Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[mnementh]

           

Just like Oakley sez:  "Thermonuclear Protection." 

Shipped priority, new carton (NOT recycled), H-Taped top & bottom. Not only H-Taped, but stapled AND double-walled carton. Inside that, the good ol- "Spray-foam Cube of Goodness". Inside THAT, my little pink bundle of joy. And not just a pink wrapper... but a pink anti-static coated bag.  And finally.... my DOA baby.    It's pretty hard to pack better; clearly these are professionals who didn't cut corners getting my meter here intact. While I wish I could have saved a few dollars, I don't begrudge them a penny spent on shipping. That package would have survived even those guys who chuck it over the fence.   

And worst part of all... it's fixed and all functions appear nominal against my Sperry and Aneng 8002 & 8008. Once I put hands on the 16V battery for my voltage reference, I'll check the DC voltage readings against it. But its late and I feel crunky due to lack of Sudafed, so I'm gonna go pass out now.


mnem
ZZZzzzZZZzzzZZZzzz...

That is something else [emoji122] brilliant packing on that, and better still the meter works even though their stuff seems to be sold as powered up but not tested, so sold as is etc. Now I'm really looking forward to getting mine delivered [emoji41]. It's currently showing on the tracking as shipped from GSP Centre to International Destination yeeeeessss. Oh, there's just one problem with your 189, it's yellow and not red [emoji6][emoji106]

I think I'm okay widdat... got plenty of red, and blue, and green in the rest of my herd...   

I'm very pleased to find a used gear vendor that actually does as they claim... post gear direct from triage rather than made-up BS about units they've already cannibalized to fix other units. While I did pay what I consider to be premium price for a DOA meter, I got what I bid on with a straightforward repair, rather than working to get get it powered up and then trying to fix a dozen other things wrong because a unit was pieced together from borked parts taken off other units.

I tried to make the tinkering fun last, really I did.     

I originally was going to just nuke the AAs and go LiPo, but once I opened it up and found an absolutely pristine PCB, I took my time scrubbing the battery compartment and making up coil-spring battery clips from my junk drawer so as to fit in the original slots. But even that only took an hour or so... Aside from fuses, now it needs one plastic 1/4 turn for the battery door, a new tilt stand/bail and the optional probe-holder on the back. All are available on fleaBay as are the original battery clips, but I think I want to try printing the plastic parts first.

I've been looking since I bid on Scrotum-hat's meter for the spare fuses I had from my 87; no luck. Guess I have to suck it up and spend the $15 for a new pair.

mnem
Maybe they're under his hat...

[bd139]

Damn it. Got outbid on some tubes (Heathkit VTVM) 

[Berni]

So i have done some playing around with my HP 4145B (From this post:  https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/test-equipment-anonymous-(tea)-group-therapy-thread/msg1743695/#msg1743695 )

The UI has quite a few tricks up its sleeve, not very intuitive at first but once you get used to it its actually a really quick to navigate UI.

Wow, that's some piece of gear. Although I've seen some at reasonable prices (with 5.25" or 3.5" drive), they usually don't have the boot/config disk. I suppose that's kind of important unless you have the means to create one and are prepared to calibrate it.

Yes the boot disk is very important since without it it just sits there and does nothing while displaying a error number. But now that i have a working one i can make as many copies of the disk as i want.

As for calibration i think it doesn't even need it. There is an autocal button on it that makes it do a happy reed relay dance inside for some time, but i haven't seen anything about calibration elsewhere. It could just be that the calibration is all in the form of trimm pots.

Oh and i noticed that my cables don't quite fully work for it. The HP 4145 has a different triax pinout than the 4141. There is no separate force and sense terminal anymore so it now goes center = force/sense, middle = guad, outer = earth. This made for some weird low current readings when my cable adapter shorted the center and middle conductor at the DUT.

[bitseeker]

Yeah, that's the other nightmare with Triax. There are so many configurations for the conductors. I'm glad I finally found a 2-to-3 slot/lug adapter. Trying to go to coax BNC would've required too many adapters for the various combinations.

[URI]

My bargain-bin 6114A didn't come with feet.

Same problem here. My first 6114A came without feet. 

Ah, OK. Good to know in case I come across a good source for them. I've seen other feet sometimes at a better price if you buy multiple sets.

@bitseeker: I solved the problem of my first 6114A missing its feet:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/what-did-you-buy-today-post-your-latest-purchase!/msg1755449/#msg1755449
 

I don't know anything about the HP 4260A yet but there's a user and service manual downloadable at keysight.com - barely readable on some pages but better than nothing.

edit:
I found some readable manuals after some research on the net.
Started reading..hmm..nice device..hmm..external oscillator input..interesting device..might keep it..   

[Specmaster]

Damn it. Got outbid on some tubes (Heathkit VTVM) 

I think maybe Heathkit gear is coming back into fashion again, I got some tubes as well, 2 tube Heathkit VTVM, 2 tube Tech RF generator and 1 tube RF generator and none of them get what I would warm even, the Tech is the warmest by a mile and my warmest piece of kit is without doubt the Fluke PM3390B which does get pretty warm above the PSU.

[Specmaster]

@mnementh Nice selection of gear there, somehow I'd imagined much more of the Fluke yellow with a flurry of their meters but I see the 189 is your first which explains the reason for getting one as they are the believed holy grail of meters, I went through that phase but I'm shedding mine now and leaving myself with just 2 27's, they and the 867 will be my mainstay of the handhelds. I have a handful of lesser meters with next to no commercial value that I'm keeping as general knock about meters.

Have you tried the 189 on your reference module yet to see how it fares against calibration, I reckon that it will still be within an acceptable calibration, mine were and they are much older.

Your chinese LCR meter in the centre has a massive screen, got any info on that and how does that compare against the Peak unit? 

[bitseeker]

My bargain-bin 6114A didn't come with feet.

Same problem here. My first 6114A came without feet. 

@bitseeker: I solved the problem of my first 6114A missing its feet:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/what-did-you-buy-today-post-your-latest-purchase!/msg1755449/#msg1755449
 

Hey, nicely done. Isn't that better than paying $25 + shipping just for feet alone? It seemed the right way to go. And I've now added that model to my foot donor shopping list.

edit:
I found some readable manuals after some research on the net.
Started reading..hmm..nice device..hmm..external oscillator input..interesting device..might keep it..   

LOL! It was bound to happen. Do you have other LCR meters to compare it with? I'd be interested to see how it performs relative to some modern stuff.

[mnementh]

@mnementh Nice selection of gear there, somehow I'd imagined much more of the Fluke yellow with a flurry of their meters but I see the 189 is your first which explains the reason for getting one as they are the believed holy grail of meters, I went through that phase but I'm shedding mine now and leaving myself with just 2 27's, they and the 867 will be my mainstay of the handhelds. I have a handful of lesser meters with next to no commercial value that I'm keeping as general knock about meters.

Have you tried the 189 on your reference module yet to see how it fares against calibration, I reckon that it will still be within an acceptable calibration, mine were and they are much older.

Your chinese LCR meter in the centre has a massive screen, got any info on that and how does that compare against the Peak unit? 

Oh, the 189 is far from my first. I had one of the first pre-release 87s back from my time with Philips Lighting. I've had a number of the "general purpose" models from time to time since... and I had one of those horrible 2oMhz scopemeters for a while when I worked as a mechanic. That certainly SEEMED like a much better idea than it was... 

The 87 was always my go-to... I called it my "Left Hand of Darkness" because that's where I kept it on my bench close to hand, and no matter what dark, dastardly and wicked task I threw at it, it performed without fail.

THAT is the hole I've been needing to fill ever since it was stolen; and while the 189 appears to definitely have similar fine pedigree (I'm certain there must be some Welsh Warpony in these somewhere), there certainly are enough differences that it will be some time before I can operate it blind with my glasses off like I did with the 87.

Maybe THAT is the hole that I'm trying to fill... I dunno. It's really hard to make an unbiased comparison to something that's been at your side for 30 years.

I'm still looking for the LiPo I use with that voltage reference; I packed it away and now can't find it. I plan to validate the 189 and my other meters against that and some precision resistors I bought today.

mnem
*tzzzt*

[neo]

What wood do you guys suppose is the most stable? I need pair of 8 foot posts, either a 3x3 or a 4x4. Leaning towards either ash or maple. Ash is dead common and cheap enough though i think maple may do better, 
*note*  Though i only mentioned ash or maple i am open to suggestions of all types so long as it can be had reasonably cheaply and available in the midwest. Also considering, poplar or alder and i'd even consider longleaf pine if i had a known source for #0 (best, structural grade) pine. Defects are all too common in #2 pine, every 4x4 i got at that length sucks too bad to be fixed.

Also some numbers for you nerds out there, the top will be comprised of .5 inch mdf 1" white fir and 1.5 inch shortleaf pine for a total of 3 inches and will weigh approximately 160 pounds. The frame for the table will be made entirely of pine, either shortleaf or long, and will weigh approximately 110 pounds not counting the upper shelves which will weigh approximately 105 pounds with just one shelf. I intend to have the post come just shy of my ceiling, the ceiling being 7'11 and post being shaved down to fit.

Now back to your regularly scheduled program, table talk over (from me) for the day.

[bitseeker]

Dayum, I have subscribers now!  I'll have to make more glowy videos...   

That's right. TEA channel #1. We're anxiously awaiting the next notification.

Just watched the next episode. That was cool that the 5248M has an always-on oscillator output so you could feed it back in via the external clock input.

[Cubdriver]

    I didn't even get to link my own video!   

Please pardon the mess - house under reconstruction.  That damned video camera has the opposite issue to the iPhone - it has TOO much depth-of-field, and shows stuff TOO clearly!!

It seems that the oscillator is doing its thing, but the signal is getting lost somewhere along the way.  A service manual has been ordered (a 'preliminary' version; the only paper one available currently - hopefully it will be close to what I have).  Depending on differences, I may wind up ordering Dave at Artek's scanned version, too, but want to see the paper one first.  I prefer the paper versions as I don't need to print them out.

It looks like I've painted myself into a corner here and will have to document this one, huh?   

-Pat

[bitseeker]

OK, OK. I'll wait, next time.

Yup, you can't stop now. You're already two episodes into the repair. Gotta see what's causing it to read 100 MHz, too.

[neo]

It looks like I've painted myself into a corner here and will have to document this one, huh?   

-Pat

Well i wouldn't say have to, though it may be better for your health if you do. 

Just kidding, of course, though i do love watching your videos.

EDIT:
Also, Pat, i believe i found the problem in my 5340A.

[Cubdriver]

OK, OK. I'll wait, next time.

LOL - no worries.  Actually, in that test mode, it's SUPPOSED to read 100MHz, so that part is working correctly.  Perhaps it will come in from 99.9999 once it has cooked for a while - lord only knows when it had last been turned on.

I was initially going to us a Tek 545B that I acquired about a year ago in an old test gear haul and had never turned on.  Unfortunately I wasn't recording when I powered it up, as it IMMEDIATELY expelled a nice cloud of smoke from its starboard side, and for the last few hours the pungent scent of eau de Allen Bradley has been slowly dissipating from the house (that or I'm acclimating to it!).  I don't want to open the windows and lose all my conditioned air - it's humid as balls outside at present.  The smoke cloud would have made for an amusing opening to a video - "we'll use this old vintage Tektronix scope to check the oscillator in the " <click> (flips mains switch) -  - "...or not..."  <excavates Tek 516>  "...counter."

And yet another thing joins the repair queue...   

Yup, you can't stop now. You're already two episodes into the repair. Gotta see what's causing it to read 100 MHz, too.

   I should have known better and anticipated that was coming!   

-Pat

[Cubdriver]

It looks like I've painted myself into a corner here and will have to document this one, huh?   

-Pat

Well i wouldn't say have to, though it may be better for your health if you do. 

Just kidding, of course, though i do love watching your videos.

EDIT:
Also, Pat, i believe i found the problem in my 5340A.

Sweet - what do you think it is?  And t'would appear I'll be making more videos.  Y'all will have no one but yourselves to blame - remember that!   

-Pat

[neo]

It looks like I've painted myself into a corner here and will have to document this one, huh?   

-Pat

Well i wouldn't say have to, though it may be better for your health if you do. 

Just kidding, of course, though i do love watching your videos.

EDIT:
Also, Pat, i believe i found the problem in my 5340A.

Sweet - what do you think it is?  And t'would appear I'll be making more videos.  Y'all will have no one but yourselves to blame - remember that!   

-Pat

Not sweet, something on A23 went screwy and short of pulling every single part and testing them i've run out of ideas. Everything in the counter behaves as it should except for the small glitch, the glitch which happens to involve counting. After all when you hear hoofbeats, think of horses not zebras.

That and I've temporally misplaced A23...

[mnementh]

Just wanted to pass on a smaller fleaBay find... this is apparently a fellow tinkerer who has hooked up with some local equipment scrappers to make some TEA money.

This fellow, member n2cbu has high ratings, lots of interesting stuff, and is not only willing to combine shipping, he has his storefront set up to automatically do so.  This parts list has $24.49 worth of shipping by individual part; essentially a very reasonable $3.50-ish/item minimum. That all combined down to a Net shipping cost of $4.24.

His store motto is "From my basement to yours: If you don't need it, I HAVE IT!!!" I wanna support him just for THAT! 

I bought 2 of the 100ohm 0.1% resistors and one 25-ct strip of the 5315ohm 0.1% resistors. I intend to put them all on a breadboard and make a ladder strip with double rows of 0.100" pins & jumpers so by putting in series or parallel I can make a very good, very cheap scalar resistance array that should have values pretty much in the middle of every range up to 500000 ohms.

Cheers,


mnem
*Pretty good at making bad decisions*

[Brumby]

His store motto is "From my basement to yours: If you don't need it, I HAVE IT!!!" I wanna support him just for THAT! 

I like that....  far too much for my own health.

[URI]

My bargain-bin 6114A didn't come with feet.

Same problem here. My first 6114A came without feet. 

@bitseeker: I solved the problem of my first 6114A missing its feet:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/what-did-you-buy-today-post-your-latest-purchase!/msg1755449/#msg1755449
 

Hey, nicely done. Isn't that better than paying $25 + shipping just for feet alone? It seemed the right way to go. And I've now added that model to my foot donor shopping list.

Indeed, much better.
...and much more fun. Feet alone just fit to a device you already got. Boring.   

edit:
I found some readable manuals after some research on the net.
Started reading..hmm..nice device..hmm..external oscillator input..interesting device..might keep it..   

LOL! It was bound to happen. Do you have other LCR meters to compare it with? I'd be interested to see how it performs relative to some modern stuff.

I have a direct successor here at my bench, an HP 4263A LCR meter. -I'm curious comparing both instruments myself provided it's working.

[URI]

The 87 was always my go-to... I called it my "Left Hand of Darkness" because that's where I kept it on my bench close to hand, and no matter what dark, dastardly and wicked task I threw at it, it performed without fail.

Yep, the Fluke 87 (started with III at work) are dead proof and more stable than any other DMM I've ever used.
At work we have some calibrated ones and the rest is uncalibrated. Both groups don't differ significantly and I wonder if the calibration service really had to trim one of the calibrated 87s through the calibration process.   
Unsurprisingly I own an 85 III (little brother with slightly weaker specs) and an 87V meanwhile.   

THAT is the hole I've been needing to fill ever since it was stolen; and while the 189 appears to definitely have similar fine pedigree (I'm certain there must be some Welsh Warpony in these somewhere), there certainly are enough differences that it will be some time before I can operate it blind with my glasses off like I did with the 87.

Maybe THAT is the hole that I'm trying to fill... I dunno. It's really hard to make an unbiased comparison to something that's been at your side for 30 years.

Sounds like a trauma -I hope you found the cure now!   

[med6753]

All this good stuff took place over night while I was working some overtime. Gotta go watch those videos. 

Anyway, going after the 0.2V position instability problem on the 465B Channel 2. Channel 2 attenuator cover removed. Another big difference from the 465. The 465 has just 2 attenuator assemblies...10X and 100X. This 465B has 4....2X, 4X, 10X, and 100X. And once you remove the cover you can see the backside of the switch deck. On the 465 you have to remove and disassemble the entire Vertical board to get to it. This is a much more intelligent design.


The least invasive cleaning method is a spray of 100% IPA. Did that then blow dryer. Here's the results after sitting about an hour. 1V p-p in the 0.2V position absolutely stable. Another successful repair.

[Specmaster]

Excellent repair job there med6753, I have never thought about using IPA as a switch/contact cleaner before. Can you buy it already in a aerosol format or do you have transfer it into one of those squeezy bottles? 

[med6753]

Excellent repair job there med6753, I have never thought about using IPA as a switch/contact cleaner before. Can you buy it already in a aerosol format or do you have transfer it into one of those squeezy bottles? 

Nope, bought a MG Chemicals 945mL 99.9% IPA bottle from Amazon and poured some into a standard cleaner spray bottle. It works great!   

[med6753]

And since there was a fail on the burn-in cycle that counter has been reset to zero. I want to see at least 2 defect free burn-in's before I'll consider doing final calibration. So it's back on the cart cooking.