Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[factory]

Its another Philips. Couldn't find anything resembling a manual, but for less than 22 € including shipping you can't do much wrong:

Looks like one of the Japanese made ones (a re-branded Takeda Riken), I have a Philips PM 2423 multimeter made by them.

David

You have a point there. The whole appearance is definitely not Philips-y. Colors, buttons, tilt stand. Still haven't opened it, scheduled for this evening.

I have no issues whatsoever with the counter being not a Philips original.

It was the picture of the back that gave it away for me, the PCB's may be marked Takeda Riken, but unfortunately this doesn't help much with finding a manual, as they aren't exactly common either.

My multimeter is the same as this one, apart from the tilt stand/handle being missing.
http://www.glowbug.nl/neon/PM2423.html

David

[tggzzz]

I've finally got around to opening 1/3 of a previous acquisition.
Snip

Datron voltage divider, operating in a manner of the volt ratio box(L&N,Guildline)made the primary standard ones.
Datron 4902. I'd buy it from you...

I've got the other 2/3 as well.

I think learning to use it will occupy me for a while.

tggzzz has become one with the resistance. 

mnem

I'm guessing the whole set is something like this one.



David

(Somebody else) give the man a cigar

[bd139]

Yeah don't need a 27. They seem to fetch a premium for being yellow and having two buttons.

Does the continuity detector always beep even if the contact is extremely short? To test this I usually stuff the DMM on continuity and strike the probe tips together lightly and away again.

That is the "scan & latch" continuity function I was asking about. tggzzz and Spec both say no. 

I'll admit... I've been spoiled by a few decades with the 87; that really is a "minimum spec" for me anymore. I'd pay twice as much for an 87 to have it; I've actually gotten rid of all my meters that don't, aside from the 3478A and my pile of HFT "LittleRedBoxOfDAMIFINO" units I have in a drawer as giveaway units. 

mnem
*back out into the suck*

Yeah after discovering this I'm tempted to get another 87.... 

[bitseeker]

Today is my sixty-first birthday. That's an impressive number given what I have put this meat bag through. To celebrate, SWMBO took me out to dinner at a local restaurant that happens to have a butcher shop.  Here are two of the gifts I received:



About the key fob... one day after a particularly frustrating conference call, I walked into the kitchen, announced someone seemed to have slipped a full dose of fukitol^TM into my club soda, and went outside to spend the rest of the day on the deck, reading a biography of Newton.  SWMBO had never heard the term before, interwebbed it, and turned it into a birthday present.

I accidentally gifted myself (set up a sniper as a place holder two weeks ago and forgot about it) an 8184H power sensor, claimed to be in working order, to complete my power meter kit. 436 tear down evaluation and photos to follow. Must RTFM before proceeding so as to avoid destroying any of the sensors.

Happy birthday, wch! That's quite a key fob.

[bitseeker]

Yeah don't need a 27. They seem to fetch a premium for being yellow and having two buttons.

Does the continuity detector always beep even if the contact is extremely short? To test this I usually stuff the DMM on continuity and strike the probe tips together lightly and away again.

That is the "scan & latch" continuity function I was asking about. tggzzz and Spec both say no. 

I'll admit... I've been spoiled by a few decades with the 87; that really is a "minimum spec" for me anymore. I'd pay twice as much for an 87 to have it; I've actually gotten rid of all my meters that don't, aside from the 3478A and my pile of HFT "LittleRedBoxOfDAMIFINO" units I have in a drawer as giveaway units. 

mnem
*back out into the suck*

Yeah after discovering this I'm tempted to get another 87.... 

 

[Specmaster]

Yeah don't need a 27. They seem to fetch a premium for being yellow and having two buttons.

Does the continuity detector always beep even if the contact is extremely short? To test this I usually stuff the DMM on continuity and strike the probe tips together lightly and away again.

That is the "scan & latch" continuity function I was asking about. tggzzz and Spec both say no. 

I'll admit... I've been spoiled by a few decades with the 87; that really is a "minimum spec" for me anymore. I'd pay twice as much for an 87 to have it; I've actually gotten rid of all my meters that don't, aside from the 3478A and my pile of HFT "LittleRedBoxOfDAMIFINO" units I have in a drawer as giveaway units. 

mnem
*back out into the suck*

Yeah after discovering this I'm tempted to get another 87.... 

 

Just like spinning record, keeps going round in a circle, you will end up getting giddy and falling over, take a stake and drive it into the ground and anchor yourself to it. I'm thinking that bat shit crazy red headiness behaviour he often refers to  is taking him over 

[BU508A]

Hello TEA,

I hope, you can help me with a thing that confuses me.

A few months ago I have bought a nice HP 3456A.

Here are some pictures of it:

Top view of the digital part:



Top view analogue part:



Mains input, no RIFA surprises:



The power supply unit, top view:



El Capo:



The input amplifier:



Some input protection:



A fancy standoff party:



A funny thingie, no idea what this is, looks like a wirewound resistor:



Another HP special item:



And this is the master of all this desaster, the reference:



But now to my question, hopefully some 3456A experts are around.

The schematic for the oscillator crystal states the following thing:

Mains input 60Hz - 5.85MHz
Mains input 50Hz - 4.875MHz



But when I'm looking at the crystal in my 3456A I found a 6MHz crystal:



It looks geniune and untouched.

Can somebody explain this to me? I'm a bit confused. 
I have ordered some 4.875MHz crystals from this .cz company
http://www.krystaly.cz/en/

Can I replace the existing crystal with one of the 4.875MHz?

Thanks for your answers.

Mounty

[bd139]

Just like spinning record, keeps going round in a circle, you will end up getting giddy and falling over, take a stake and drive it into the ground and anchor yourself to it. I'm thinking that bat shit crazy red headiness behaviour he often refers to  is taking him over 

If you hang around with crazy you end up crazy  . Hang on why am I here? 

[syau]

Hello TEA,

I hope, you can help me with a thing that confuses me.

A few months ago I have bought a nice HP 3456A.

Here are some pictures of it:

Top view of the digital part:



Top view analogue part:



Mains input, no RIFA surprises:



The power supply unit, top view:



El Capo:



The input amplifier:



Some input protection:



A fancy standoff party:



A funny thingie, no idea what this is, looks like a wirewound resistor:



Another HP special item:



And this is the master of all this desaster, the reference:



But now to my question, hopefully some 3456A experts are around.

The schematic for the oscillator crystal states the following thing:

Mains input 60Hz - 5.85MHz
Mains input 50Hz - 4.875MHz



But when I'm looking at the crystal in my 3456A I found a 6MHz crystal:



It looks geniune and untouched.

Can somebody explain this to me? I'm a bit confused. 
I have ordered some 4.875MHz crystals from this .cz company
http://www.krystaly.cz/en/

Can I replace the existing crystal with one of the 4.875MHz?

Thanks for your answers.

Mounty

I also had similar confusion as you trying to replaced the 6 MHz and later found the correct one in the A/D at the bottom side of the unit near the PCB edge, A30 board (that crystal is install in a horizontal position to a socket)

[GreyWoolfe]

El Capo:

Actually, for the size, it should be il Capo di tutti Capi.   

[mnementh]

El Cap-itan. 

mnem
*ducks soggy ol' boot thrown from stage left*

[worsthorse]

Finally some time for TEA indulgence.  At a hamfest a few months back, I found a B+K 501A curve tracer. The seller had no idea if it worked and gave it to me for twenty-five bucks.  I put it on the shelf when I got home, lured by the siren call of some of the more complex gear in the repair queue. I pulled it out tonight to see if it worked (and if I could remember how to set up a scope in XY mode)...



Started with a partial disassembly to be sure there were was no obvious damage.





Those big old electrolytics gave me a little pause but I pressed on.  The schematics are useful because they include waveforms to be expected at various test points, but taking it all the way apart is a bit of chore, so I was happy to see that I probably don't have any obvious damage to fix

The calibration procedure is pretty simple, as you adjust the X and Y sweep using the base sweep circuit. Here's the vertical adjustment pattern...



I pulled out a couple of PN3646 NPN switching transistors and plugged them in.  The tracer works...   



I am going to snuggle with the manual and get reacquainted with how these things work. After I do that, I will decide if I want to tear it completely down, and check to see if all the parts are still in tolerance given that the caps and carbon comp resistors are, I dunno, forty-five years old. 

Oh, one neat feature... the 501A has two sets of sockets so you can match transistors, whether of the same type or complementary.  And the sweep voltage goes up to 100V, so it will handle power transistors.

[mnementh]

 

mnem
*heeds Hypnos' siren call*

[Ero-Shan]

As promised, here's a few pictures of the PM6603's innards.

And it sure isn't a Philips machine. They did not use Philips headed screws.

The housing is dominated by a big (and heavy!) silvery box:


Underside:


Box open. This is the power supply. Linear and shielded. Uncommon.


Some details:



A-ha, not completely linear. Likely for Nixie supply:


PSU removed:


This is much nicer than I'd thought.

[beanflying]

Ahhh that Feelelec's better 

All Calm and sipping a second beer now for a hunk of rare steak for dinner 

[BU508A]

This is much nicer than I'd thought.

Well, at last it is not a Philips. 

Thanks for the pictures.

[bd139]

Yeah definitely not Philips. No plastic and it's not broken 

[BU508A]

I also had similar confusion as you trying to replaced the 6 MHz and later found the correct one in the A/D at the bottom side of the unit near the PCB edge, A30 board (that crystal is install in a horizontal position to a socket)

Yes, you are right, thanks for claryfing. I was looking at the wrong crystal. 

This is the oscillator for the CPU:





I will have a look this evening to the (hopefully now then  ) correct crystal. Pictures will follow.

[Ero-Shan]

Hello TEA,

I hope, you can help me with a thing that confuses me.

A few months ago I have bought a nice HP 3456A.

... snip ...

Can somebody explain this to me? I'm a bit confused. 
I have ordered some 4.875MHz crystals from this .cz company
http://www.krystaly.cz/en/

Can I replace the existing crystal with one of the 4.875MHz?

Thanks for your answers.

Mounty

I think TiN can be regarded as an expert for the 3456A. There's a long report on xDevs.com about a 3456A fix.

And I can take a look into my 3456A's. Probably not before Friday, though.
Reminds me that I still need a new transformer for my second one ...

[Ero-Shan]

Yeah definitely not Philips. No plastic and it's not broken 

Bah! My PM6620 and PM2421 are definitely Philips and absolutely Heavy metal! 

[bd139]

PITA today. I bought some Wittig probes to go with the HM203. Nearly paid as much for the probes as the scope. But the damn BNC holes are slightly recessed on the scope and the probes have plastic shrouds around the BNC. Going to have to trim ~3mm off the end so they will actually go in the scope 

[BU508A]

PITA today. I bought some Wittig probes to go with the HM203. Nearly paid as much for the probes as the scope. But the damn BNC holes are slightly recessed on the scope and the probes have plastic shrouds around the BNC. Going to have to trim ~3mm off the end so they will actually go in the scope 

HAM Radio Friedrichshafen 2019, choose one   

[bd139]

Prices are very "pffffft" 

I am using these: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/153341055122

The are dirt cheap and have consistent performance.

[BU508A]

Prices are very "pffffft" 

I am using these: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/153341055122

The are dirt cheap and have consistent performance.

 

The cheaper ones are in the boxes on the right.

If I have to buy some probes for a Hameg 203 or 205 I think I would buy one of these:

https://www.reichelt.de/modular-probe-25-mhz-x1-testec-lf-112-p32414.html?

They are good quality and even not expensive they are no cheapies.

150 Euros for a 500MHz probe isn't that bad imho.

https://www.reichelt.de/rf-probe-500-mhz-10-mohm-testec-12070-p217578.html?

[bd139]

Yeah those are my backup probes. RS and CPC sell them here but they are 2x the price of the Wittig ones