Author Topic: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread  (Read 14786173 times)

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Offline tautech

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80125 on: January 19, 2021, 10:01:15 pm »
Correction, the probe tip is indeed removable. And it looks the same as other 5mm Tek Probes. Now I just have to find a source. Must be something out there.


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Offline BU508A

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80126 on: January 19, 2021, 10:12:17 pm »
Ta.

I knew about the TME ones, and the fact that they'd gone away as I had them on the putative BOM for one of my own design/build PSUs (Which I still haven't finalised the design(s) for as I keep changing my mind about things).

I'll take a critical look at the 3631 binding posts to see if they'll fit. Thank fuck that Keysight post photos with a scale for parts like that. First look suggests that the 66312 part has a keying flat on the mounting thread, the 3631 has a complete round thread - possibly within bodging range with a grinding wheel if necessary. The 66312A ones have a captive 'spinny bit' so I can't just take the knobs off the others and put them on the otherwise good existing posts. Bah!

Pollin in Germany is selling those (sadly, only the yellow and green ones are available, the others are sold out):



You can have the red and black one if you want for 1 EUR each and shipping. (I hope, a letter to the UK wouldn't be that expensive)

Edit:
I saw that Robert was faster and was coming up with the proper parts.  :-+
Never mind.  :)
« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 10:29:10 pm by BU508A »
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Offline 25 CPS

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80127 on: January 19, 2021, 10:26:22 pm »
This video popped up in my Youtube feed yesterday and given the discussion here, I watched it:



It definitely agrees with BD's comments about Sony's house sound.  The descriptions in that video of the Sony and the Marantz agree with how I remember both of them.  My family had one of the smaller Marantz receivers from the same period for a long time and my best friend's family had a lot of Sony stereo equipment from the 80s and 90s.  It's too bad the guy who made the video isn't an electronics engineer/technologist/test equipment geek.  If it was me putting those two receivers up against each other and I heard that difference, they'd both have gotten carted downstairs and put them on the bench with the 8903B and sweep them to get some hard and fast numbers to see if Sony goosed the ends of the frequency response to tailor the sound compared to the Marantz.

Anyhow, I did shoot some unboxing video of the 34401A and the S-A-A-2N/TinySA packages.  The camcorder wasn't a Sony though!  If there's interest, I can try to stitch something together and toss it online later if anybody wants to see.
I'm not at all surprised by his conclusion here, the Marantz receiver has now for many years been considered to be one of the top hi-fi units you can get and that quality shone through just be looking at the 2 side by side and looking inside did not disappoint either and the sheer smoothness of the sound said it all. The Sony uses IC's to reduce the cost and IC's lend themselves to machine assembly and the Marantz, clearly much more complex to assemble, was hand built.

I won one of those Sony receivers on eBay recently for repair and the sound quality when repaired ready for flipping again was just described and after extended soak tests it was becoming clear the bass was very muddied, more like a one note samba, the mid-range was just about right and the high notes too bright. Just from that short experience of the modern Sony, it was enough to turn off them for ever as well.

One of the best budget (top end of the budget) range in the 70s to 80s was Nippon Sound, fully discrete alloy and wood cabinets but these amps and receivers kicked some arse I can tell you. Not sure what happened to them, but I have a hunch that they became Yamaha but not sure.

I remember the Marantz 22xx line well.  Actually, I have one downstairs that was a garage find that's waiting to go on the bench plus my family had one for many years when I was growing up.  That one died spectacularly though and my parents decided not to get it repaired but bought a Denon A/V receiver and a Denon DCD-15000 CD player to replace the Marantz when it blew up instead of getting it repaired.  I don't remember why they opted not to repair it.  Anyways, the CD player sounded quite good but that Denon receiver was awful.  The pre/power amplifier were mediocre.  So was the tuner.  The phono stage was awful.  Between getting the CD player at the same time and the truly awful sounding phono preamp in that Denon receiver, my family pretty much stopped playing our record collection overnight.

The Marantz was the much better receiver by far.  The Denon was unforgivably dull and sucked the life out of every piece of music that was passed through it for some reason.  If anything it was the opposite of every Sony stereo system that I encountered from the same time period which sounded so much better even though they had that goosed up overdone sound.  MSG, that was a good way of putting it.  Anyhow, the Denon receiver and CD player went in the garbage when my parents sold the house and moved into a condo.  I would've been curious to put the Denon on the bench and take some measurements on that too, just to see if I could identify why and how, what part of it's overall transfer function was responsible for sucking the life out and completely killing all the music played through this thing.  Unfortunately, my parents threw it out along with the DCD-1500 and didn't tell me until after they were gone so the idea of doing that and then using it in a sound system for the back yard here went out the window.

Actually, speaking of the Sony TV at my place, my parents threw out a beautiful, low hours Panasonic plasma TV a couple of weeks ago.  They decided to de-clutter one of the rooms in their condo and listed the TV on the condo building's internal buy and sell website but got no takers so they got the building maintenance people to carry it out of their condo and heave it into the bin and that was the end of that.  If I had known they were going to throw out that low hours Panasonic plasma, I would've happily taken it and kicked the Sony with the crappy backlight bleedthrough out of my living room and put it downstairs in the workshop.  What a waste of a beautiful plasma TV.  But, as usual with my parents, they made a point of telling me after it was already gone, just like they've done with a lot of things including my grandparents car when they gave up driving when I was in college and was taking public transportation two hours each way, tell me about the car becoming available after it had already been sold.
 

Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80128 on: January 19, 2021, 10:29:53 pm »
   Yes I did that with a chair leg; I enjoyed every fucking second of it...

Tell me you put the video on youtube, you know the algo loves this stuff

I didn’t actually make a video of it unfortunately.

I do have one somewhere of me taking out my frustrations on a generic supermarket android tablet I was given. I will dig it out and upload it at some point.

When you work with technology it’s healthy to do this occasionally. At a suitably large org I helped migrate from Netware to AD, we dragged the Compaq server outside and lumped it with chunks of wood. Was great fun.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 10:31:39 pm by bd139 »
 
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Offline Zucca

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80129 on: January 19, 2021, 10:29:57 pm »
I bought today a home in the USA, for the same money:

- In Munich about 66 m² flat
- In USA, SC. home is about 490m² on about 4000 m² piece of Earth.

Fuuu yes, it is not a house, it's a piece of planet in my mind.

Only downside: Italy will be so far away, my heart is broken already.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 10:45:58 pm by Zucca »
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80130 on: January 19, 2021, 10:32:35 pm »
The house on the blue marker is the same size as my place  :-DD
 
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Offline Saskia

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80131 on: January 19, 2021, 10:33:29 pm »
congrats and enjoy, Zucca.
 
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Offline Zucca

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80132 on: January 19, 2021, 10:36:20 pm »
The house on the blue marker is the same size as my place  :-DD

Probably in London for the money I could have got a 5 stars toilet room.
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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80133 on: January 19, 2021, 10:37:57 pm »
Why....?  :o

Why would you leave actual civilization... the cradle of the Renaissance no less... for any homestead in Dumbfuckistan...? If I could manage to get my family there, they would have to hunt me down with dogs and drag us back.

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« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 10:40:42 pm by mnementh »
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Offline BU508A

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80134 on: January 19, 2021, 10:40:10 pm »
Good luck and my best wishes for you and your wife in the States.
Take care.  :-+   :)
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Offline tautech

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80135 on: January 19, 2021, 10:42:59 pm »
I bought today a home in the USA, for the same money:

- In Munich about 66 m² flat
- In USA, SC. home is about 490m² on a 4 Km² piece of Earth.

Fuuu yes, it is not a house, it's a piece of planet in my mind.

Only downside: Italy will be so far away, my heart is broken already.
Nice, at the end of a cul-de-sac is generally nice and quiet.
4000m2 not 4Km2 which would be 16,000,000m2  :o
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Offline Cerebus

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80136 on: January 19, 2021, 10:43:12 pm »
Ta.

I knew about the TME ones, and the fact that they'd gone away as I had them on the putative BOM for one of my own design/build PSUs (Which I still haven't finalised the design(s) for as I keep changing my mind about things).

I'll take a critical look at the 3631 binding posts to see if they'll fit. Thank fuck that Keysight post photos with a scale for parts like that. First look suggests that the 66312 part has a keying flat on the mounting thread, the 3631 has a complete round thread - possibly within bodging range with a grinding wheel if necessary. The 66312A ones have a captive 'spinny bit' so I can't just take the knobs off the others and put them on the otherwise good existing posts. Bah!

Pollin in Germany is selling those (sadly, only the yellow and green ones are available, the others are sold out):



You can have the red and black one if you want for 1 EUR each and shipping. (I hope, a letter to the UK wouldn't be that expensive)

Edit:
I saw that Robert was faster and was coming up with the proper parts.  :-+
Never mind.  :)

I have some of those, bought from "the usual scumbags" as AvE says, that I got to try after discovering that the line TME were carrying had dried up. Not great, not terrible, quality wise. I used most of them up on on a 4-wire current shunt I built a while back.

Ta anyway.
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Offline BU508A

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80137 on: January 19, 2021, 10:43:32 pm »
The house on the blue marker is the same size as my place  :-DD

It's late, I'm tired and I've read at first "palace"   :o   :palm:   :-DD
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Offline Zucca

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80138 on: January 19, 2021, 10:45:07 pm »
4000m2 not 4Km2 which would be 16,000,000m2  :o

Shit, I had in my mind 4K m² not 4 Km², basically my hands did not follow my brain.

EDIT: I do not know where the 16 is coming from.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 10:52:10 pm by Zucca »
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Offline Cerebus

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80139 on: January 19, 2021, 10:46:50 pm »
I bought today a home in the USA, for the same money:

- In Munich about 66 m² flat
- In USA, SC. home is about 490m² on a 4 Km² piece of Earth.

Fuuu yes, it is not a house, it's a piece of planet in my mind.

Only downside: Italy will be so far away, my heart is broken already.
Nice, at the end of a cul-de-sac is generally nice and quiet.
4000m2 not 4Km2 which would be 16,000,000m2  :o

No, I think you would find that 4 Km2 would be one square meter of liquid helium.  >:D
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Offline tautech

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80140 on: January 19, 2021, 10:51:04 pm »
4000m2 not 4Km2 which would be 16,000,000m2  :o

Shit, I had in my mind 4K m² not 4 Km², basically my hands did not follow my brain.
:-DD
16 million m2 is a whopping big place as sometimes I think mine is too big at just under 1 million m2.

4000m2 is 0.4 Ha or ~1 acre.
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80141 on: January 19, 2021, 10:57:17 pm »
The house on the blue marker is the same size as my place  :-DD

It's late, I'm tired and I've read at first "palace"   :o   :palm:   :-DD

Ah but soon I will. Once I’ve worked out that world domination thing.

More insanity on eBay. I was prepared to go to £100 on this: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/184617039740
 

Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80142 on: January 19, 2021, 10:58:24 pm »
Why...?  ;)

I thought you'd already built one...?

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Offline mansaxel

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80143 on: January 19, 2021, 11:01:41 pm »
I bought today a home in the USA, for the same money:

- In Munich about 66 m² flat
- In USA, SC. home is about 490m² on about 4000 m² piece of Earth.

Fuuu yes, it is not a house, it's a piece of planet in my mind.

Only downside: Italy will be so far away, my heart is broken already.

You obviously have a strong desire pulling you there. My congratulations on possessing this level of determination. (Or being possessed by it, pick your favourite..)

Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80144 on: January 19, 2021, 11:03:38 pm »
Yes, this.

I'm sorry; I didn't mean to be so negative. If it makes you happy Z, congratulations. Sincerely.  ;)

EDIT:

I guess I get it... I had people asking me the same thing when I moved to Texas to be with my wife.  I know I could've done a lot worse; have no doubt I would already be past tense if not for her.
;)

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« Last Edit: January 19, 2021, 11:13:58 pm by mnementh »
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Offline BU508A

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80145 on: January 19, 2021, 11:21:02 pm »
The house on the blue marker is the same size as my place  :-DD

It's late, I'm tired and I've read at first "palace"   :o   :palm:   :-DD

Ah but soon I will. Once I’ve worked out that world domination thing.

Ask this fellow for advice / support, he has a plan.
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Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80146 on: January 19, 2021, 11:26:49 pm »
I remember that as a Teenager, I brought my self a Teleton TFS-70 receiver for my bedroom and a pair of Wharfedale Denton's speakers. Teleton were based at that time in Chelmsford. On paper, it had great specifications but in reality, it was shit. It sounded lovely if you only listened for a short while, but as your ears become more tuned in to it, you hear raspiness to certain sounds.

Does anyone remember Teleton brand at all?
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Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80147 on: January 19, 2021, 11:29:28 pm »
The house on the blue marker is the same size as my place  :-DD

It's late, I'm tired and I've read at first "palace"   :o   :palm:   :-DD

Ah but soon I will. Once I’ve worked out that world domination thing.

Ask this fellow for advice / support, he has a plan.

Are yes Pinky and the Brain  :-DD

Who let Murphy in?

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Offline shakalnokturn

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80148 on: January 20, 2021, 12:23:33 am »
Does anyone remember Teleton brand at all?

I've run into them a couple of times, they kinda remind me of the Universum receivers.
 
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Offline SilverSolder

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #80149 on: January 20, 2021, 12:45:02 am »
This video popped up in my Youtube feed yesterday and given the discussion here, I watched it:



It definitely agrees with BD's comments about Sony's house sound.  The descriptions in that video of the Sony and the Marantz agree with how I remember both of them.  My family had one of the smaller Marantz receivers from the same period for a long time and my best friend's family had a lot of Sony stereo equipment from the 80s and 90s.  It's too bad the guy who made the video isn't an electronics engineer/technologist/test equipment geek.  If it was me putting those two receivers up against each other and I heard that difference, they'd both have gotten carted downstairs and put them on the bench with the 8903B and sweep them to get some hard and fast numbers to see if Sony goosed the ends of the frequency response to tailor the sound compared to the Marantz.

Anyhow, I did shoot some unboxing video of the 34401A and the S-A-A-2N/TinySA packages.  The camcorder wasn't a Sony though!  If there's interest, I can try to stitch something together and toss it online later if anybody wants to see.
I'm not at all surprised by his conclusion here, the Marantz receiver has now for many years been considered to be one of the top hi-fi units you can get and that quality shone through just be looking at the 2 side by side and looking inside did not disappoint either and the sheer smoothness of the sound said it all. The Sony uses IC's to reduce the cost and IC's lend themselves to machine assembly and the Marantz, clearly much more complex to assemble, was hand built.

I won one of those Sony receivers on eBay recently for repair and the sound quality when repaired ready for flipping again was just described and after extended soak tests it was becoming clear the bass was very muddied, more like a one note samba, the mid-range was just about right and the high notes too bright. Just from that short experience of the modern Sony, it was enough to turn off them for ever as well.

One of the best budget (top end of the budget) range in the 70s to 80s was Nippon Sound, fully discrete alloy and wood cabinets but these amps and receivers kicked some arse I can tell you. Not sure what happened to them, but I have a hunch that they became Yamaha but not sure.

I swept the idle output of a small modern Class D amplifier with a spectrum analyzer from 0 - 1MHz...   let's just say that "hi fi" was not the first thing that sprung to mind!  :D
 


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