Siglent SDS2000X Plus

[Bad_Driver]

I don‘t understand the concerns and the arguments against the request for a proper calibration sheet.

The calibration sheet is part of the product. End. It was in my SDS2000x+ and my SDG2042.
And as I noticed in most of your boxes as well.

It proves to me that Siglent is taking care of their product quality. I appreaciate this.

If it is missing it shall be allowed to ask why.

[Martin72]

Of course it´s OK, nobody would deny this.
But only one page ("This thing is OK") without measured values makes at last no sense to me.
What did they measured, which are the results from, are they in the middle of the tolerance or are the values hard on it...Nothing.
Just it´s OK.
That´s only my opinion, for sure. 

[Bad_Driver]

Martin, of course you are right.
But Siglent developes itself in the right direction. Nowadays they address perfect the market for ambitioned hobbyists
and small and medium companys.
With the exploding prices for used equipment I prefer to buy a device from them rather than to spend
the money for an overpriced 20 years old HAgilsight device in unknown condition @ Ebay.

I bought a Fluke 45 5 years ago for 80 €. Now sellers call 300€ for this 30y old device! That is crazy!

I‘m pretty sure Siglent is following all this discussions @ EEV and may be in some time we see real certificates.

[Martin72]

Siglent is my favorite brand for hobbyists, without any doubt.
At last as the sds2k+ comes up, which I would recommend for our departement (testfield), as it was not too "cheap" for yearly calibration cycle ( we must do that), but cheap enough to order a couple of them.
I´ll wait for the next fw updates before I starting a "charm offense" at work for it...

[tautech]

Of course it´s OK, nobody would deny this.
But only one page ("This thing is OK") without measured values makes at last no sense to me.
What did they measured, which are the results from, are they in the middle of the tolerance or are the values hard on it...Nothing.
Just it´s OK.
That´s only my opinion, for sure. 

The scope has been adjusted....presumably after some burn in post production and warming beforehand to match or better datasheet spec on all specified parameters. Factory Cal sheets are just proof of initial adjustment to meet specification.
Yes it's that simple.

When we have an English service manual for 2kX Plus there will be a section of how to verify accuracy.
This is also part of a pre recalibration process....verification of accuracy and it is a very detailed process where for example amplitude accuracy for each V/div step is specified with an acceptable range and % tolerance.....and that's just one parameter !

Verifying an instruments accuracy is a long detailed arduous process to do manually and even running Autocal, a fully automated process can take 10+ minutes with each automatic adjustment taking just fractions of a second.

Here is the service manual link for the earlier SDS2000X where the verification section starts on P22
https://siglentna.com/download/2611/

[Martin72]

When we have an English service manual for 2kX Plus there will be a section of how to verify accuracy.

Until that we won´t know what they´ve testing - And when we got it, we don´t know the individual measured values.
But that´s the reason why our customers won´t accept a factory calibration certificate, even when it´s brandnew.
We must always calibrate our new goods again, with a detailed protocol.
For private usage it´s OK when siglent "say" on certificate sheet it´s OK...

[Elasia]

Siglent is my favorite brand for hobbyists, without any doubt.
At last as the sds2k+ comes up, which I would recommend for our departement (testfield), as it was not too "cheap" for yearly calibration cycle ( we must do that), but cheap enough to order a couple of them.
I´ll wait for the next fw updates before I starting a "charm offense" at work for it...

We use Siglent for R&D at work now but production is all Agilent / Keysight

[Elasia]

I'm looking into Micsig CP2100B  2.5 MHz version.

Good choice..

+1 and they also make good diff probes, i use them as a set for power line analysis usually DP10013

[tautech]

First job was very gently Dremel the edge of the 1 turn current loop to allow fitment of a Tek P6021 current probe as they have just a 3.6mm cable capacity whereas the DF2001A deskew PCB has ~4mm current loop and ~0.5mm of PCB wider again.
P6022 is smaller again, only allowing for 2.75mm cable diameter. 

Two possibilities imho:

You cut of a little piece of the layer and solder a flexible wire over it.
Or you cut a piece out and solder a massive wire of say 2mm diameter between the edges, see below.

A third based on #2.


Drill holes through the PCB current loop trace either side of the cut then fit and solder wire for better strain relief. 

So out with the Dremel for mods:


1mm² insulated solid copper wire still small enough in diameter to allow the small P6022 to fit on it and the added bonus of wide enough for 2 current probes. 
Lost the current flow indicator on the silkscreen but tough titty, it's not like you can't flip a current probe so its rising edge matches a voltage probe.
Has it changed the waveform, probably but only slightly but of no concern IMO as the rising edge is what we need for deskew purposes.
The current probe amplitude is still sufficiently accurate for correct adjustment of the current probe's channel attenuation settings. 

[Martin72]

Today I must modify my fixture too....

After doing this, first I test it with the FNIRSI "tablet" scope - Large loop seems to be well, but small loop....it couldn´t displaying it because of the weak voltage resolution.

Nevertheless, done it now with the siglent.

And you can clearly see the difference between large loop and small loop, concerning the risetime as we´d discussed about it.

Small loop:



Large loop:

[Elasia]

lol tau... no holds bar, pcb never saw it coming

[tautech]

lol tau... no holds bar, pcb never saw it coming

Actually it did, small loop was at first narrowed with the Dremel so P6021 could fit on it and that worked fine until I tried the 100 MHz P6022 that has a much smaller cable capacity of under 3mm ....then I just had to talk myself into getting all brutal and doing a proper job, once and for all !

Done now and quite happy with it. 

[Elasia]

I´ve test the clamp before, but only with sinewaves as I didn´t got anything else.

Now that you have fully tested you clamp you can move on.

...to throw it in the bin. 

lol i just found one of these turds in a drawer im now soldering on for shits and giggles... had it for years.. fuzz ball and drifts like a sob just like you had in your pics

a 10uF chip cap right on the output made it semi usable, still has so much drift it could take on vin diesel

[Martin72]

Lecroy got a fixture too:

DSC025

Won´t know the price for it...

[steve1515]

Martin,
On your deskew fixture, are the USB data lines connected to anything? I'm trying to put together my schematic, but I'm not sure if they should be connected to something or can be left floating.

[Martin72]

Hi Steve,

On your deskew fixture, are the USB data lines connected to anything?

No.

Meanwhile I´m also "working" on a fixture based on the siglent one, with USB and "normal" powering sockets.
And without any smd components to make the assembling easier.
You/"we" should post it in an own thread when finished.

Martin

[tautech]

Martin,
On your deskew fixture, are the USB data lines connected to anything? I'm trying to put together my schematic, but I'm not sure if they should be connected to something or can be left floating.

Not when I checked.... don't have mine within arms reach ATM so it only requires the 5V from a USB source to operate.

I do like the LeCroy deskew but you need the Probus to power it. 

[tautech]

Meanwhile I´m also "working" on a fixture based on the siglent one, with USB and "normal" powering sockets.

What's more normal than USB powered ?

[Martin72]

When you don´t got usb power ?
It´s no hurt to implement this on the board too.

[Martin72]

Won´t know the price for it...

Now knowing the price, appx 970€ 

[Elasia]

Bullocks, smd all the way, solder paste, tweeze component, heat, done

I'd say whomever making their own should step up their game at this point in history

[Ctrlocti]

Just got one and having spent 10mins on it, the screen viewing angles are a real kick in the balls. I have mine on a shelf so the screen begins just a bit above eye-level (eye-level is right where the channel inputs are) and everything is washed out, the grid is barely visible, and the font is hard to read.

It's very nice when looking at it straight on, or even above the screen, but below it its crap.

Real shame cause the main reason I went for it was the large screen. And the fact that the angles above the screen are very good is like salt on a wound. Couldn't it be the other way around, ye gods?

On top of that, if you have any light source behind you, the screen will reflect it back so yeah, close the curtains.

Disappointed. Will see if I can make it work or if it's going back....

[Johnny B Good]

 Have you tried increasing the graticule brightness? 

JBG

[Elasia]

There is more than just graticule, touch display then menu and fiddle with the settings for backlight, intensity, graticule, etc till you find something you like

Although I have noticed the same thing you are talking about from when i had it on a higher shelf before I had the spot prepared at eye level for it.. it works best at eye level if you are able to do it

[nctnico]

Bullocks, smd all the way, solder paste, tweeze component, heat, done

I'd say whomever making their own should step up their game at this point in history

Agreed. SMD is much easier; even withoug solder paste. Hand soldering 1206 is very easy and faster than putting pins through a hole.