Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[mnementh]

I'm knee-deep in the build right now; but I'll snap a few closeups and post them once I'm back online with the old beast.

mnem
 

[med6753]

I've had this guy on extended burn-in while I go about my chores and all is well. A welcome additional to the Fluke tribe.  I don't know what it is but I just love those ruby red LED's. It must have something to do with my prior fatal attraction to wacko red heads. 

"Prior" fatal attraction? You'll be back...   

We NEVER really learn; a mental defect which is part and parcel of that Y chromosome. Just like the self-destructive need to "tame" the "bad boy" comes from that second X chromosome.

mnem
"Inconvenient females" are the only kind worth your time. 

Nope, there's no going back. Trust me. I've been with current lady for 8 years and couldn't be happier. We are perfect for each other. No way will I ruin it. But every time I see an attractive red head I always think back to those wild days but quickly come back to my senses.    

[beanflying]

Well that was an unpleasant night of pseudo sleep we got back up to 34 at 4.30am and now the humidity is kicking back in. 'Normal' Summer weather is back for the next week mid to high 20's during the day.

Time to go warm up some TEA stuff so its ready to greet the new arrivals.

But First

[med6753]

OK IT Wizards. Riddle me this.

Background....my home network consists of:

Semi-retired Toshiba laptop running Win7 Home x64
Scratch built Media PC running Win7 Ultimate x64
Acer laptop running Win10 Home x64
Dell tower running Win7 Ultimate x32

Printer and file sharing is turned on for everyone. No restrictions. The printer is on the Acer laptop.
Last week I added the Dell tower. Re-imaged it and installed a fresh copy of Win7 Ultimate x32. The other 2 Win7 machines on the network found and freely connected to the Dell tower. Exchange and read/write files back and forth no sweat. The Dell tower found the Win10 laptop and connected to the printer and could access the laptop's files. But the Win10 laptop could not find a network path to the Dell tower and spit out an error code (Forgot to write down). I tried every thing as suggested on the net to fix it but no joy. Even command line stuff like 'ip config' and 'ip reset' had no effect.

Last night I stumbled upon a fix. The issue wasn't with the Win10 laptop. It was with the Dell tower. See pix. Did you know that this sharing existed under network adapters? I didn't. As soon as I turned it on the laptop found the Dell. Now everyone is happy and I'm happy. So here's the riddle. How come the Win7 machines ignored this and connected to the Dell tower but the Win10 laptop absolutely refused until this was turned on?

[0culus]

You might want to black out your external IP address. While IP geolocation isn't exact by a long shot, it can easily narrow down the city where you are.

[Specmaster]

Gonna stick with the Silent Copper. I know for a fact the Phenom will run at 3.8 all day on it. 

mnem
*Cut-hack-drill-file*

Totally agree with you, my last 2 previous PC's which my boys now use daily, like mine are on for 18 hours a day, are still running and they are running AMD Phenom II X4 955 @ 3.2GHz and the other AMD Phenom II X4 965 @ 3.4GHz. I think you get far more bang per buck from AMD's.

I also have an old Dell Dimension E520 running a Intel Pentium D 805 running @ 2.66GHz, which I got recently to turn into a games machine for older games that refuse to run under Windoze 10, I have a ACER Travelmate 2492 with Intel Celeron M420 running @ 1.6GHz and an HP  Elitebook 8540P running a Intel Core i7 620M @ 2.66 GHz and the AMD's kick Intels butts.

[mnementh]

@med -

It's part of the "home network" vs "public network" security policy. By default, WiFi networks are set to a higher "Public" security level in Windows 10; this blocks UPnP discovery. You have to deliberately enable it at both ends.

mnem
*Hunting accessory risers in my "Big bin o' computer junk*

[med6753]

You might want to black out your external IP address. While IP geolocation isn't exact by a long shot, it can easily narrow down the city where you are.

Where is it showing? I thought the IP address shown in your posts was only viewable to you and the mods, not anyone else.

Besides, I really don't care. Having my IP address and 50 cents just might buy them half a cup of coffee. 

[Specmaster]

OK IT Wizards. Riddle me this.

Background....my home network consists of:

Semi-retired Toshiba laptop running Win7 Home x64
Scratch built Media PC running Win7 Ultimate x64
Acer laptop running Win10 Home x64
Dell tower running Win7 Ultimate x32

Printer and file sharing is turned on for everyone. No restrictions. The printer is on the Acer laptop.
Last week I added the Dell tower. Re-imaged it and installed a fresh copy of Win7 Ultimate x32. The other 2 Win7 machines on the network found and freely connected to the Dell tower. Exchange and read/write files back and forth no sweat. The Dell tower found the Win10 laptop and connected to the printer and could access the laptop's files. But the Win10 laptop could not find a network path to the Dell tower and spit out an error code (Forgot to write down). I tried every thing as suggested on the net to fix it but no joy. Even command line stuff like 'ip config' and 'ip reset' had no effect.

Last night I stumbled upon a fix. The issue wasn't with the Win10 laptop. It was with the Dell tower. See pix. Did you know that this sharing existed under network adapters? I didn't. As soon as I turned it on the laptop found the Dell. Now everyone is happy and I'm happy. So here's the riddle. How come the Win7 machines ignored this and connected to the Dell tower but the Win10 laptop absolutely refused until this was turned on?

Yes I knew it was there because I have my own internal network and I had to configure it all have had the same issues with Windoze 10 which is what my daily driver is running (took advantage of the free upgrade back when I was working as I used it for working from home and needed full compatibility with company programs) but 2 boys who are still living at home are running Win 7 so I had to go through the same barrier myself.

[med6753]

@med -

It's part of the "home network" vs "public network" security policy. By default, WiFi networks are set to a higher "Public" security level in Windows 10; this blocks UPnP discovery. You have to deliberately enable it at both ends.

mnem
*Hunting accessory risers in my "Big bin o' computer junk*

Makes sense.  I'm running that Dell tower over WiFi rather than CAT5 because I ran out of available slots on my router.

[0culus]

You might want to black out your external IP address. While IP geolocation isn't exact by a long shot, it can easily narrow down the city where you are.

Where is it showing? I thought the IP address shown in your posts was only viewable to you and the mods, not anyone else.

Besides, I really don't care. Having my IP address and 50 cents just might buy them half a cup of coffee. 

In your screenshot, right side.

[med6753]

You might want to black out your external IP address. While IP geolocation isn't exact by a long shot, it can easily narrow down the city where you are.

Where is it showing? I thought the IP address shown in your posts was only viewable to you and the mods, not anyone else.

Besides, I really don't care. Having my IP address and 50 cents just might buy them half a cup of coffee. 

In your screenshot, right side.

Oops, yep.....you are correct. I'm not too concerned.

[mnementh]

*LUNCH BREAK*

      

ZOMG... look what I found at the bottom of the bin. This is only the second time it's ever been powered up; I brought this home from work where it had been discarded DOA out of the box. Took it home & replaced a cracked resistor, saved it for emergency spare. Never used it because "tentacle monster". And effing radioactive green cable sleeving. 

@tautech - here's the pics of my Silent Copper. The soldering is repairs where fins got knocked loose. These aren't as fragile as they look; but after almost a decade and 4 rebuilds, a few fins have gotten knocked loose. More cooling mass.

If I find my original one, I'll post pics of that too.

Thanks for the interest in old-school! 

mnem
*Lit AF*

[tautech]

*LUNCH BREAK*

   

@tautech - here's the pics of my Silent Copper. The soldering is repairs where fins got knocked loose. These aren't as fragile as they look; but after almost a decade and 4 rebuilds, a few fins have gotten knocked loose. More cooling mass.

If I find my original one, I'll post pics of that too.

Thanks for the interest in old-school! 

mnem
*Lit AF*

Nice mnem. 
What sort of wattage cooling do they offer ?

[Specmaster]

@mnem, how can that be a silent copper cooler with a stonking great fan pushing and pulling air between the 2 cores? To my mind silent means running completely fanless as any fan will contribute some level of noise.

That tentacle monster is rather cool, not that I like to bling my PC's up with lights and colour coordination cables etc, to me, they are a workhorse and no more, that said my case has a big window side panel but not from choice, its below desk/bench and so is out of sight anyway.

Any excess cables should be able to be hidden behind the motherboard mounting plate anyway so that they do not impede the cooling airflow in anyway past the cpu and graphics coolers, I'd be perfectly happy to have that PSU in my desktops provided it kicks enough power. My PSU on my daily driver is a Corsair 750W modular unit so if the system requires it, there is something in reserve.

[0culus]

Noctua fans would be one way. Expensive, but nearly silent.

[Specmaster]

True, I have those fans fitted and I can still hear them but nowhere near as bad as stock fans and they certainly cannot be described as silent unless the person has a hearing problem and cannot hear noises below a certain level?

[Mr. Scram]

It's pure physics. You need effective coolers which nowadays means heatpipe coolers with lots of surface area. Since that Silent Copper was new a lot of progress has been made. Add a few large but quiet and slow spinning fans and it's very possible to stay below what any normal human can hear at a realistic distance, even under full load. Remember that big fans equal more airflow for less noise. Small fans are noisier. Undervolting also helps.

Fully passive is asking for all kinds of trouble, especially because computers aren't usually designed to be passively cooled. A component like the motherboard can overheat when not cooled by a modest airflow. It's possible, but it generally makes more sense to go with a very quiet actively cooled build.

[Mr. Scram]

True, I have those fans fitted and I can still hear them but nowhere near as bad as stock fans and they certainly cannot be described as silent unless the person has a hearing problem and cannot hear noises below a certain level?

Are you running them full blast? It depends on the ambient noise the location of the PC and some other factors, but it's definitely possible to have fans that are for all intents and purposes inaudible without having hearing problems.

[0culus]

True, I have those fans fitted and I can still hear them but nowhere near as bad as stock fans and they certainly cannot be described as silent unless the person has a hearing problem and cannot hear noises below a certain level?

Maybe they aren't as good as they used to be? My last PC build (which is languishing with an apparent CPU failure till I can stop buying test equipment...  ) has the Noctua D14 heat sink and those fans are almost impossible to hear. Maybe they weren't silent but you couldn't listen to the machine and immediately think "that's a fan blowing".

[beanflying]

My Shack has a commercial fridge in it so I don't have a problem with fan noise 

[GregDunn]

I've had this guy on extended burn-in while I go about my chores and all is well. A welcome additional to the Fluke tribe.  I don't know what it is but I just love those ruby red LED's. It must have something to do with my prior fatal attraction to wacko red heads. 

I'm a big fan of LED displays too - I know why, it's because I built a Heathkit digital clock when they first came out.  Well, that and the fact that the type Fluke uses are readily replaceable if they ever should die.  And because they're readable across the room, day or night.  I need to take a photo of my bench with all the meters on and all the room lights off.   

[Brumby]

I need to take a photo of my bench with all the meters on and all the room lights off.   

Forever the romantic.  (No, honey, it's not weird.)

[Specmaster]

True, I have those fans fitted and I can still hear them but nowhere near as bad as stock fans and they certainly cannot be described as silent unless the person has a hearing problem and cannot hear noises below a certain level?

Are you running them full blast? It depends on the ambient noise the location of the PC and some other factors, but it's definitely possible to have fans that are for all intents and purposes inaudible without having hearing problems.

No, I have 5 x 140mm fans on my PC, 2 at the front, 1 at the rear and 2 at the top on the double radiator all of them are automatically controlled by the PC.

[mnementh]

@tautech - Both of this famiy were rated at 300W cooling.

@mnem, how can that be a silent copper cooler with a stonking great fan pushing and pulling air between the 2 cores? To my mind silent means running completely fanless as any fan will contribute some level of noise.

That tentacle monster is rather cool, not that I like to bling my PC's up with lights and colour coordination cables etc, to me, they are a workhorse and no more, that said my case has a big window side panel but not from choice, its below desk/bench and so is out of sight anyway.

Any excess cables should be able to be hidden behind the motherboard mounting plate anyway so that they do not impede the cooling airflow in anyway past the cpu and graphics coolers, I'd be perfectly happy to have that PSU in my desktops provided it kicks enough power. My PSU on my daily driver is a Corsair 750W modular unit so if the system requires it, there is something in reserve.

BIGGER IS BETTER for quiet; you should know that. The bigger they are, the slower they can run and still move the required air.

A couple ways they could call it that... first, these coolers were made in the days of screaming 60mm tower CPU fans. While today's standard for a quiet PC is 20-30dB, back then anything less than 40-50 dB was considered good. Secondly, the fan CAN be adjusted so that its maximum speed is very slow and very quiet... easily less than 10dB. A 120mm fan doesn't need to be turning very fast to move a usable amount of air.

Back then, nobody even considered the idea of a truly "Silent" PC... hard drives were noisy, all passive cooling wasn't reasonable and there wasn't a demand. If you wanted quiet, you bought a laptop. The older model Silent Copper with no fan was specifically made to leverage the popular case designs that had a 120mm fan in front/back of the MB cavity and a cold air duct in the side of the case right above the CPU. Technically, it was absolutely silent, even if you put a fan right there.  This one has a big fan with tach, so more modern boards with noise profiles in the BIOS can control the fan for better thermal regulation than passive designs can offer.

And finally... even "Quiet PC" standards are variable today.  A PC can meet "Silent" standards under idle and office tasking and still have the ability to ramp up when under heavy load, like rendering video and gaming. It is expected.

True, I have those fans fitted and I can still hear them but nowhere near as bad as stock fans and they certainly cannot be described as silent unless the person has a hearing problem and cannot hear noises below a certain level?

Are you running them full blast? It depends on the ambient noise the location of the PC and some other factors, but it's definitely possible to have fans that are for all intents and purposes inaudible without having hearing problems.

No, I have 5 x 140mm fans on my PC, 2 at the front, 1 at the rear and 2 at the top on the double radiator all of them are automatically controlled by the PC.

Have you adjusted the cooling profile in the BIOS? Many modern machines have "Silent" and "Quiet" profiles that relies on passive cooling effect and underclocking for idle and low-load work, while still ramping up when demand requires.

mnem
*Back to my cave*