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Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

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Specmaster:

--- Quote from: BravoV on June 02, 2018, 05:50:14 pm ---
--- Quote from: Specmaster on June 02, 2018, 02:27:56 pm ---Totally disagree, its not a weak argument, so your saying that Dave's advice is also flawed in the same way, he has done a series of scope videos showing how to connect them without blowing the arse out of them which is a typically a thing a beginner might do. I'm not saying that someone a bit more experienced wouldn't to, hell we can all screw up from time to time.
--- End quote ---

Still, are you saying when a noob that going to get their 1st scope, its the "right" way to get the cheap 10 or 20 bucks used analog scope 1st, not the new affordable DSO even they can afford it ? Learn, and once they blew it, thats for sure according to you, then buy the new DSO.

Thats fine if its what you believe is the right path.



--- Quote from: Specmaster on June 02, 2018, 02:27:56 pm ---I liken it to just passing your driving test and we all know that does not mean that your a safe driver at all, just means that on the day you reached the required standard for a pass. Once passed would rush off out and secure your that Aston Martin DB8 and probably kill yourself (assuming an insurance company would take you on with such little experience, or buy something more suitable first to gain experience and demonstrate to everyone that you can actually handle a car correctly and not be a hazard to others? That's probably not the best example but you should see the logic in it.

--- End quote ---

Here is quite different, once passed the driving test and got the license, for sure here I've seen there a lot of parents (not all though) bought their kids "NEW" affordable car like Korean or Japanese car, and some are even allowed them to drive the parent's expensive European car.

Also here we don't have Aston Martin at every house hold, I guess thats our fundamental different, just leave these and stop this argument as I don't see we both going to agree each other.

Call it a day, ok ? Peace.

--- End quote ---

Peace, yes, its always peace with me. I was not saying it was the "Right Way" just maybe a more sensible option. Neither you or I can make people do anything they don't want to do.

I'm quite sure that a person who had made their mind up that were going to do something, would not post in a forum that they were going to do it. Generally when people do that on a forum they are looking for other viewpoints so that they can benefit from the views and personal experiences then make their own minds up based upon those views.

All that myself and some others are attempting to do is to offer the other side / opinion if you prefer because there are always at least 2 sides to a story.

The car analogy, maybe the Aston Martin was a bit too specific, what I was implying by that is, does it make sense to have driving lessons in a sensible car suitable for a learner, to, once passed the driving test, jump straight into a super car or other high performance car?  In fact in parts of the world you are banned from doing that, and in others you have tp display "P" plates to let others know that your still learning your road craft as a "provisional driver" so that they are made aware that the driver may still make some mistakes that more experienced drivers wouldn't normally make.

I have personal experience of this with my Brother-in-Law who once he passed his test, went and got him self a VW Golf GTI, (Rabbit if your in the USA), despite myself and the rest of the family say no. Why did he do that, simply because he could afford it and he wanted what he thought to be a cool car. He almost killed himself in that car because he was not experienced enough to handle the performance. He is now a lot older and wiser now, drives a Porsche Cayenne and has 2 sons, 1 has just passed his test and he brought him a new car and that car was a Nissan Leaf, electric, why, because it was a safer car to have as his first car and because he remembered how he almost killed himself years ago.

So lets not bogged down in this, its just another point of view, nothing more or less.

GerryBags:

--- Quote from: mnementh on June 02, 2018, 04:31:29 pm ---Tektronix operated on a different business model than is expected in today's world of greed and multimillion-dollar management payscale; first, they produced bleeding-edge high-tech using the best materials obtainable at the time, BAR NONE. Second, they operated on approximately a 3:1 cost:profit ratio, while today's big business expects closer to a 10:1 ratio, and they do that by pushing as much of their cost onto the 3rd party overseas manufacturing. Third, they manufactured EVERYTHING here in the USA, using USA workforce and paying above-average wages to get the best-qualified workers and to KEEP THEM, as opposed to the current mantra of "reduce cost of workforce by ANY MEANS POSSIBLE", even if that means most of your work is done by incompetents and/or shipped overseas.

--- End quote ---

There is a really interesting old video about Tek's CRT division on VintageTek's YT channel (It was linked in here last time this subject came up, I think), just as it was closing down. They were moving to DSO's and felt they could compete, but everyone seemed aware of the risk they were taking in basically abandoning the edge they'd had over their competitors for half a century. As it turns out, the fears expressed by people such as the guy who headed up the CRT plant were well founded; they have lost their dominance of the oscilloscope market. Even so, they still get a decent slice of it and have survived which might not have been the case if they had clung to the CRO as their focus.

It's always sad to see a unique, effective and successful team of engineers shut down in its prime like that from marketing concerns, but it does seem to have been inevitable with the way that investors matter more than customers to a businesses survival.

med6753:
Gang, let's give the DSO/CRO debate a rest and get back to TEA. I think we are at this point :horse: :horse: :horse: and further discussion will just get folks pissed off. 

I did a quick teardown of the Siglent SDS 1052DL DSO. I've never had it apart in the 2 years I've had it. First pix is after cover removal. Fully shielded. And none of the famous Siglent rust that Dave has seen numerous times in his teardowns. 2nd pix looking straight down at the power supply. 3rd pix of the main board. That's as far as I went with the teardown.

Another thing I never did was give it a performance check on the Heath IG-4244 scope calibrator. So here's it's first check and quite frankly I'm impressed. 1MHz, 10MHz. Still pretty decent at 20MHz. And just for giggles I hit it with 50MHz. Not too shabby considering it's advertised bandwidth is 50MHz. This tells me that whatever components are in there they are conservatively rated and capable of higher bandwidth. Maybe I should use this DSO more often instead of just being a bench queen and collecting dust.   :-+

BravoV:

--- Quote from: mnementh on June 02, 2018, 04:31:29 pm ---The death of CROs has nothing to do with whether it is better or not; it has to do with what it costs to make a high-quality CRO vs a high-quality DSO that MAY OR MAY NOT be able to perform as well as a laboratory-grade CRO.

--- End quote ---

Whats the example of laboratory grade CRO ? I mean for today's standard that is still in use and it's specification.

What about major advancements in ADC technology + powerful silicon say for last 2 decades ? I always thought these are the major aspects for the death of CROs ? CMIIW

Specmaster:
Thanks for sharing these with us, its nicely laid out but I'm not so sure I approve of the BNC socket being mounted directly onto the PCB, get a sticky plug or a ham fisted person, I can see that coming asunder.

Its shouldn't be a surprise to see it responding to 50MHz input, it is a 50MHz scope after all?

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