23 years. Now, it's time to upgrade its sample rate, bandwidth, vertical resolution, and functionality. I placed the order several days ago, but the dealer informed me that they are currently out of stock for this model, as the factory is producing a new batch. Consequently, I have to wait for a few days, possibly up to 10 days.

[Martin72]

It will be worth the wait...
Firmware update:
Every current model has already received one this year, I'm curious when "we" are on it.

[teddychn]

My HD has arrived. But I'm a bit disappointed that its screen (protector) has a lot of scratches on it. Here is my first impression and opinion below:

Positives:

1. The LED indicators are brilliant, they can even change color according to different functions. For example, the TRIGGER indicator changes its color depending on the trigger channel.
2. 12 bits plus ERES can show very small details in large signals.
3. 12 bits-2M-point FFT is very useful.
4. It's very responsive, even though it's 12 bits with deep memory.

Negatives:

1. I don't understand why there are so many scratches on the screen. If they were caused during delivery, why does the center area also have scratches? It shouldn't be like this.
2. The knobs turn loosely and wobble. Another 9-month-old SDS2074X plus of my company is even more secure. I don't know if I'm too picky.
3. I don't know if the soft-plastic knobs have any problem of getting sticky. My 54622D's knobs became sticky with aging.

Wishes:

1. Now I feel that 4 math channels are also needed.
2. Logarithmic frequency scale of FFT is important for this kind of high-resolution spectrum. It helps to investigate low frequency details.
3. Quick Action Key could be designed to pop up a panel (or window) with multiple soft keys to choose from.
4. Customizable functions for Auto, Default and Touch keys. I rarely use them personally. If they could be changed to other shortcut keys, that would be very convenient.

By the way, I'm thinking about getting a screen protector. Do you use one on your oscilloscope?

[Martin72]

Hi and congratulations...

FFT: We've created a wish list(thread see my signature), I'll check later to see if logarythmic scaling is already included.
Screen protector I don't use..

[Martin72]

Now a little more (at home)....

Negatives:

1. I don't understand why there are so many scratches on the screen. If they were caused during delivery, why does the center area also have scratches? It shouldn't be like this.
2. The knobs turn loosely and wobble. Another 9-month-old SDS2074X plus of my company is even more secure. I don't know if I'm too picky.
3. I don't know if the soft-plastic knobs have any problem of getting sticky. My 54622D's knobs became sticky with aging.

1. That wouldn´t worry me much, as this foil is only a kind of transport protection, not a "real" screen protection foil we all know from tablets, smartphones...
Important is of course you don´t have scratches on the screen.
2. They´re using better incremental encoders for it, they are much smoother than those of the 2000xplus model, so they feel "wobbly".
3. Time will tell, the knobs of my HD are still in the same condition as I´ve bought the scope a year ago.

Wishes:

1. Now I feel that 4 math channels are also needed.
2. Logarithmic frequency scale of FFT is important for this kind of high-resolution spectrum. It helps to investigate low frequency details.
3. Quick Action Key could be designed to pop up a panel (or window) with multiple soft keys to choose from.
4. Customizable functions for Auto, Default and Touch keys. I rarely use them personally. If they could be changed to other shortcut keys, that would be very convenient.

1. Will come probably with the next (and only second) firmware
2. As mentioned before.
3 Yeah, that rigol style would be welcome, although it´s not really important for me.
4. Sounds to me like a difficult and fundamental "operation" on the UI, hard to believe that they will approach it that way.
You can't have everything.

[rf-loop]

My HD has arrived. But I'm a bit disappointed that its screen (protector) has a lot of scratches on it. Here is my first impression and opinion below:




Negatives:

1. I don't understand why there are so many scratches on the screen. If they were caused during delivery, why does the center area also have scratches? It shouldn't be like this.




By the way, I'm thinking about getting a screen protector. Do you use one on your oscilloscope?

Did you not notice (This notice label can also see in your image) "Remove before use"


This film is only for factory and packaging handling protection.

Btw. Why you need screen protector? For what. (but yes if you handle it in environment where is lot of hard material dust for example, stone dust or similar what do not usually exist in electronics working rooms. Or with fingers what have this kind of dirty) Why need even touch this display more than just in some rare cases. Mouse is your friend number 1. 
Mostly I do not touch whole oscilloscope at all until I connect signal wires or probes.

[teddychn]

I know the film is just for protection. But I have never seen any brand new products with such scratches on its screen protector right out of the box. Fortunately,there is another thicker film underneath it.
So I don't need one anymore.

I use both a mouse and touch, depending on the available space on my desk. In addition, because the HD is a bit too tall for my rack, I currently have it set on the top shelf. As a result, using the mouse while sitting causes some discomfort in my neck. I am currently planning to modify my instrument rack to accommodate it.

In addition to the 12-bit and deep-memory advantages, having four 500MHz probes and the hardware ERES/Average mode makes it worth the price. Of course, excellent performance as well. No regrets.

[Martin72]

Hi,

In addition to the 12-bit and deep-memory advantages, having four 500MHz probes and the hardware ERES/Average mode makes it worth the price.

As the user rf-loop already said once, actually it is too cheap...To our luck.
And to have Average as acquisition mode, what an advantage this is I notice again and again at work when I measure with a SDS2104X+.
There you have to "sacrifice" a math channel for it, also it is not exactly convenient to have to act this way.
And so it is as it is, you realize only gradually what advantages the HD still brings with it, in addition to the 12 bit.