Products > Test Equipment
Suggestions for a good second-hand LA?
gslick:
--- Quote from: mbalmer on September 08, 2022, 11:45:16 pm ---It sounds like the most inexpensive option (at least from what I can make out) is to get an HP 16555D or 16557D, and get a set of cables to go with it. I’m having trouble finding either of those boards sold with their respective cables. Seems like people are parting things out.
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If you already have a fully functional 16702B, maybe I could set you up with a 16555A analyzer module with cables (two cables, breaking out to four 16-data-channel + 1-clock-channel PODs), but no flying lead sets, for not much more than the cost of shipping within the US. I could verify that the 16555A analyzer module currently passes all self tests. The 16555A is the 1M-sample version, the 16555D is the 2M-sample version. I have more 16555A logic analyzer modules than I will ever use at this point.
mbalmer:
--- Quote from: nctnico on September 09, 2022, 12:33:29 am ---$2k for a TLA715 is way too much. I'd start by lowballing at $250. See who bites. Many of the 'broken' ones simply miss the removable hard drive bay and thus won't boot. If the seller can show the display works with a boot error, all it takes is fitting an SSD in the internal bay and install the OS (Win2k). The removable hard drive bay is prone to poor contact anyway.
Next thing is the software: you can control the TLA700 series remotely buy running the software on your PC. It won't be any faster or slower compared to using the LA directly but having a bigger screen is way more comfortable. You'll need a mainframe with a network connection. You'll need a 10/100Mbit Cardbus (not PCI!) PCMCIA network adapter. IIRC my TLA715 even came with such an adapter.
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The mainframe options on eBay right now are pretty sparse. The ones that are sub-$300 are all very clearly not working or don't have an indication in the listing as to whether the system actually boots. I've messaged one seller about one that might be a candidate (it says "tested to power on" and the shots just show a backlit black screen). One mentions that it doesn't complete the boot process using WinXP instead of Win2K, which makes me think that it might be a viable candidate.
It also sounds like the LA modules for the Tek versions are generally less expensive for just as much capability -- it's the mainframes themselves that are the expensive portions.
--- Quote from: gslick on September 09, 2022, 12:36:46 am ---If you already have a fully functional 16702B, maybe I could set you up with a 16555A analyzer module with cables (two cables, breaking out to four 16-data-channel + 1-clock-channel PODs), but no flying lead sets, for not much more than the cost of shipping within the US. I could verify that the 16555A analyzer module currently passes all self tests. The 16555A is the 1M-sample version, the 16555D is the 2M-sample version. I have more 16555A logic analyzer modules than I will ever use at this point.
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I may just take you up on that, depending on how my search for a working 16717A plays out in the next few days. I've got one more replacement module coming, and if that doesn't work, I've found two 16557D boards that I might spring for, but I'm still REALLY leery of the corrosion thing, since I've been burned by five straight boards.
gslick:
--- Quote from: mbalmer on September 09, 2022, 02:15:35 am ---The mainframe options on eBay right now are pretty sparse. The ones that are sub-$300 are all very clearly not working or don't have an indication in the listing as to whether the system actually boots. I've messaged one seller about one that might be a candidate (it says "tested to power on" and the shots just show a backlit black screen). One mentions that it doesn't complete the boot process using WinXP instead of Win2K, which makes me think that it might be a viable candidate.
It also sounds like the LA modules for the Tek versions are generally less expensive for just as much capability -- it's the mainframes themselves that are the expensive portions.
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If you wanted to go the Tektronix route, one option is a TLA721 mainframe. Those can sometimes be found for less than a TLA715 mainframe, even with the more expensive shipping for a TLA721 mainframe. Of course the very large downside to a TLA721 mainframe is the very large size. If you don't have a lot of open bench space, a TLA721 mainframe would not be a great option.
Where are you located? I have a couple of Tektronix full-sized VXI mainframe logic analyzer chassis that I should get rid of cheaply, but they are not something that I have any interest in trying to ship.
Halberd:
I own and use both the 16702B and 16902A mentioned in the topic, as well as the 1672G.
I can't recommend anything since you didn't say what specs and features you need and what you use them for, but I can make a few comments.
--- Quote from: mbalmer on September 08, 2022, 02:07:22 am ---I've got an opportunity to get my hands on an Agilent 16902A that has a (potentially) faulty HDD -- the person selling it said that they can't test the logic analyzer module (a 16950B) because they can't get the system to start. Apparently, it blue-screens during the boot process. If that is indeed the case, that the thing just needs an OS reinstallation, would a unit like this be something more viable?
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My 16902A did not fail but to make it run a little faster, I replaced it with a new HDD and completely re-installed it and updated the LA application to the last release for use.
If you have the installation CD(with WindowsXP Key code) and only the HDD is broken, recovery is rather easy.
--- Quote from: mbalmer on September 08, 2022, 02:07:22 am ---I recently purchased an HP/Agilent 16702B without knowing about the (apparently) infamous corrosion issue due to the plastic runners used on the bottoms of the module boards.
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I have yet to obtain a module that does not work properly due to this problem, but I think this problem is rather an easy one to fix. I think this problem is rather easy to repair, since it can be determined to some extent by visual inspection and a tester.
I usually use the lowest spec 1672G for hobby use. Because it takes about 20 seconds from power on to use.
The 16702B should take about 4+ minutes and the 16902A about 2 minutes or less.
I bought a defective one, completely disassembled it, maintained it and used it, and the total cost of the three units(with some modules) was less than $1000.
mbalmer:
--- Quote from: gslick on September 09, 2022, 07:23:07 pm ---If you wanted to go the Tektronix route, one option is a TLA721 mainframe. Those can sometimes be found for less than a TLA715 mainframe, even with the more expensive shipping for a TLA721 mainframe. Of course the very large downside to a TLA721 mainframe is the very large size. If you don't have a lot of open bench space, a TLA721 mainframe would not be a great option.
Where are you located? I have a couple of Tektronix full-sized VXI mainframe logic analyzer chassis that I should get rid of cheaply, but they are not something that I have any interest in trying to ship.
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Joplin, MO. I am potentially willing to drive to pick up a unit, but it might have to wait until I get through some more of marching season (I'm a band director by profession).
--- Quote from: Halberd on September 09, 2022, 09:04:36 pm ---I own and use both the 16702B and 16902A mentioned in the topic, as well as the 1672G.
I can't recommend anything since you didn't say what specs and features you need and what you use them for, but I can make a few comments.
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Most of what I'm doing is diagnosing issues with 8-bit and 16-bit systems, and looking on the data/address buses of those systems along with serial and parallel bus spying. While I haven't done a larger bit depth system yet, there are some possibilities that I might later, so having the additional bandwidth to look will be helpful.
--- Quote from: Halberd on September 09, 2022, 09:04:36 pm ---My 16902A did not fail but to make it run a little faster, I replaced it with a new HDD and completely re-installed it and updated the LA application to the last release for use.
If you have the installation CD(with WindowsXP Key code) and only the HDD is broken, recovery is rather easy.
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I think I'm throwing in the towel on the 16902 simply because of the cost of the 90-pin flying lead sets (between $400 and $2,000 in varying states of completness?!?! :wtf: ), so as much as I'd like a module like that, it's a bit out of reach.
--- Quote from: Halberd on September 09, 2022, 09:04:36 pm ---I have yet to obtain a module that does not work properly due to this problem, but I think this problem is rather an easy one to fix. I think this problem is rather easy to repair, since it can be determined to some extent by visual inspection and a tester.
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Seriously?! Somehow, I've had a string of five of them all in various states of disrepair. Two of them outright say the module has failed upon boot, the other three all throw errors related either to the comparators or the VRAM. I'm trying to see if I can revive some of them, but considering that my experience with these boards is very limited, I am struggling to perform tests and then dig out issues.
--- Quote from: Halberd on September 09, 2022, 09:04:36 pm ---I usually use the lowest spec 1672G for hobby use. Because it takes about 20 seconds from power on to use.
The 16702B should take about 4+ minutes and the 16902A about 2 minutes or less.
I bought a defective one, completely disassembled it, maintained it and used it, and the total cost of the three units(with some modules) was less than $1000.
--- End quote ---
I don't mind the long power-up time -- what I do want, however, is something that can handle, at minimum, a 16-bit wide data bus (preferably a 32-bit bus or a 64-bit bus if I'm really lucky), along with associated address pins, chip selects, and such for diagnosing and watching data streams. Again, mainly for work on retro systems and consoles, but potentially as late as the PS3 or Dreamcast era in terms of watching data lines.
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