Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[mnementh]

Heh... that's painfully familiar. Behind all my drawer boxes full of reasonably current semis and connectors... is a whole 'nuther layer from back in the day when I used to fix VCRs/CD/DVD Players/Stereos for a living. I probably still have pristine vacuum-packed spindle and idler tires for Emerson in there somewhere. 


mnem
Maybe they need to get "Misplaced" the next time I move...

[bitseeker]

Wow, that's quite a tower. What are the DMMs on the bottom? I can't quite make out the labeling on the front panel.

They're Solartron 7150.

Thanks. I haven't seen them before.

...I eventually started the work on the 3458A with its NVRAM problem... read the cal ram with my newly acquired programmer (got it for this very job!). Comparing the data with what was read via GPIB a few weeks ago showed it to be identical. That I took as a good sign. 

That's surely a relief!

[xrunner]

Sorry, I only stumbled upon this today. Maybe I'm in the clear? (Of course, those are not all ... they're about half the lot.) 

That's a good stack but I still see a little bit of light at the top - keep going ... 

[med6753]

Only need five DMMs? Let's see here. With four power rails, that's four voltages, so four DMMs for that. Unless those four do simultaneous voltage and current (or alternating, if you don't mind relays clacking), you need four more DMMs. Then, you'll probably want to monitor one or two other locations in the device. Well, that's 10 so far. And it's not good to use your last meter because that's when you know you'll need one more. So, you need at least one or two spares. A dozen DMMs sounds pretty good despite having only two hands and eyes.

Excellent, I have successfully justified all my currently operational DMMs.

Sorry, I only stumbled upon this today. Maybe I'm in the clear? (Of course, those are not all ... they're about half the lot.) 

Wow, that certainly puts my stack to shame. But I'm curious. All mine work and are calibrated. Not that it really matters but is that the same for your stack or is it more of a spare parts bin? 

[Ero-Shan]

Wow, that certainly puts my stack to shame. But I'm curious. All mine work and are calibrated. Not that it really matters but is that the same for your stack or is it more of a spare parts bin?

Nothing to be ashamed of. Especially if they're all in good condition!

To answer your question: I simply don't know because I didn't check them all (yet). One of the 8050s has obviously a blind LCD. The uppermost had that, too. As I had a 8060 8040 lying on its death bead at that time, I asked it to donate its display (told it that parts of it would live on which helped the decision). So the display got transplanted and the 8050 got the LED modification (compared to others I did a horrible job). This one does work. I'll eventually look after all of them, but there's more interesting equipment to check/clean/repair first. And the next carload of stuff is expected to arrive next week, so that will keep me busy for months, if not years, to come.

Alas, I have no means to calibrate them.  As I don't really need the precision, adjustment against my 3458A (last calibration spring 2016) is good enough for me. I do not intend to become a volt-nut.

Edit: The poor deceased was an 8040.

[Mr. Scram]

Nothing to be ashamed of. Especially if they're all in good condition!

To answer your question: I simply don't know because I didn't check them all (yet). One of the 8050s has obviously a blind LCD. The uppermost had that, too. As I had a 8060 lying on its death bead at that time, I asked it to donate its display (told it that parts of it would live on which helped the decision). So the display got transplanted and the 8050 got the LED modification (compared to others I did a horrible job). This one does work. I'll eventually look after all of them, but there's more interesting equipment to check/clean/repair first. And the next carload of stuff is expected to arrive next week, so that will keep me busy for months, if not years, to come.

Alas, I have no means to calibrate them.  As I don't really need the precision, adjustment against my 3458A (last calibration spring 2016) is good enough for me. I do not intend to become a volt-nut.

No intention of becoming a voltnut? Like I said before, too late. You own a 3458A. Normal people don't own a 3458A. Even enthusiasts don't regularly own a 3458A You can kick and scream all you want

[URI]

[Loads of Fluke 80x0s]
As I don't really need the precision, adjustment against my 3458A (last calibration spring 2016) is good enough for me. I do not intend to become a volt-nut.

Oh, if you don't intend to become a voltnut I can take that (3458A) burden from you. I'll offer a 3456A to you in exchange -with that it's not so dangerous to slip into volt-nuttery. 
Otherwise: Welcome to the dark side.. 

[Specmaster]

Alas, I have no means to calibrate them.  As I don't really need the precision, adjustment against my 3458A (last calibration spring 2016) is good enough for me. I do not intend to become a volt-nut.

It's way too late to say that, it's so evidently clear to everyone here that you are exhibiting every possible kind of obsession it is possible to have with test gear and a lot of it needs to be finding new homes, especially those that you have so many duplicates of. I think most of us would understand having so many if they were different, you could claim that you was a collector preserving one of each type for posterity, that would make sense, but you cannot claim that your not a volt-nut under the current conditions. 

[Ero-Shan]

Oh, come on, don't be so hard on me. 

I just did a quick check of the Fluke 8050As and the Solartron 7150s, only DC Volts (with a Knick precision voltage source and a Prema 5000S as reference) and Ohms (1  , 100  , 1k , 10 k , 100 k , 1 M 0.1 % resistors and a lousy 10 M @ 5 %).
Most of them are not working too well. All 7150 have stickers on them "VAC out of tolerance". Not all of them will have a happy future. 

The slippery path to voltnuttery is not too dangerous for me, as I have hard limits on what I may spend. Meaning: a calibrated calibrator is just not affordable to me.
But I might consider getting my 3458A calibrated (when the yearly cal is due at work) and pay the fee (around 400 €). IMHO, the calibration firm should do it for free, as it was them who got the second 3458A (for free!). I might then "calibrate" my Knick and Burster calibrators against this. That should work sufficiently well for DC Volts, DC Amps and Ohms. No luck with anything AC, though.

I can always tell myself that it'll take the rest of my life to get all the stuff working again, so I'll never need to actually measure anything with them. 

Until I found this thread and read it, I was a such a happy collector of TE and components. But now ...

[med6753]

There are different levels of voltnuttery. You don't have to go totally over the edge of sanity. You can do a decent job of DCV cal on an 8050 or 8600 with 2 of these real cheap. 1 for primary and the other for backup and verification. Of course it's not a "traceable" standard but I have found they are damn accurate.

You can build up an ohms "standard" pretty easily with 0.1% resistors. Again, not "traceable" but it works.

Agreed, AC volts is a whole different animal. I don't have anything here that I would consider anywhere near stable and accurate enough to do a good cal. So for now I go without. 

[bd139]

I’m doing something similar. I’ve got a REF02 based transfer standard which I get someone I know who works in a lab with traceable cal devices to run it up on their 6.5 digit meter at a known temperature. This happens once a year. When I get it back I check my DMMs against it at the same temp. It’s fine for 3.5/4.5 digit meters. Things get complicated if you have more digits so I’m avoiding that complexity.

AC volts I use my DDS and a reference meter. Tolerance on AC is always much looser so a 1% ballpark is fine. DDS is pretty accurate actually even with reference powers (Rigol DG1022Z).

[Ero-Shan]

There are different levels of voltnuttery. You don't have to go totally over the edge of sanity. You can do a decent job of DCV cal on an 8050 or 8600 with 2 of these real cheap. 1 for primary and the other for backup and verification. Of course it's not a "traceable" standard but I have found they are damn accurate.

You can build up an ohms "standard" pretty easily with 0.1% resistors. Again, not "traceable" but it works.

Agreed, AC volts is a whole different animal. I don't have anything here that I would consider anywhere near stable and accurate enough to do a good cal. So for now I go without.

I don't know how my calibrators compare to the AD584 based thingies. But your approach is very close to what I have in my own mind. Edge of sanity? There are people who see me on the other side of that edge already. 

AC volts I use my DDS and a reference meter. Tolerance on AC is always much looser so a 1% ballpark is fine. DDS is pretty accurate actually even with reference powers (Rigol DG1022Z).

My DDS project is still in its infancy, and will probably stay there forever. You imply a little GAS, I suppose?

Thanks for the suggestions.

[Specmaster]

My method is far easier to do and less expensive. Having recently purchased 3 DMM and they all on read the same on Vdc, Vac and Ohms so I us as sort of bench mark backed by some 1% resistors and a brand new cell which are typically 1.6v, it is then easy to check new meters against these comparators. I have a 6.5 digit meter which last calibration date was around 10 years ago, this I gnome anything after 3dp.

The main use of the 6.5 digits is tracking shorts down where extra digits come in handy. Nothing I do is that critical that demands such precision (the lure of those digits glowing gets me every time)

[mnementh]

For that purpose, a ShortSqueek or ToneOhm works a lot better; you can scour eBay for these old-school tools or make one like this:

http://www.nutsvolts.com/index.php?/blog/post/build_an_audible_milliohmmeter/

The only similar device I know about that is still in production is the EDS LeakSeeker series; they've been around almost as long as the original ShortSqueek, or maybe a spinoff, I'm not sure of that particular history.
 

mnem
Make mine a double, please.

[khs]

Here some simple comparison measurements, checked with my HP3456A-1   

Fluke 731B-1      10.00015            
Fluke 731B-2      10.00030            
Fluke 731B-3      10.00028            
Fluke 5100A 10V    9.99991             
Fluke 332B  10V      10.00035   

Fluke 332B  10V checked with the other voltmeters:
HP3456A-2   10.00011   
UDS6      10.00036   
7066      9.99999

All Fluke references and HP voltmeters are not calibrated and never adjusted.

The UDS6 and 7066 are not as stable as the HP3456, so I made some adjustments. I don't use these voltmeters as 'comparison reference'.

But even the UDS6/7066 are better than my requirements (0.1%).

So my risk to get a volt-nut looks to be quite low..

[tggzzz]

Today started off well: I got some cash and more room in my house by flogging a Tek 464, 465, and a few other odds and sods. Daughter was happy, because it might be easier for her to get to her bed.

But then I blew both of those on a 7-decade Kelvin Varley Divider, a Julie Research VDR106/7. Daughter won't see it until next weekend

So, was today +ve, -ve or neutral?

[Specmaster]

Today started off well: I got some cash and more room in my house by flogging a Tek 464, 465, and a few other odds and sods. Daughter was happy, because it might be easier for her to get to her bed.

But then I blew both of those on a 7-decade Kelvin Varley Divider, a Julie Research VDR106/7. Daughter won't see it until next weekend

So, was today +ve, -ve or neutral?

Haha, sounds like I'm not the only one to have overflowed  then 

[bitseeker]

Oh, come on, don't be so hard on me. 

Don't worry. We're all in it together. Soon, everything will seem normal.

Until I found this thread and read it, I was a such a happy collector of TE and components. But now ...

Not happy anymore? Maybe in shock? It will soon pass. Then, you'll be back to happy collecting again and sharing pics here of your TE scores.

[tggzzz]

Today started off well: I got some cash and more room in my house by flogging a Tek 464, 465, and a few other odds and sods. Daughter was happy, because it might be easier for her to get to her bed.

But then I blew both of those on a 7-decade Kelvin Varley Divider, a Julie Research VDR106/7. Daughter won't see it until next weekend

So, was today +ve, -ve or neutral?

Haha, sounds like I'm not the only one to have overflowed  then 

Having a full house is an effective way to save money: you can't buy anything unless you also throw something out. I'm more-or-less incapable of the latter.

[Mr. Scram]

Today started off well: I got some cash and more room in my house by flogging a Tek 464, 465, and a few other odds and sods. Daughter was happy, because it might be easier for her to get to her bed.

But then I blew both of those on a 7-decade Kelvin Varley Divider, a Julie Research VDR106/7. Daughter won't see it until next weekend

So, was today +ve, -ve or neutral?

Why am I picturing one of those hoarder houses, with your daughter sleeping in a bed with just enough room for her to lie down, with obscure and ancient electronics stacked all around?

[tggzzz]

Today started off well: I got some cash and more room in my house by flogging a Tek 464, 465, and a few other odds and sods. Daughter was happy, because it might be easier for her to get to her bed.

But then I blew both of those on a 7-decade Kelvin Varley Divider, a Julie Research VDR106/7. Daughter won't see it until next weekend

So, was today +ve, -ve or neutral?

Why am I picturing one of those hoarder houses, with your daughter sleeping in a bed with just enough room for her to lie down, with obscure and ancient electronics stacked all around?

Oh, there's plenty of room for her to sleep; her bed is 5ft off the ground Besides, if it really bothered her on her few returns home, there's plenty of her gunk that could be junked.

[Mr. Scram]

Oh, there's plenty of room for her to sleep; her bed is 5ft off the ground Besides, if it really bothered her on her few returns home, there's plenty of her gunk that could be junked.

Bunk beds, because daddy needs storage 

[tggzzz]

Oh, there's plenty of room for her to sleep; her bed is 5ft off the ground Besides, if it really bothered her on her few returns home, there's plenty of her gunk that could be junked.

Bunk beds, because daddy needs storage 

Fortunately not; bunk beds were in place a decade before GAS and TEA broke out.

[Specmaster]

Oh, there's plenty of room for her to sleep; her bed is 5ft off the ground Besides, if it really bothered her on her few returns home, there's plenty of her gunk that could be junked.

Bunk beds, because daddy needs storage 

Fortunately not; bunk beds were in place a decade before GAS and TEA broke out.

Bottom bunk used like a bench of some sort I guess?

[tggzzz]

Oh, there's plenty of room for her to sleep; her bed is 5ft off the ground Besides, if it really bothered her on her few returns home, there's plenty of her gunk that could be junked.

Bunk beds, because daddy needs storage 

Fortunately not; bunk beds were in place a decade before GAS and TEA broke out.

Bottom bunk used like a bench of some sort I guess?

Homework desk. Being short makes it easier