Siglent Technical Support join in EEVblog

[McBryce]

Reminder to all with Siglent products to check their firmware is up to date with latest version so to take advantage of any new features and/or capability that may have been added to your products:
https://int.siglent.com/download/firmwares/

Nope, not only is there not new firmware to fix the multiple bugs still present in my relatively new SHS806 Scope, but now it's not even listed under handheld scopes. If that's the level of support that one can expect from Siglent I won't be buying further devices from them.

McBryce.

[hpw]

Reminder to all with Siglent products to check their firmware is up to date with latest version so to take advantage of any new features and/or capability that may have been added to your products:
https://int.siglent.com/download/firmwares/

Nope, not only is there not new firmware to fix the multiple bugs still present in my relatively new SHS806 Scope, but now it's not even listed under handheld scopes. If that's the level of support that one can expect from Siglent I won't be buying further devices from them.

McBryce.

You get the beef point, as you see almost ALL SIGLENT gears did not get any FW update SINCE YEARS. Talking to Siglent support gets as water down the toilette and than it's done forever.

For an users ... as looks like most gear no any longer supported 

Hp

[oz2cpu]

brand new SPD3303X
BUG found
and yes it is running latest fw:
SPD3303X Firmware - 1.01.01.02.07R2 (Release Date 02.05.21 )

outputs will not turn on, random delays, red led at each output,
setpoints copied to read out display, both voltage and current sets, while 0V 0A is at the connectors.

Power recycled, now it works, want to see the video ?
go here : https://youtu.be/U1h9nqPttLw

[RikV]

I own a SDM3065X since a couple of months.
It look to me that I cannot save the screen time-out to the startup settings?
Is there a way to see the "uptime"-hours? Number of power-ons seems not meaningfull.

[tonycstech]

@ "Taking a screenshot with "SDS 1202X-E" using the blue Print button that saves the file to USB pen drive."

Is it a known issue that the newest FW 1.3.26 makes the scope to freeze completely and therefore useless, when trying to save an image more than once?

No it is not a known issue. 

Yes it is a known issue.
At times scope would freeze every time i try unless i boot with USB removed. Then it will work every time but not forever. It will take some time before it starts acting up again.
Just today (again when i needed it the most) it started acting up.
Tried different USB drive, same problem. But it went away as soon as i booted WITHOUT USB drive inserted.
Something in the circuit that is not working correctly. I think if i let it sit for few hrs, it will come back.
I cannot hope this will go away because i know for a fact it will come back the worst moment possible.

[tautech]

@ "Taking a screenshot with "SDS 1202X-E" using the blue Print button that saves the file to USB pen drive."

Is it a known issue that the newest FW 1.3.26 makes the scope to freeze completely and therefore useless, when trying to save an image more than once?

No it is not a known issue. 

Yes it is a known issue.
At times scope would freeze every time i try unless i boot with USB removed. Then it will work every time but not forever. It will take some time before it starts acting up again.
Just today (again when i needed it the most) it started acting up.
Tried different USB drive, same problem. But it went away as soon as i booted WITHOUT USB drive inserted.
Something in the circuit that is not working correctly. I think if i let it sit for few hrs, it will come back.
I cannot hope this will go away because i know for a fact it will come back the worst moment possible.

Thanks, some more info please.

Firmware version ?
USB stick properties ? Stick size and format type and cluster size.

[BillyO]

My request to Siglent for help with issues on my SDS1104X-E have landed on deaf ears.  No response whatsoever.

Is this par for the course?

[tonycstech]

Thanks, some more info please.
Firmware version ?
USB stick properties ? Stick size and format type and cluster size.

Firmware is the latest they have, problem persisted regardless of firmware so its irrelevant.
USB drive does not matter, it will behave the same way regardless of the drive or how its formated.

I now know exactly how it works:
#1 Format USB drive
#2 Boot scope with USB inserted.
#3 press PRINT.
If scope prints no problems, turn off the scope, unplug from the main and try to turn it on again by holding the power button for 2-5 seconds. Repeat couple of times.
This will drain internal capacitors
Now repeat steps 1-2-3
As soon as i hit print, scope will freeze. All buttons are frozen while display is still responding to probe.

If i boot scope and insert USB drive after scope has booted, PRINT will work no problem.

If i sent it to siglent, they may not be able to reproduce the problem and call it good.
Meanwhile i end up without a scope for a month.
Plus they will not apply new warranty sticker and who know what else.
Last time i sent them multimeter, they lost my probes and did not replace warranty sticker so its tempered with at this point.

[tautech]

Thanks, some more info please.
Firmware version ?
USB stick properties ? Stick size and format type and cluster size.

USB drive does not matter, it will behave the same way regardless of the drive or how its formated.

Thank you but it could. It must be FAT32 with preferably 4k clusters, 8GB is the max size known to work in all Siglent devices and some models don't like the cheapest USB stick.

I have reported this issue before and can again but not without the best and fullest info for engineers to reliably replicate it.
As it has not been properly addressed we cannot know if the problem is local (USB stick) or with the scope.


Currently I'm trying to convince Siglent to supply a USB stick with all instruments with manuals and SW applicable to that instrument like they do with the supplied CD in many parts of the world but not all I believe.

Then we would have a known to work uniform USB stick for users to also install firmware with and capture files to.
You might be amazed how few update their instruments firmware.

[tonycstech]

I confirmed.
Formatting to FAT32 with 4096bits cluster size makes the problem go away.
It is a scope issue, firmware to be specific, unable to handle different drives. Typical Chinese device problem.
I've seen this on security NVR systems. USB device wont work when booted with it plugged in, but will work if you unplug and plug it back in.


Also something is wrong with this forum.
When i click POST, it takes me somewhere else other then to a place where i just posted my reply.
It makes me confused and i go back to post again and again but it will not post anymore.
This is very strange.
Every forum in the world directs you to where you just posted.

[tautech]

I confirmed.
Formatting to FAT32 with 4096bits cluster size makes the problem go away.
It is a scope issue, firmware to be specific, unable to handle different drives. Typical Chinese device problem.
I've seen this on security NVR systems. USB device wont work when booted with it plugged in, but will work if you unplug and plug it back in.

Thank you. 

Also something is wrong with this forum.
When i click POST, it takes me somewhere else other then to a place where i just posted my reply.
It makes me confused and i go back to post again and again but it will not post anymore.
This is very strange.
Every forum in the world directs you to where you just posted.

This is easy fixed with a Profile setting.
Modify Profile>Look and Layout>Return to topics after posting by default<select.

[Hexley]

@tautech -
Hey Rob, any insight into when the factory might do another firmware release for the SDG1000X? There are a couple of outstanding issues that it would be nice to get resolved:

• Unexpected behavior when locked to an external reference. I just re-checked my unit and when set to 10 MHz it runs 173 mHz low when locked¹. This is for FW 1.01.01.33R1B6, btw.
• Unexpected behavior of the sweep mode (interaction with non-sweep settings). See https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/siglent-sdg1000x-waveform-generators/175/, post #199 for details and how to replicate.

Thanks,
Hexley

¹ Setup: the SDG1000X was locked to a GPSDO at 10 MHz. The same reference signal was fed to the counter, an HP 53131A, to ensure a common timebase. The SDG1000X was set to produce exactly 10 MHz and connected to the input of the counter which then read 9.999 999 827 MHz. As a cross check, the same setup was applied to a different AWG (KS33521B) and the counter read 10.000 000 000, as expected.

[Back2Volts]

I have a Siglent SPD3303-X-E.  I am wondering if I can hookup the negative of the fixed output, CH3, to the green/ground of the CH1/CH2, to have a three voltage power supply.  It seems like it would be an interesting feature, which I would like to make use of, but from the manual, I have not been able to determine if it is possible or not. 

Is this possible?

Edit:   I have got to the conclusion that it has to be possible because Siglent NA describe it as "3 independently controlled and isolated outputs".   So it should work without problems.

[profanum429]

I figured I'd ask here; I'm looking at the Siglent VNA cal kits and if I'm reading the datasheet right they are pretty much equivalent to the Agilent kits called out in there. I'm looking at the F603FE as a good economy kit so I was wondering if it came with known coefficients or touchstone files? I'm assuming it's supposed to be a copy of the 85033E kit? Just looking for some confirmation before I purchase since if I'd like to use in on more than just the SVA and I'd need to setup the kit elsewhere.

I suppose I could measure them all on a work VNA with a much better cal-kit and setup than my home SVA and use those Touchstone files as my data based standards, but I figured I'd see if they are characterized beforehand.

[tautech]

AFAIK Siglent Cal kits are made by Rosenberger as many of their HF coax cables are.
They are not supplied with any characterization data.

[profanum429]

AFAIK Siglent Cal kits are made by Rosenberger as many of their HF coax cables are.
They are not supplied with any characterization data.

Dang, that’s what I figured. Thanks! By any chance do you know if it’d be possible to pull the kit data off of the SVA? I’ve seen a vnacalkit directory on the machine but it seems to not have everything in it to cover all the kits on the machine and the data files that are there only go up to 1.5GHz so I feel like I’m not looking at the correct things.

[tautech]

AFAIK Siglent Cal kits are made by Rosenberger as many of their HF coax cables are.
They are not supplied with any characterization data.

Dang, that’s what I figured. Thanks! By any chance do you know if it’d be possible to pull the kit data off of the SVA? I’ve seen a vnacalkit directory on the machine but it seems to not have everything in it to cover all the kits on the machine and the data files that are there only go up to 1.5GHz so I feel like I’m not looking at the correct things.

IIRC you can but not in STP files like we've asked for. Each and every Cal can be saved internally to be recalled when needed for say a common cable/adapter setup you might use. They can all be named as you like.

If you do a Cal on the full sweep of the instrument that's what will be saved and a narrower sweep will only save that frequency settings. SVA have increased the data/sweep points from a previous max of 751 to 10001 although default is still just 200. We only change the points for speed vs accuracy depending on what we need.

[profanum429]

AFAIK Siglent Cal kits are made by Rosenberger as many of their HF coax cables are.
They are not supplied with any characterization data.

Dang, that’s what I figured. Thanks! By any chance do you know if it’d be possible to pull the kit data off of the SVA? I’ve seen a vnacalkit directory on the machine but it seems to not have everything in it to cover all the kits on the machine and the data files that are there only go up to 1.5GHz so I feel like I’m not looking at the correct things.

IIRC you can but not in STP files like we've asked for. Each and every Cal can be saved internally to be recalled when needed for say a common cable/adapter setup you might use. They can all be named as you like.

If you do a Cal on the full sweep of the instrument that's what will be saved and a narrower sweep will only save that frequency settings. SVA have increased the data/sweep points from a previous max of 751 to 10001 although default is still just 200. We only change the points for speed vs accuracy depending on what we need.

To follow this up, I'm apparently blind.

https://siglentna.com/wp-content/uploads/dlm_uploads/2021/04/Mechanical-Calibration-Kit-Datasheet-v1.4.pdf

has the coefficients for the Siglent kits (I swear I didn't see the last few pages last time I looked at it); the F603 kits seem to match the 85033E kits so I'm guessing manufactured to those tolerances. I ordered a F603FE kit yesterday and will have it hopefully early next week and I'll be measuring it on my TTR506A with a Maury cal kit to get some (hopefully) decent touchstone files to go along with it.

[oz2cpu]

is the SPD3303X designed specially poor ? when it comes to ESD or other unwanted unlucky hight voltage events
between the DC - AC - Chassis ??

yesterday i killed BOTH my SPD3303X due to an arc over event in the lab to mains.
and i mean it took me 9hrs tracking and replacing parts in them, that much was found dead so far,
List : TL072 shorted, 7815 shorted, Ethernet ic shorted, IRFP150 shorted, IC inside fan shorted,
4k7 in gate drive, and a 100nF cap in gatedrive shorted,
small signal pnp for gatedrive shorted, 6.3A fuses blown,

last thing to solve : ch3 output not going on, complex logic trying to trace the idea behind all the transistors, diodes and zeners involved in this,
one reason for it to be very complex is the LED control, it is a 2 pin led, 2 color, red green,
the green do go on when i push output enable, so signal from optocoupler is there, however no gate drive, to power board,
and the power board is confirmed working (the other unit works now 100%, so i got one to compare with)
any one with a schematic snip of the ch3 logic ?
picture attached, i need to know the part types of the four SOT23 devices,
otherwise i need to remove them one by one from my working unit to prove their function,
and then add what ever i feel fit the feature

[tautech]

i need to know the part types of the four SOT23 devices,

Silkscreen Pt#'s please.

[2N3055]

is the SPD3303X designed specially poor ? when it comes to ESD or other unwanted unlucky hight voltage events
between the DC - AC - Chassis ??

yesterday i killed BOTH my SPD3303X due to an arc over event in the lab to mains.
and i mean it took me 9hrs tracking and replacing parts in them, that much was found dead so far,
List : TL072 shorted, 7815 shorted, Ethernet ic shorted, IRFP150 shorted, IC inside fan shorted,
4k7 in gate drive, and a 100nF cap in gatedrive shorted,
small signal pnp for gatedrive shorted, 6.3A fuses blown,

last thing to solve : ch3 output not going on, complex logic trying to trace the idea behind all the transistors, diodes and zeners involved in this,
one reason for it to be very complex is the LED control, it is a 2 pin led, 2 color, red green,
the green do go on when i push output enable, so signal from optocoupler is there, however no gate drive, to power board,
and the power board is confirmed working (the other unit works now 100%, so i got one to compare with)
any one with a schematic snip of the ch3 logic ?
picture attached, i need to know the part types of the four SOT23 devices,
otherwise i need to remove them one by one from my working unit to prove their function,
and then add what ever i feel fit the feature

Tom,

I'm curious about that discharge.. I'm not sure I understand what the actual discharge current path was , and what was the energy.. What happened?

Best
Sinisa

[oz2cpu]

>Silkscreen Pt#'s please.
PCB is called SDY8.007.038H
SPD3303_150700
QC1 = unknown sot23, marking 2A and a 6 or 9 laying down
QC2 = QC3 = QC5 = QC6 = unknown sot23, marking 1AM>
cant find QC4 so that number maybe is not in use
UC5 = TL431 this one works
UC3 = TL072 ok changed that one
UC4 = TL072 did not change it yet
DC3,DC4,DC6 unknown diode
ZD702 unknown zener
ZD703 unknown zener

[oz2cpu]

>I'm curious about that discharge..

me too

>I'm not sure I understand what the actual discharge current path was ,

lets try investigate this

>and what was the energy.. What happened?

lets try to understand via this picture, geiger counter is powered from mains, but its metal case is not earth
power supply is correctly mains powered with 3 pin earth cable
the xray tube is not correctly isolated for the voltage, at least not then it is close to metal
so an arc over happened here.
at least that is my first guess..

the 2nd guess is there is something wrong inside the DC/DC converter, so an arc over inside that, could deliver 20kV back into its 9V dc input.

since the ethernet chip inside the powersuppæly was blown too,
and both ch1 and ch2 and ch3 power mosfets and all that was blown,
it is very likely the path was arround mains

rise times of arc is VERY fast

also i find no VDR or TVS or the likes in mains, or any DC outputs,
that means : what if "normal" ESD it discharged into any DC ports ?
will the same ? or a bit smaller damage happen ?
my bench is ESD safe, and i normally dont have ESD problems

I am aware that if the DC/DC contain any size of capacitor the charged 20kV could deliver a few kA current on its way
NO powersupply in the world would be able to survive that. it is CLEARLY my own user fault
and i am not here to blame Siglent.

But i would have been more happy if i have seen at least a little bit of over voltage / ESD / Surge / Burst protection parts

[tautech]

>Silkscreen Pt#'s please.
PCB is called SDY8.007.038H
SPD3303_150700
QC1 = unknown sot23, marking 2A and a 6 or 9 laying down
QC2 = QC3 = QC5 = QC6 = unknown sot23, marking 1AM>
cant find QC4 so that number maybe is not in use
UC5 = TL431 this one works
UC3 = TL072 ok changed that one
UC4 = TL072 did not change it yet
DC3,DC4,DC6 unknown diode
ZD702 unknown zener
ZD703 unknown zener

Further to your PM:
From PCB SDY8.007.038J SPD3303_200800 I have here:
QC1 2A with wide U or C on its side.
QC2 1AM with Y on its side
AFAIKT all MELF diodes will be something quite ordinary 4148 or similar.
MELF zeners at this time unknown.

I have cost request for this PCB to Siglent.
I will work with them for zener and MELF diode identification and SOT23 transistor confirmation.
Gimme another day or 2.....

[oz2cpu]

thanks a lot,
i was hoping for a part number :-)
but if we are going after the part marking, please see this closeup
anyone with a good idea ?