Author Topic: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread  (Read 8008640 times)

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Offline vk6zgo

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107925 on: November 29, 2021, 12:13:15 am »
ICs? Who needs ICs for digital logic?

The divide-by-10 circuits in the 1965 Tek 184 use only 3 transistors. How do they do that? Having debugged mine, that's a rhetorical question!


Now I know TOO !  ;D

What a coincidence/timing, look what me just got !
Some old junk to please Tautech !  :-DD

An old Nixie counter, and no IC in there either, here too they used discrete trannies everywhere to do all the counting decoding or anything really.

Lucky me, for a change I was able to find a service manual. A rare occurrence for all these old French instrumentation companies. A nice manual at that, 20+ pages, in good resolution, with all the info you would want. So I attached the schematic for the decade boards/Nixie drivers, just because I love you. 5 identical boards of course, because 5 Nixies in this thing. First / fastest two decade boards have an identical design and layout as the 3 slower ones, all they did was use different transistor models.

As we can see there are 18 transistors on each decade board. 8 transistors was enough for them to implement the 4 bit counter. A pair of 2 transistors for each bit.
Then for the BCD decoding and driving of the Nixie, it's combined apparently, they use only one transistor per digit, so 10 transistors.

Note how funky looking the transistor symbol is, never seen them drawn like this before !  :o


Anyway this one popped up here right after I bought that tiny Minitron counter, I don't choose timing, things pop up when they do...  just so happens to have two nice things in a row... probably means I won't see anything worthwhile for a year now !  :-//


So, it's an old Nixie counter, from 1965, made by " Rochar " , short lived small French company (quickly bought and killed by Schlumberger, like they did with ADRET and Enertec and god knows who else).

5 digits, good for 2.2MHz it says in the manual, can't even test that, my old sig gen only goes to 1MHz !  :-//

It's a full featured counter, a universal counter, not a basic minimalist frequency counter like the Minitron I just bought.
Heavy and oozes build quality when you look at it and play with it. Thick aluminium face plate, engraved. Weighs a lot more than its looks might suggest. 6+ kg IIRC.
Counter is in tip top shape ! Excellent cosmetic condition inside out, no rust and barely a speck of dust inside.
Bright work in good shape except as usual for the old silver plated BNC connectors of that era... silver tarnished nothing you can do about it... so will need replacing with more modern BNC.
All Nixies work perfectly, very bright and even brightness.
Did a quick basic check, just measuring frequency, did not try all the other features, will see later.
--> it works ! All those Nixies come to life and dance around to show me something.... though not quite what I expected...displayed frequency is, looks like, half of what it should be ! No worries.. decades boards are fine, must just be a failed frequency divider in the time base circuitry.... with 150 Germanium trannies in there, that's a lot of potential tin whiskers !!!  :-DD
It's a miracle this counter can work at all really... I am not complaining.

Anyway, I had to tear it down right from the start because it uses a weird obsolete power socket, so I tried to get inside to solder a cable somewhere, just temporarily, to test it. No joy. spent half an hour taking it apart, removing bits and pieces of the chassis, a decade board, all the nixies and the bezel that keeps them aligned, a  big bracket/gusset... only to realize that would only get me so far... but not far enough to solder a cable. So gave up and put it all back together again.

Well, at least it let me see how the thing is put together, check for its internal condition, and take pics for you, and for my archives.
So next time I get in there, I will know what awaits me.

Then when putting the face plate back on, one of the screws refused to "bite"... so left it out. No way I was going through the chore of taking this all apart and back again (it's a major PITA).. again, just to see what was wrong with that screw. They are tiny Philips head screws that suck big time. Most are in bad shape and even when in good shape it's all too easy to damage them, you have to apply so much force and pray so much that you won't damage the heads and that the screw will be kind enough to come loose... no. I hate these screws ! So I don't care for this "missing" screw as I think I will replace all of them with new screws with a different head style. I don't know, BTR maybe.


As for the power socket, it is long obsolete, I am 44 and it's the first time I see one like that. Old man said it was used for power hungry domestic appliances.. in the '60s. I was born in 77... yes I am just a kiddy sorry.
Don't want to spend a year, money and time getting (if at all possible...) the matching obsolete power cord... and don't want to have X bits of kit each requiring their own weird cord so... will be retrofitting a standard IEC socket. This is quite an undertaking.. will have to take this thing apart again, remove all the bits I already removed.. and 3 times more so I can actually work on this thing to fit the new socket.  But well, no choice... otherwise I can't use this thing, and I DO want to use it, I am in love already. Might not show in pictures but it's such a cool looking piece in the flesh.

What's more ? When I got it... the amber colour filter in front of the Nixie tubes... had fallen off ! It appears it was held in place merely by some strips of foam all around the edges of the filter, pushing/pressing the filter onto the back side of the face plate... that's it ! Of course with time the foam as always, disintegrated completely so the filter was completely loose inside the cabinet... You can see the remains of that foam on the pictures... that disgusting looking brown-ish stuff...

This is now fixed already ! By some miracle I happened to have some foamy rubbery sticky "tape", of an appropriate thickness, 2mm or something I don't know, lucky me ! Cut some strips to size, got rid of the old foam, sticked the new foam into place... problem solved !
Being rubbery as well as foamy, it will give a grip on the filter, on its own, on top of the basic pushing-against-the-face-plate action, so should be good !  8)

Anyway, so to sum it up, a pristine and lovely bit of kit I am delighted to have !  :D with the following to do when it's turn comes :

- Replace all the crappy philips screws holding the face plate, with a less rage producing screw type.
- Fit an IEC socket
- Troubleshoot and hopefully fix the time base issue so it can display the actual input frequency, rather than just half of it...
- Might add a web server with logging and remote control capabilities, to please Tautech ?

Attaching a few piccies...


Those funny looking transistor symbols were "the latest & greatest" in the early 1960s, & some early adopters got their fingers burned when they went with them.
One such was the Oz electronics mag "Electronics Australia", who adopted them whole-heartedly, only to have to backpedal a while later, when they realised they "went over like a wrought iron hanglider" in industry.

Your frequency counter is only the second time that I saw them used in a commercially produced schematic.
The other was when I had to read the schematic of a device produced by "Commonwealth Electronics" for our old aviation regulator, as part of the old "Broadcast Operator's Certificate of Prpficiency" practical test.

I think they kept it as "a trap for young players"----but I was an "old player!" 8)
 
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Offline vk6zgo

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107926 on: November 29, 2021, 12:43:31 am »
Oh how the mighty have fallen! :'(

They had a monopoly at a time when all German state broadcasters (there were no commercial stations) had to be fitted from scratch for b/w and then in 1967 for colour tv. This clearly couldn't go on forever.

It wasn't only them. Mostly all German makers of broadcast equipment were living in a land where milk and honey flowed in endless abundance. The stations had money 'like hay', as we say here. Only the best was good enough and discussing prices was just not done.

This changed with the arrival of commercial broadcasters who, by their very nature, had to be cost-conscious. Most of the great old names didn't survive the next decade.

They were, however, very good!

I thought, from looking at video test signals from our rack mounted Marconi generator, that the drawn waveforms in textbooks were fanciful, & "real life" waveforms were a bit "grottier"-----until I saw the output of a Fernseh PGM75!

It looked "close enough to the drawing, that they could kiss without sin".
It wasn't until we got Tek 148 generators that anything matched the PGM 75 for accuracy!


https://www.radiomuseum.org/r/fernseh_pruefsignalgeber_pgm_75_e.html

Fernseh was very widely used in Oz, including by commercial stations.
Like most European stuff, they were difficult to work on, but their old stuff was so reliable, that was rarely a problem.

In their later, "Bosch" incarnation, they seemed to have lost their way, with dumb "clever" ideas, like using the fold out hinges on boards of a picture monitor as connectors.
"Blind Freddy" could have foreseen disaster------& disaster, it was!
Sony used cheap plastic hinges (which were easily "bodged" if they broke), & ribbon cable with connectors!

Bosch made some very nice, if "maintenance heavy" Studio VTRs in that period, but failed to see the direction the industry was going, so again, got "steamrollered" by Sony!



« Last Edit: November 29, 2021, 01:07:51 am by vk6zgo »
 

Offline beanflying

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107927 on: November 29, 2021, 12:44:29 am »
Worth following along for those who passed up the opportunity to buy a dirt cheap MEGA Anchor/Calibrator @med  :-DD and anyone else who looks at AC Calibrators and goes not worth it for the $ or the space.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/metrology/an-experimental-ac-voltage-calibrator/?topicseen
Coffee, Food, R/C and electronics nerd in no particular order. Also CNC wannabe, 3D printer and Laser Cutter Junkie and just don't mention my TEA addiction....
 
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Offline vk6zgo

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107928 on: November 29, 2021, 12:58:47 am »

Seems the "no power supply for it" as they call it is due to the old Bulgin mains connector, I'm guessing the power lead was either missing, or the seller decided it looked unsafe.  :-//
Even the RS catalog from 1984 states certain types of both sizes of Bulgin connector, with the cover that can be removed without tools, are only rated for 50V unless inaccessible.  >:D
If only those sellers on ePay knew this, selling those connectors at silly prices for old amps and other equipment.  :palm:


David

Mouser and RS still stock the cable connector; it's called PX0631. Still lots of dire warnings about it being a piece of shit connector on the catalog pages.  :-DD

I know, because I bought one for my Solartron DVM.

A sensible price is about €4 plus VAT. Anything above that is extortion.

They always sucked--especially as compared to Oz domestic plugs of the late 1950s/early '60s, which were already often PVC, with the tortuous path to prevent the wires pulling out.

The silly thing about the "Bulgin" connector, was that there was no reason why it couldn't have been re-engineered to be a much safer device.
A similar thing with the "Belling Lee" coax connectors---a bit of re-engineering, & they would probably still be mainstream.

Greed, hubris, or both, on the part of the manufacturers led to market share loss
 

Offline cyclin_al

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107929 on: November 29, 2021, 01:10:31 am »
Heh... that logo looks so nefarious, like something out of The Prisoner...  :-DD

An eye with wings. Isn't that what tele-vision is all about? ;-)
LOL... grand-dad usedta call such logos and signage "eyeball thieves", as they were designed to steal your attention away involuntarily from what you needed to be doing. ;)

mnem
 :P

My Dad and all the Grandparents called them the Boob-tube.  You became a boob if you watched too much toob...  :horse:
 
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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107930 on: November 29, 2021, 01:15:43 am »
Worth following along for those who passed up the opportunity to buy a dirt cheap MEGA Anchor/Calibrator @med  :-DD and anyone else who looks at AC Calibrators and goes not worth it for the $ or the space.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/metrology/an-experimental-ac-voltage-calibrator/?topicseen
Done it for a transfer standard to set up a portable test jig easily 30 years ago. Used a old Pioneer receiver with a blown channel; the other channel worked a treat.

I seriously don't see why anyone would be surprised that it works...?

mnem
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Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107931 on: November 29, 2021, 01:36:13 am »

.....snip

It seems there are quite a lot of such bulldust merchants around----I remember some allegedly ex-Tektronix guys trying to tell us that the seriously dire Tek 650 series of picture monitors were really "all made by Sony!'.

Funny thing, they all had "Beaverton , Oregon" all over them!

They might have been partially correct. Sony learned a lot from Tek on CRT manufacturing and applied that to the development of the Trinitron CRT. It's possible that those monitors had a Trinitron CRT but were still built in Beaverton.

Here is one of those Tek picture monitors I saw last week but forgot to post, didn't sell at 99 euros, no idea if it's a Sony or not.
https://www.ebay.de/itm/275037647046


Not sure I would want to touch anything Sony TV related from the 1970's, after watching the recent Shango066 video.

David

Judging by the "squareness" of the CRT it has the look of a Trinitron. I'd be very surprised if it wasn't.

That was my reaction when I saw the photo, and isn't there some sort of tie up between Tek and Sony anyway?
Who let Murphy in?

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Offline vk6zgo

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107932 on: November 29, 2021, 01:45:42 am »

.....snip

It seems there are quite a lot of such bulldust merchants around----I remember some allegedly ex-Tektronix guys trying to tell us that the seriously dire Tek 650 series of picture monitors were really "all made by Sony!'.

Funny thing, they all had "Beaverton , Oregon" all over them!

They might have been partially correct. Sony learned a lot from Tek on CRT manufacturing and applied that to the development of the Trinitron CRT. It's possible that those monitors had a Trinitron CRT but were still built in Beaverton.

Here is one of those Tek picture monitors I saw last week but forgot to post, didn't sell at 99 euros, no idea if it's a Sony or not.
https://www.ebay.de/itm/275037647046


Not sure I would want to touch anything Sony TV related from the 1970's, after watching the recent Shango066 video.

David
I wouldn't take Shango 066 as a guide---like many other "youtubers" he is a legend in his own lunchbox!"

I looked up the video, got about 2m30s into it & gave up, as his diagnosis technique is so painful.

The fault report says "no HT" (presumably they mean "EHT").
A sneaky trick is to turn on the TV, put your forearm close to the screen (the outside part), & if the EHT is coming on, the hairs on your arm will be attracted to the screen.

If they just flick out, then return, you may have a failed Horiz o/p device, but if they stay out, you haven't lost EHT, but have another fault (just one of the tricks you develop after fixing stuff for a living!)

I vaguely remember fixing a similar set with the SG264A, but happily that device was OK.

Most of the Sony stuff I fixed just used ordinary BJTs in that position, & were, if not super easy, reasonably so.
I avoided Philips "K" series stuff, Sharp weren't bad, neither were Sanyo, or National/Panasonic.

One weird thing about Sony is the number of different SMPS they used---Sanyo, on the other hand, kept the same design for decades!
Convergence of a Trinitron is a dream, compared to "Delta gun" tubes!

Unfortunately, the "direness" of the Tek 650 series was in the stuff they sourced, not the Trinitron tube & accessories---Sony used the same display bits in their BVM1301, which was "reliable as old boots".




 

Offline cyclin_al

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107933 on: November 29, 2021, 02:22:10 am »
....
It started off okay, with creating an installation USB and doing the install of Ubuntu 20.04.
However, there was no networking.  Eventually discovered that there is no driver for the on-board Ethernet.
....

OK, I just need to know this, which Ethernet card doesn't have a Linux driver in 2021, I'm fiddling with Linux practically from the beginning and I never encountered such a beast, including the time when Linux was a bunch of floppies and the Gigabit cards were strange beasts. Some crappy scanner, mouse with 100 buttons, or miserable GDI printer, sure, but network card, never.

Could you kindly please do a lspci command in a terminal and paste it here or just tell the model of the card or which mobo was if it's an embedded card ?

Thanks,
DC1MC

The offending device is the Realtek RTL8125 series.  In my case, it is on an ASRock B550 Steel Legend motherboard.

It took all of a few seconds to find the driver itself:
https://www.realtek.com/en/component/zoo/category/network-interface-controllers-10-100-1000m-gigabit-ethernet-pci-express-software

The problem is getting all the dependencies onto a machine that is offline.

I get stuck searching with commands that do not generate a list for automation of the downloads:

Code: [Select]
sudo apt-get -qq --print-uris install build-essential linux-headers-$(uname -r) | cut -d\' -f 2 > urls.txt
Code: [Select]
sudo apt-get -y install --print-uris build-essential | cut -d\' -f2 | grep http:// > apturls
My other machine that is online just responds with a message that it is fully updated and does not generate the needed list.
This is the stage where my LINUX-foo lacks to be able to modify the command with the appropriate arguments to generate the list anyways.

IMO wired Ethernet is the better choice over WLAN. WLAN dongles might need firmware that isn't included e.g. in the free Debian installers.

Thanks for the warning.  The dongle I just ordered, if it has that issue, puts me right back where I am now (unless their firmware does not have dependencies).

The end-state goal is to use the onboard 2.5 Gbit wired ethernet.  WLAN as a temporary solution to perform the install/updates has got potential; I just need to get the dongle (hopefully tomorrow).
 

Online Neomys Sapiens

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107934 on: November 29, 2021, 02:51:39 am »
Rochar Nixie Counter follow-up : FIXED !  :D

I know, I am quick , but I am genius so it was to be expected eh ?!   ^-^

No.... operator error of course ! That counter works just fine, it's the operator that needs fixing !  :-DD

I should have RTFM instead of just fiddling randomly with the knobs, impatient that I was   ::)

It's not very intuitive for youngster like me. There is no explcit and obvious knob to set frequency range, nor any unit indicator on the display, never mind a decimal point...

...snip



Well of course you had problems understanding the control functions.......it's all in French.  :P :P :P :-DD :-DD
Ces't un appareil pour déterminer la fréquence dans le Phoen!
 

Online Neomys Sapiens

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107935 on: November 29, 2021, 03:12:51 am »
I found the problem with the hp 8904A keys. A ribbon cable connecting the front PCB to the top PCB in the main chassis. I re-seated all the cables at first but the problem didn't go away. It did change a bit in that some keys that were not working before started to, and some that were - stopped working. So I was onto to something. Then I bet the money on J1. I remembered looking at it that I wasn't very impressed with the choice of cable connector when I took the whole thing apart after I first got it.

I have never seen that selection of cable and connector in any other hp gear - have any of you? I don't know how the end with the pins was made, it doesn't look like an end connector that you could make a direct replacement for at home. Looks like it was fabricated at the connector factory and shipped to hp ... ? Anyway it may have been the first and last time it was used by hp, and for good reason.

Anyway, I pulled the connector for the second time, and cleaned it with alcohol, and wiped with some contact enhancer, and the second time it was fixed.

The hp 8804A Multifunction Synthesizer is an interesting bit of kit though. It has four channels internally - each one can be set up to generate a certain waveform (freq,. amplitude, phase, and type (sine, square, noise, etc.). Then these channels can be combined together internally to make any sort of output you want. In fact, had to glance back at the operations manual to remember how to get it going after three years. The fact that only some keys were not working made me think I was not doing things the way it wanted. Pic shows sine and square wave with noise intentionally added.
An useful device. But those cables play the main role in every repair report of it. And it is only that fancy if you get the maximum configuration.
 
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Online Neomys Sapiens

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107936 on: November 29, 2021, 03:22:09 am »
Oh how the mighty have fallen! :'(

They had a monopoly at a time when all German state broadcasters (there were no commercial stations) had to be fitted from scratch for b/w and then in 1967 for colour tv. This clearly couldn't go on forever.

It wasn't only them. Mostly all German makers of broadcast equipment were living in a land where milk and honey flowed in endless abundance. The stations had money 'like hay', as we say here. Only the best was good enough and discussing prices was just not done.

This changed with the arrival of commercial broadcasters who, by their very nature, had to be cost-conscious. Most of the great old names didn't survive the next decade.
I remember having repaired a lot of monitors from them for a little TV studio. They were big ugly B&W  fuckers and it was always the same transistor which died. IIRC an MJ900 or MJ901.
 
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Online med6753

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107937 on: November 29, 2021, 03:30:41 am »

.....snip

It seems there are quite a lot of such bulldust merchants around----I remember some allegedly ex-Tektronix guys trying to tell us that the seriously dire Tek 650 series of picture monitors were really "all made by Sony!'.

Funny thing, they all had "Beaverton , Oregon" all over them!

They might have been partially correct. Sony learned a lot from Tek on CRT manufacturing and applied that to the development of the Trinitron CRT. It's possible that those monitors had a Trinitron CRT but were still built in Beaverton.

Here is one of those Tek picture monitors I saw last week but forgot to post, didn't sell at 99 euros, no idea if it's a Sony or not.
https://www.ebay.de/itm/275037647046


Not sure I would want to touch anything Sony TV related from the 1970's, after watching the recent Shango066 video.

David

Judging by the "squareness" of the CRT it has the look of a Trinitron. I'd be very surprised if it wasn't.

That was my reaction when I saw the photo, and isn't there some sort of tie up between Tek and Sony anyway?

Yes. In order for Tek to sell equipment in Japan they had to team up with a Japanese company who just happen to be Sony. And there are Sony/Tektronix branded scopes.

https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/335
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Online Neomys Sapiens

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107938 on: November 29, 2021, 03:37:26 am »
Meets quite a few criteria,
Test equipment tick
Nixie tube tick
Ham related tick
It works tick
Happy camper here

Does need sl weird power supply (220v, we have 240v and with all the solar feed in, it often hits 250v)

West Oz used to be 250v, & plenty of devices with supposedly lower voltage ratings operated merrily for decades.

As factory has pointed out, the thing has adjustable transformer primary taps.
A "234" volt setting will operate ok on 250v "till the cows come home".
Immediately I envisage some content operator in front of his equipment, until a loud 'MOOOO' is heard from the window. In the same moment an evil flash, smoldering sound and thick smoke emanates from the rear of some device!
« Last Edit: November 29, 2021, 03:41:46 am by Neomys Sapiens »
 
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Online Neomys Sapiens

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107939 on: November 29, 2021, 03:54:42 am »
The new one, IIRC, is Siemens.

As we say in Germany:

Wollen Sie Siemens oder darf es was ordentliches sein?
(Do you want Siemens oder rather something decent?)

alternatively:

Wollen Sie Siemens oder soll es funktionieren?
(Do you want Siemens or will it have to work?)
Report sent to Erlangen.
 
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Offline DC1MC

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107940 on: November 29, 2021, 06:21:38 am »
...
The offending device is the Realtek RTL8125 series.  In my case, it is on an ASRock B550 Steel Legend motherboard.
...

"Ubuntu 21.04 wird der RTL8125 nativ vom Kernel 5.10.x unterstützt."


In this version of French that is not used too much in Canada  >:D, it tells us that the Ubuntu 21.04 supports natively the  chip and if you don't have special reasons for to install another Ubuntu version, I would go with this one, making the updates a bit easier.

Also kernel series 5.10 is ancient, I'm always amazed why the desktop distributions are not a bit more agile with the kernel and libraries, but this a whole other can of bird seeds.

Cheers,
DC1MC
 
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Offline Zoli

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107941 on: November 29, 2021, 06:29:38 am »
...
The offending device is the Realtek RTL8125 series.  In my case, it is on an ASRock B550 Steel Legend motherboard.
...

"Ubuntu 21.04 wird der RTL8125 nativ vom Kernel 5.10.x unterstützt."


In this version of French that is not used too much in Canada  >:D, it tells us that the Ubuntu 21.04 supports natively the  chip and if you don't have special reasons for to install another Ubuntu version, I would go with this one, making the updates a bit easier.

Also kernel series 5.10 is ancient, I'm always amazed why the desktop distributions are not a bit more agile with the kernel and libraries, but this a whole other can of bird seeds.

Cheers,
DC1MC
Hmmm....
....
It started off okay, with creating an installation USB and doing the install of Ubuntu 20.04.
However, there was no networking.  Eventually discovered that there is no driver for the on-board Ethernet.
....
Looks like DC1MC's French is more advanced, always ahead with one :-DD :-DD :-DD
 
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Offline mansaxel

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107942 on: November 29, 2021, 08:15:01 am »
The end-state goal is to use the onboard 2.5 Gbit wired ethernet.  WLAN as a temporary solution to perform the install/updates has got potential; I just need to get the dongle (hopefully tomorrow).
  • My snarky answer is to upgrade to OpenBSD, whose "rge" driver is in kernel and has support for the card in question.
  • My technically relevant answer is the you oughta install "apt-rdepends" which is a command I just discovered that lists the dependencies of a package. The dependencies of apt-rdepends are:
Code: [Select]
apt-rdepends
  Depends: libapt-pkg-perl (>= 0.1.11)
  Depends: perl:any
libapt-pkg-perl
  Depends: libapt-pkg6.0 (>= 2.1.20)
  Depends: libc6 (>= 2.14)
  Depends: libgcc-s1 (>= 3.0)
  Depends: perl
  Depends: perlapi-5.32.1
<snip>

Then, this list can be used thusly:

Code: [Select]
apt-rdepends apt-rdepends  | \
awk '/Depends/ {
      pkgs[$2]++;
      };
      END {
            for (pkg in pkgs) {
                 print pkg;
            };
};' | \
while read pkg ; do
     apt-get download ${pkg} ;
done
    This can be used to create a stash of packages in the current directory, that then can be sneakernetted to the relevant computer.
    [/li]
  • The practical answer is to download a newer release of the operating system to a USB stick and install that.


Remember that "Ubuntu" is zulu for "I can't install Devuan."  :-DD :-DD :-DD
 

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107943 on: November 29, 2021, 08:41:17 am »
[...]

Remember that "Ubuntu" is zulu for "I can't install Devuan."  :-DD :-DD :-DD
Installing the Devuan is not the problem, running with it is (for me at least). As an "unlucky one" that has come to Linux only after the "poettering apocalypse" - I know nothing else.
I can make a easily comprehensible, human readable, start "script" to have something autostart on a Debian (or anything that runs the dreaded systemd) -
but on devuan, looking into how one might do it, it leads to a whole rabbit hole of tools and references. (And this is just the first thing I was defeated by that came to mind)
As someone who still relies heavily on google to get around doing stuff on linux (and it's not like it is too easy anway) straying too far from the guarded path leads only to despair...
« Last Edit: November 29, 2021, 08:45:35 am by ch_scr »
 
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Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107944 on: November 29, 2021, 09:02:29 am »

.....snip

It seems there are quite a lot of such bulldust merchants around----I remember some allegedly ex-Tektronix guys trying to tell us that the seriously dire Tek 650 series of picture monitors were really "all made by Sony!'.

Funny thing, they all had "Beaverton , Oregon" all over them!

They might have been partially correct. Sony learned a lot from Tek on CRT manufacturing and applied that to the development of the Trinitron CRT. It's possible that those monitors had a Trinitron CRT but were still built in Beaverton.

Here is one of those Tek picture monitors I saw last week but forgot to post, didn't sell at 99 euros, no idea if it's a Sony or not.
https://www.ebay.de/itm/275037647046


Not sure I would want to touch anything Sony TV related from the 1970's, after watching the recent Shango066 video.

David

Judging by the "squareness" of the CRT it has the look of a Trinitron. I'd be very surprised if it wasn't.

That was my reaction when I saw the photo, and isn't there some sort of tie up between Tek and Sony anyway?

Yes. In order for Tek to sell equipment in Japan they had to team up with a Japanese company who just happen to be Sony. And there are Sony/Tektronix branded scopes.

https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/335
Oh I see, they are still 2 separate companies but use an association with Sony to access the Japanese market.
Who let Murphy in?

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107945 on: November 29, 2021, 09:28:30 am »
Not exactly fun with TEA here, but I've had some fun building a simple transistor test adapter for the Tek 577:

Nothing to tell your mother about, just using stuff that was readily available in the stash. No PCB layout, just perfboard, no fancy white solder mask with black silkscreen, just a printed piece of paper.






« Last Edit: November 29, 2021, 09:30:07 am by capt bullshot »
Safety devices hinder evolution
 
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107946 on: November 29, 2021, 09:55:38 am »

.....snip

It seems there are quite a lot of such bulldust merchants around----I remember some allegedly ex-Tektronix guys trying to tell us that the seriously dire Tek 650 series of picture monitors were really "all made by Sony!'.

Funny thing, they all had "Beaverton , Oregon" all over them!

They might have been partially correct. Sony learned a lot from Tek on CRT manufacturing and applied that to the development of the Trinitron CRT. It's possible that those monitors had a Trinitron CRT but were still built in Beaverton.

Here is one of those Tek picture monitors I saw last week but forgot to post, didn't sell at 99 euros, no idea if it's a Sony or not.
https://www.ebay.de/itm/275037647046


Not sure I would want to touch anything Sony TV related from the 1970's, after watching the recent Shango066 video.

David

Judging by the "squareness" of the CRT it has the look of a Trinitron. I'd be very surprised if it wasn't.

If the screen is only curved horizontally, high chance it is a Sony Trinitron tube.
 
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107947 on: November 29, 2021, 10:33:12 am »

.....snip

It seems there are quite a lot of such bulldust merchants around----I remember some allegedly ex-Tektronix guys trying to tell us that the seriously dire Tek 650 series of picture monitors were really "all made by Sony!'.

Funny thing, they all had "Beaverton , Oregon" all over them!

They might have been partially correct. Sony learned a lot from Tek on CRT manufacturing and applied that to the development of the Trinitron CRT. It's possible that those monitors had a Trinitron CRT but were still built in Beaverton.

Here is one of those Tek picture monitors I saw last week but forgot to post, didn't sell at 99 euros, no idea if it's a Sony or not.
https://www.ebay.de/itm/275037647046


Not sure I would want to touch anything Sony TV related from the 1970's, after watching the recent Shango066 video.

David

Judging by the "squareness" of the CRT it has the look of a Trinitron. I'd be very surprised if it wasn't.

That was my reaction when I saw the photo, and isn't there some sort of tie up between Tek and Sony anyway?

Yes. In order for Tek to sell equipment in Japan they had to team up with a Japanese company who just happen to be Sony. And there are Sony/Tektronix branded scopes.

https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/335

Same deal with HP/Yokogawa.
They also swapped products between each other too, an easy way to expand your product portfolio.
Where does all this test equipment keep coming from?!?

https://www.youtube.com/user/NearFarMedia/
 

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107948 on: November 29, 2021, 10:45:16 am »

.....snip

It seems there are quite a lot of such bulldust merchants around----I remember some allegedly ex-Tektronix guys trying to tell us that the seriously dire Tek 650 series of picture monitors were really "all made by Sony!'.

Funny thing, they all had "Beaverton , Oregon" all over them!

They might have been partially correct. Sony learned a lot from Tek on CRT manufacturing and applied that to the development of the Trinitron CRT. It's possible that those monitors had a Trinitron CRT but were still built in Beaverton.

Here is one of those Tek picture monitors I saw last week but forgot to post, didn't sell at 99 euros, no idea if it's a Sony or not.
https://www.ebay.de/itm/275037647046


Not sure I would want to touch anything Sony TV related from the 1970's, after watching the recent Shango066 video.

David

Judging by the "squareness" of the CRT it has the look of a Trinitron. I'd be very surprised if it wasn't.

That was my reaction when I saw the photo, and isn't there some sort of tie up between Tek and Sony anyway?

Yes. In order for Tek to sell equipment in Japan they had to team up with a Japanese company who just happen to be Sony. And there are Sony/Tektronix branded scopes.

https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/335

Same deal with HP/Yokogawa.
They also swapped products between each other too, an easy way to expand your product portfolio.

Correct. But the real driving factor is Japan's very restrictive policies concerning foreign companies doing business there. 
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #107949 on: November 29, 2021, 01:34:42 pm »
[...]

Remember that "Ubuntu" is zulu for "I can't install Devuan."  :-DD :-DD :-DD
Installing the Devuan is not the problem, running with it is (for me at least). As an "unlucky one" that has come to Linux only after the "poettering apocalypse" - I know nothing else.
I can make a easily comprehensible, human readable, start "script" to have something autostart on a Debian (or anything that runs the dreaded systemd) -
but on devuan, looking into how one might do it, it leads to a whole rabbit hole of tools and references. (And this is just the first thing I was defeated by that came to mind)
As someone who still relies heavily on google to get around doing stuff on linux (and it's not like it is too easy anway) straying too far from the guarded path leads only to despair...
"Devuan" is *NIX-nerd for "I need my daily dose of      !"    >:D

mnem
Okay, I admit it... I'm still a wannabe *NIX-nerd... :-[
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