Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[bd139]

Being in Europe there wasn’t a big RPN following. TI and Casio got in with their algebollocks calculators.

At school/college it was all TI and Casio for me.

[Specmaster]

   I have no idea which vendor's listing you're talking about; I posted two eBay searches in thread... 

mnem
 

Almost all the vendors quoted 0-50 , some quote nothing but I did see one or two that quoted 50M which is a bit more like it. Quite an interesting item through but for now, I'll stick with what I have.

      

Oh, I wasn't suggesting you should kick yours to the curb; I was just promoting my current favorite for folks who are actually looking for such a beast or who might have a few TEA-assignable shekels burning a hole in their pockets. I bought mine primarily because my collection of the things are still in a trailer in Buffalony. 

mnem
 

No, I know you weren't, the main upgrade as far as I could see would have been an angled display, no added functionality other than the ability to check some SMD parts, without having to dismantle the case. Not a problem to me, I try avoid those and stick to TH stuff.

[Wolfgang]

And an RPN calculator 

I am reading the 48GX manual at the age of 40 in 2020. Those are my sins father.

PS: Why nobody told me about RPN 20 years ago when I was a student?

Some time ago somebody invented brackets and RPN became obsolete.
AFAIK, the first automatic processor for formulas was FORTRAN back in the sixties ...

[tggzzz]

Being in Europe there wasn’t a big RPN following. TI and Casio got in with their algebollocks calculators.

At school/college it was all TI and Casio for me.

And they were very careful to specify exactly which model, since some Casio calculators gave 1+2*3=7 (correct) and others 1+2*3=9 (incorrect).

Not forgetting the "half RPN" calculators, where sin(30*5) had to be entered as 30+5= sin

[bd139]

Being in Europe there wasn’t a big RPN following. TI and Casio got in with their algebollocks calculators.

At school/college it was all TI and Casio for me.

And they were very careful to specify exactly which model, since some Casio calculators gave 1+2*3=7 (correct) and others 1+2*3=9 (incorrect).

Not forgetting the "half RPN" calculators, where sin(30*5) had to be entered as 30+5= sin

They weren't actually that careful from experience. That was one of the reasons of the sudden uptake and standardisation of TI graphic calculators in around 1990.

My daughter's A-level mathematics course suggests a Casio FX-CG50 which appears to be another "Kinpo steamer" https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B071S1HRM7/

They don't teach them anything about mathematics still, just what order to press the buttons 

Anyway I bought a TI-85 the other day which is probably the only thing I'd call a respectable algebraic calculator. It is waaaaaay more powerful than the 83/84 series and doesn't have a shifted exponent key like those which were clearly designed for education. It also has a solver, complex number support, engineering notation, decent fitting models and a proper manual targeted at people who apply it to problems, not trying to pass an exam:

[mansaxel]

Being in Europe there wasn’t a big RPN following. TI and Casio got in with their algebollocks calculators.

At school/college it was all TI and Casio for me.

Same in Sweden. Most of my classmates had Casio FX-82p, with the odd TI (my wife swears by TI). I did differently, went with my mother (who was head teacher and responsible for buying all school materials, books, pens, paper et c. for a large 7-12yo school and thus had business relations with the office material suppliers in the area) and bought, and still have my Sharp EL506p, on its original set of batteries. Since 1985. 

Only some of the engineering students (this is from age 15 until university, i.e. "senior high" in US, and Gymnasium in Germany and Sweden) had -hp- calcs, mostly to piss of the teachers, and hide programs from them. 

The teachers knew by heart how to cleanse the Casios and TIs but the  -hp- withstood them.

[Zucca]

Anyway I bought a TI-85

When I see my old horse TI-68, I struggle not to cry:



with that device I was surfing with complex numbers, doing impendence parallel calculation with the "i" notation for the immaginary part. All the other students were mostly one step behind me.
That device server me well and never got a "blue screen". How much stable were those machines compared with today raspdevil?

If only I knew about RPN, it was 1999-2005.

[Robert763]

And an RPN calculator 

I am reading the 48GX manual at the age of 40 in 2020. Those are my sins father.

PS: Why nobody told me about RPN 20 years ago when I was a student?

You should get a HP41 emultor V41 it's great

[Specmaster]

Anyway I bought a TI-85

When I see my old horse TI-68, I struggle not to cry:



with that device I was surfing with complex numbers, doing impendence parallel calculation with the "i" notation for the immaginary part. All the other students were mostly one step behind me.
That device server me well and never got a "blue screen". How much stable were those machines compared with today raspdevil?

If only I knew about RPN, it was 1999-2005.

Agreed, TI-68 is a great machine, I still have one as well.

[med6753]

Poking my head in to see what's going on. Calculators again! Fucking engineers. 

I'm going back to bed. 

[tggzzz]

Being in Europe there wasn’t a big RPN following. TI and Casio got in with their algebollocks calculators.

At school/college it was all TI and Casio for me.

And they were very careful to specify exactly which model, since some Casio calculators gave 1+2*3=7 (correct) and others 1+2*3=9 (incorrect).

Not forgetting the "half RPN" calculators, where sin(30*5) had to be entered as 30+5= sin

They weren't actually that careful from experience. That was one of the reasons of the sudden uptake and standardisation of TI graphic calculators in around 1990.

Hmmm. My experience skipped from "pi^2=g=10 and you don't need calculators" to daughter'e era of ~2000.

They don't teach them anything about mathematics still, just what order to press the buttons 

Daughter's primary school arithmetic was far better than mine. I was taught the algorithm that computers would use in their job. Daughter was taught to use any technique and trick that got the right answer, which is far better w.r.t. order of magnitude estimation.

OTOH I'm unconvinced secondary school was better; for GCSE they seemed to be taught a bastardised tedious manipulation that was 10% towards calculus. We learned calculus (of polynomials except 1/x).

Anyway I bought a TI-85 the other day which is probably the only thing I'd call a respectable algebraic calculator. It is waaaaaay more powerful than the 83/84 series and doesn't have a shifted exponent key like those which were clearly designed for education. It also has a solver, complex number support, engineering notation, decent fitting models and a proper manual targeted at people who apply it to problems, not trying to pass an exam:

Too much for calculators - I inevitably make a slip and have to start again. Text file plus replay/reentry is the minimum, i.e. spreadsheet or better.

[bd139]

Your last point is pretty spot on to be honest. I have a massive excel sheet I use for most stuff if I'm honest.

Calculators are an indulgence mostly

[mansaxel]

Your last point is pretty spot on to be honest. I have a massive excel sheet I use for most stuff if I'm honest.

Calculators are an indulgence mostly

Indeed. I try to get better in RPN by using the excellent Free42 app, but most calculation is bc or dc, sometimes Excel, but if I'm serious, i'll emulate the rows and the treatment of them in awk.

[bd139]

Random thing. Playing with CollapseOS (portable FORTH OS)



Thing is FULLY self-hosting. This is running inside their C virtual machine but it'll run the same code on bare 8086/Z80.

[BU508A]

Anyway I bought a TI-85

When I see my old horse TI-68, I struggle not to cry:



with that device I was surfing with complex numbers, doing impendence parallel calculation with the "i" notation for the immaginary part. All the other students were mostly one step behind me.
That device server me well and never got a "blue screen". How much stable were those machines compared with today raspdevil?

If only I knew about RPN, it was 1999-2005.

During my time being an EE student I had both calculators, the TI-85 and the HP 48SX (a friend of mine and me upgraded it to 128kByte RAM) but I preferred using the HP 48SX over the TI-85. I'm still having both calculators but the TI is suffering of a dark LCD when switched on. Adjusting the contrast doesn't help.

[bd139]

Open it up and "iron" the display ribbon cable termination with the edge of a soldering iron. That usually fixes the display issues on those ones.

[wolfy007]

Well alls well that ends well. Bought a 3478A for a decent price, supposedly working, get it and the 3V/30V DC ranges are not working. Look at schematic, figure its either U102 hybrid input chip or K102 reed relay (hoping not the U102). Set range manually to 30V, shunt K102, bingo getting correct reading. Let seller know its faulty, get US$50 further discount. Found replacement relay and all is good. So good that it doesnt need a cal, still in spec, how good is that!

Still needs a nice cleanup, also deffused some RIFA bombs, now its a great deal...   

[bd139]

That's a good outcome. Nice one 

[mansaxel]

Well alls well that ends well. Bought a 3478A for a decent price, supposedly working, get it and the 3V/30V DC ranges are not working. Look at schematic, figure its either U102 hybrid input chip or K102 reed relay (hoping not the U102). Set range manually to 30V, shunt K102, bingo getting correct reading. Let seller know its faulty, get US$50 further discount. Found replacement relay and all is good. So good that it doesnt need a cal, still in spec, how good is that!

Still needs a nice cleanup, also diffused some RIFA bombs, now its a great deal...   

*intensifies search for a 3478 that does not cost twice the price again for shipping*

[BU508A]

Well alls well that ends well. Bought a 3478A for a decent price, supposedly working, get it and the 3V/30V DC ranges are not working. Look at schematic, figure its either U102 hybrid input chip or K102 reed relay (hoping not the U102). Set range manually to 30V, shunt K102, bingo getting correct reading. Let seller know its faulty, get US$50 further discount. Found replacement relay and all is good. So good that it doesnt need a cal, still in spec, how good is that!

Still needs a nice cleanup, also diffused some RIFA bombs, now its a great deal...   

*intensifies search for a 3478 that does not cost twice the price again for shipping*

Interested in some gambling?   

https://www.ebay.com/itm/233672580533

[bd139]

Looks like a war victim. Needs a crutch 

[Brumby]

.... and what else, one wonders.

[Brumby]

I'm still mulling over the power switch cap that was busted on the one I got.  Sure, there is the 3D printing option, but I'm kinda partial to the idea of getting the real deal.  Not sure where to look - my eBay searching has been pretty lame.

[mnementh]

All TEA inmates are invited to help me choose what to buy on my next equipment purchase. 

>> Rigol MSO5074 or Siglent SDS2104X Plus ? <<

PS: "Buy both" is NOT ALLOWED 

No brainer. If you can cough up the dosh for the SDS2104X, get it. The Rigol is a clear second here, plus the Siglent comes with a friendly neighbor you can tap on the shoulder if something goes completely pear-shaped. Oh, and 50Ω input.

As I've said in here before... If I had the money for new, I'd just let Tautech sell me somethin'.

mnem

[mnementh]

Your last point is pretty spot on to be honest. I have a massive excel sheet I use for most stuff if I'm honest.

Calculators are an indulgence mostly

Yup. The only time I feel a honest need for a calculator is Tax Time. The rest of the time calc.exe on the 10-key is more than adequate.

mnem
Misery loves company.