Author Topic: Teledyne LeCroy WaveRunner 64xi, morphed to differential probes...  (Read 43429 times)

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Online joeqsmith

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Re: Teledyne LeCroy WaveRunner 64xi
« Reply #100 on: June 20, 2018, 10:35:01 am »
Put the new SSD into the system and turned it on.  Boots fast.

The long term SSD test continues.  For something that was to be problematic, we are now well past the three year mark with the one SSD in the 64xi and a whopping four years on the 8500.  I have yet to see a file get corrupt.   Just a recap for the 64xi, I made no changes to the OS to try an increase the life of the drive.  Just mirrored the drive over and called it a day.   This is still my main scope.   

Also, the knobs are still tight!  lol.
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 
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Offline rsjsouza

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That is a great report, Joe. These SSDs are surely smart so they don't wear out that easily. Although I would inagine that a regular PC would be much more data intensive than the oscilloscope, thus being the worst case scenario for these drives.
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Online joeqsmith

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Good point.  I installed a SSD in my laptop maybe 5 years ago but it's not the primary drive.    When I finally retired my XP based P4 machine in 2016,  I used a 200G M.2 drive as the primary in the new PC.  It's too early to say but so far I have not seen any problems with it.   
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 

Offline rsjsouza

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I have five year-old Samsung 840 SSDs running on work laptops that do not show signs of wear - even with intensive embedded Linux and u-boot projects being built on them quite regularly for about three out of the five years.

Not SSDs, but I love the statistics put by these guys at:
https://www.backblaze.com/blog/hard-drive-stats-for-2017/


Vbe - vídeo blog eletrônico http://videos.vbeletronico.com

Oh, the "whys" of the datasheets... The information is there not to be an axiomatic truth, but instead each speck of data must be slowly inhaled while carefully performing a deep search inside oneself to find the true metaphysical sense...
 

Online joeqsmith

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I have five year-old Samsung 840 SSDs running on work laptops that do not show signs of wear - even with intensive embedded Linux and u-boot projects being built on them quite regularly for about three out of the five years.

Not SSDs, but I love the statistics put by these guys at:
https://www.backblaze.com/blog/hard-drive-stats-for-2017/

I am not aware of anyone I know in person running SSDs that has had problems.  They only seem to exist on the internet.  Larger sampling or typical internet regurgitating, hard to say.     I'm sure I am setting myself up for a massive SSD failure at home.   :-DD
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 

Offline rsjsouza

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I have five year-old Samsung 840 SSDs running on work laptops that do not show signs of wear - even with intensive embedded Linux and u-boot projects being built on them quite regularly for about three out of the five years.

Not SSDs, but I love the statistics put by these guys at:
https://www.backblaze.com/blog/hard-drive-stats-for-2017/

I am not aware of anyone I know in person running SSDs that has had problems.  They only seem to exist on the internet. Larger sampling or typical internet regurgitating, hard to say.     I'm sure I am setting myself up for a massive SSD failure at home.   :-DD
Well, if it's on the Internet it must be true, right? :)

I have the same feel sometimes... When things go too well... Murphy is at the corner waiting to strike!
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Oh, the "whys" of the datasheets... The information is there not to be an axiomatic truth, but instead each speck of data must be slowly inhaled while carefully performing a deep search inside oneself to find the true metaphysical sense...
 

Online joeqsmith

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I have five year-old Samsung 840 SSDs running on work laptops that do not show signs of wear - even with intensive embedded Linux and u-boot projects being built on them quite regularly for about three out of the five years.

Not SSDs, but I love the statistics put by these guys at:
https://www.backblaze.com/blog/hard-drive-stats-for-2017/

I am not aware of anyone I know in person running SSDs that has had problems.  They only seem to exist on the internet. Larger sampling or typical internet regurgitating, hard to say.     I'm sure I am setting myself up for a massive SSD failure at home.   :-DD
Well, if it's on the Internet it must be true, right? :)

I have the same feel sometimes... When things go too well... Murphy is at the corner waiting to strike!

I think sometimes people repost so much garbage that eventually everyone starts to believe it, only because of the shier number of posts.   :-DD

Because I have posted so many of my home made probes in this thread, I may as well continue....   

How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 

Offline tautech

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Just watched the diff probe vid Joe, great work and thanks for sharing.  :-+
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Online joeqsmith

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Re: Teledyne LeCroy WaveRunner 64xi, morphed differential probes...
« Reply #108 on: June 26, 2018, 12:16:02 pm »
Glad you enjoyed it.   If you do a search on this site, there are a few threads where people have attempted to make their own higher frequency higher voltage differential probes. 

During the video, I mentioned used two circuits.  One for the high frequency, the other for the DC and mixing the two.  This is not a new idea and may have merit for this design.
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 

Offline bson

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I am not aware of anyone I know in person running SSDs that has had problems.  They only seem to exist on the internet.  Larger sampling or typical internet regurgitating, hard to say.
It's just people who don't understand what the data retention spec refers to; it's the guaranteed minimum retention, at the end of a device's useful life.  It the retention guaranteed when it starts issuing SMART warnings.

https://www.micron.com/about/blogs/2015/may/addressing-data-retention-in-ssds

However, data retention specs are not given for a new device.  It is very important to note that published specifications for data retention describe the behavior of the device only at the end of its prescribed service life.

The JEDEC specification for data retention tells us that for enterprise storage devices, data retention at the end of the service life shall be at least three months (stored at 40°C).  For SSDs in the client computing market, data retention shall be at least one year after the drive’s service life (assuming it’s stored at 30°C).

 

Online joeqsmith

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I am not aware of anyone I know in person running SSDs that has had problems.  They only seem to exist on the internet.  Larger sampling or typical internet regurgitating, hard to say.
It's just people who don't understand what the data retention spec refers to; it's the guaranteed minimum retention, at the end of a device's useful life.  It the retention guaranteed when it starts issuing SMART warnings.
Could be.  If you take the time to read some of the early comments, one person was talking about a couple of weeks was all they were seeing.  But again, it's the internet.
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 

Online joeqsmith

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Re: Teledyne LeCroy WaveRunner 64xi, morphed to differential probes...
« Reply #111 on: July 05, 2018, 09:27:54 pm »
The parts for my next version of a differential probe arrived.  However,  I ran into a small setback and it will be a while until I can try building something up.  My plan is to still go ahead with the project in the next month or so.  Sorry for the delay.
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 

Offline rsjsouza

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Re: Teledyne LeCroy WaveRunner 64xi, morphed to differential probes...
« Reply #112 on: July 05, 2018, 09:37:47 pm »
You disappoint me, Joe. You talk about minor setbacks as if your house was struck by lightning...
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/hear-kitty-kitty-kitty-nope-not-that-kind-of-cat/msg1646627/#msg1646627
Vbe - vídeo blog eletrônico http://videos.vbeletronico.com

Oh, the "whys" of the datasheets... The information is there not to be an axiomatic truth, but instead each speck of data must be slowly inhaled while carefully performing a deep search inside oneself to find the true metaphysical sense...
 

Online joeqsmith

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Re: Teledyne LeCroy WaveRunner 64xi, morphed to differential probes...
« Reply #113 on: July 18, 2018, 11:31:39 pm »
It's been a mini marathon here the last few weeks.  I knew this new probe would not be very good starting out.  Its mostly made from parts I salvaged, which made for some poor choices in the design.   I assume the $130 MICSIG diff probe would out perform it in any test.    :-[   

https://youtu.be/0thOfk4I3qs







How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 
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Online joeqsmith

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Re: Teledyne LeCroy WaveRunner 64xi
« Reply #114 on: June 12, 2020, 06:52:43 pm »
Necroposting my own thread....

Someone was asking about this old scope so I dug up this thread and thought, it's been five years now that the SSD has been running in both the 64Xi and the 8500A.   Time for an update. 

I don't use the 8500A often but the 64Xi continues to be my primary scope and sees a fair amount of use.  I have not had a single problem with the two drives.

I recently went to use the 8500A and it came up with some musical song and an error about how it had overheated the last time it was used.   I was concerned that maybe the SSD was the problem but it was the battery for the NVRAM was all.   Installed a new battery,  reset the BIOS and it was back in business.   

I picked up an old VNA from around this same era and ended up buying a couple more of the Transcend drives for it as well.   That PC is running Windows 2000, compared with XP in the two LeCroys.  It's been in service for a few months now and is seeing a fair amount of use as well with no problems.   I wonder if these drives  are starting to become harder to find so I bought a few of them.  They were shipped direct from the factory.   
 
On the 8500A, I had installed a Gb Ethernet card which also seemed to raise some questions if it was going to cause problems.  After five years, again it seems to be fine. 



Had replaced the drive on the 8500A with an SSD.  It's been working very well.   I had bought two different ones to try.  One SATA one PATA.   The SATA with adapter went in the 8500A, the PATA is going into this system.  Different brand, we will see.

Just be careful with SSDs in that scope, as they tend to suffer from file system corruption (I tried several ones, including the Transcend PATA SSD on your picture), and all suffered from the same problem.

The reason seems to be that the SSDs only really support UDMA modes, which for PATA requires a 80 conductor cable to work reliably. The scope however uses a 44pin cable (there are no 84 conductor cables, at least I'm not aware of them) which is not really suited for UDMA66 or faster modes. Another forum user (Tunersandwich) who has the same scope made the same experience, he also tried a SSHD but that was a no-go either.

In the end I went back to spinning rust, i.e. a modern fast SATA laptop drive connected through a cheap SATA-PATA bridge. Works fine and absolutely reliable.

Quote
$7350 for the Rigol DS6064 or $9660 for the DS6104.  I assume this is the market LeCroy is going after.   

Not really. The WaveRunner Series starts quite a bit above that.

The WaveSurfer 3000 is the one that competes with the Rigol DS6000 scopes, although no-one really buys them anyways due to their poor value for money.
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 

Offline gbenyhe

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Re: Teledyne LeCroy WaveRunner 64xi, morphed to differential probes...
« Reply #115 on: June 13, 2020, 10:27:11 am »
Hi Joe,
Thanks for your pics and all, they are incredibly useful for me during the refurbishment of my own 64Xi. I am just repairing the broken standoffs on the front cover's backside. First I gently fix the broken parts together by carefully melting them with a soldering iron, then give it a prosthetic machined from textile bakelite glued on it with a two components resin.   
 

Online joeqsmith

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Re: Teledyne LeCroy WaveRunner 64xi, morphed to differential probes...
« Reply #116 on: June 13, 2020, 04:02:40 pm »
Hi Joe,
Thanks for your pics and all, they are incredibly useful for me during the refurbishment of my own 64Xi. I am just repairing the broken standoffs on the front cover's backside. First I gently fix the broken parts together by carefully melting them with a soldering iron, then give it a prosthetic machined from textile bakelite glued on it with a two components resin.

I highly suspect the same standoffs on mine are also broken as the whole front cover is dangling.  The thin strip of plastic along the outside edge continues to brake away.  I have thought about rebuilding my cover with fiberglass and filler but the scope has other mechanical problems as well.   I wonder if their new products are this bad.   Wife may not be to happy with me if I buy another scope.   :-DD
How electrically robust is your meter?? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsK99WXk9VhcghnAauTBsbg
 


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