Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread

[bd139]

T440/450 hybrid FrankenPad here running windows 10. Very little hassle now on windows 10. Doesn't get in the way at all.

[0culus]

There's a reason I still have an old CF-29 Toughbook under the bench. XP stable like the rock of Gibraltar, serial and parallel built-in, backlit keyboard and touchscreen. Yeah, the screen's a little dim and yellow... but If I can't fix whatever I'm connecting to with it, I can beat the damned thing to death with it. 

mnem
*toddles off to ded*

They sure don't make stuff like they used to....for me the sweet spot with Windows was 7 Pro. Ran that for years on my now-dead gaming rig, till new games demanding new directX versions appeared.

I wish Thinkpads were actually as nice as they were when IBM owned the line.  This one is pretty much ok, but it's a shadow of the old ones.

Since my need for speed wrt computing power is rather low, and lots of software I run was written in the win7 era, I have four Dell business class machines I use for radio and electronics related tasks. Windows 7 Pro is reliable, not overburdened with "improvements" and does not participate in the "you will update your computer os now or you will stop using your computer" paradigm that Microsoft insists is for my own well-being.  I am not quite sure what I am going to do when official support stops next year but for now, good enough!

And oh yeah, there's the CF25 running DOS 6.22 and WfW for the really old software that I still keep handy.

I still have the Win7 Pro DVD that I bought when I build that computer. I'd totally keep using it on an older machine that doesn't need network connectivity.

[bd139]

Just remember win7 is EOL on Jan 14 2020. At which point I will come and personally confiscate your fingers if you have it installed on a machine that isn't airgapped for the good of the Internet

[med6753]

T440/450 hybrid FrankenPad here running windows 10. Very little hassle now on windows 10. Doesn't get in the way at all.

Running WIN10 on this laptop and I'm OK with it EXCEPT when MS releases those version updates and they can't make up their mind on "homegroup" or "no homegroup". Currently they are on the "no homegroup" kick and it completely fucks up my home network. I have to go in and manually fix stuff so the WIN7 machines can communicate with it.

[mnementh]

Yes, I know this, since I do really like the music from this aera.
And, usually, I'm holding this against to some of my friends.

And now what comes is all your fault, you gave me the idea for a TEA hymn!
And I'm sorry for the crude english, it is not really my mother tounge
but I tried and did the best I could do.
Any improvements, corrections, whatever are very welcome!  

Music:  Eagles - Hotel California
Lyrics: Eagles

Adapted lyrics: BU508A / Mounty

Welcome to the T E A forum

....You can check out any time you like,
But you can't never leave!'

<lots of electric guitar playing and clicking relays>

Well and truly filked, Mounty! Thank you for sharing!

mnem
*sent by threatening an iPad with exploratory surgery*

[Mr. Scram]

Just remember win7 is EOL on Jan 14 2020. At which point I will come and personally confiscate your fingers if you have it installed on a machine that isn't airgapped for the good of the Internet

"Yeah but the actual risk is slim just don't do anything stupid"

[mnementh]

In Other News...

The new MB is in the box and cables made up; it POSTs and boots to BIOS. BUT...

The damn USB ports are now all flaky as hell; mouse freezes up and keyboard acting like there’s a key pressed and held most of he time.   

This after it performed flawlessly on the bench for more than an hour while I puttered around setting up the fans and CPU pump and stuff.

It took half an hour of unplugging/replugging mouse/KB to complete a BIOS update... I can’t even get into the “Tweak” submenu to tune the OC.   

Done all the usual troubleshooting; new mouse/KB, different PSU...

I’m on the road doing family stuff; when we get home I’ll  strip it down to RAM & CPU... again.

mnem
    Okay... I think I’ve bled enough for this bleeding edge.

[nixiefreqq]

don't you just hate to break a promise to yourself?

said 4 years  ago when we downsized and moved......"no more tube radios".

walked away from this POS radio and almost made it 50 ft before turning around and offering the guy 20 bucks (this morning at the berryville hamfest).

in my defense.......somewhere between 1965 and 1967 my old man came home with the brother to this one.  AND HE GAVE IT TO ME!

he supervised my first ever electronic repair when we replaced a filter cap. (of course it was a bodge and we only replaced one cap in a multi-section electrolytic).  lost track of that radio some time in the early 80's.

this one hums too and the bfo (cw switch) does not seem to work.  if i'd found this one last summer the old man coulda' helped me fix it too........  oh well...... he was ornery, stubborn, and didn't seem to realize WWII was over and the world had changed.......and i miss him.

ps  yeah i know.  non-polarized plug and it is a transformerless death trap.   was maybe 12 the first time i plugged it in wrong and got knocked on my ass touching the hot chassis.  will find a way to re-cord the bitch before actually using it.




 

[bd139]

That’s the ugliest most dangerous thing I’ve ever seen. I love it 

Just remember win7 is EOL on Jan 14 2020. At which point I will come and personally confiscate your fingers if you have it installed on a machine that isn't airgapped for the good of the Internet

"Yeah but the actual risk is slim just don't do anything stupid"

It isn’t that slim. I watched a small company getting buggered last year after a data breach on XP.

Edit: Using EOL windows is like bagging a redhead. And we all know where that leads 

[BU508A]

Edit: Using EOL windows is like bagging a redhead. And we all know where that leads 

Ireland?   

[bd139]

I was thinking emotional and financial ruin 

[BU508A]

The two are not mutually exclusive. 

I believe, the British people are experts to this subject when it comes to North Ireland. 

[bd139]

Ooh headshot. Yes we are indeed 

[Mr. Scram]

It isn’t that slim. I watched a small company getting buggered last year after a data breach on XP.

Edit: Using EOL windows is like bagging a redhead. And we all know where that leads 

You wouldn't believe how many people think it's alarmist nonsense, although I suspect you know all to well. Or that keeping your applications up to date will protect Windows.

[bd139]

Believe me I do. I work in the finance sector mostly which is a combination of the most important data to secure past medical info, but run by the cheapest bastards on the planet. I saw one company that managed to get themselves into a maintenance contract with an MSP after being missold Citrix and the MSP wanted to charge them for updates. What did they do? Well basically told the MSP to fuck off. Unpatched stock windows Server 2008 with circa 2010 updates in 2017  . Talking to their IT director "it'll be fine".

Edit: just to note this was also the company I found bloody Nectar points toolbar (basically data leak) installed on all their fucking machines in unpatched IE10

[GreyWoolfe]

There is no end of this road, is it?      

You can check out any time you like, but you can never leave.

Hotel California, The Eagles, in case you don't get the reference.

Yes, I know this, since I do really like the music from this aera.
And, usually, I'm holding this against to some of my friends.

And now what comes is all your fault, you gave me the idea for a TEA hymn!
And I'm sorry for the crude english, it is not really my mother tounge
but I tried and did the best I could do.
Any improvements, corrections, whatever are very welcome!  

Music:  Eagles - Hotel California
Lyrics: Eagles

Adapted lyrics: BU508A / Mounty

Welcome to the T E A forum

<chorus>
Welcome to the T E A forum
Such a lovely place (such a lovely place)
Such a lovely space
Plenty of gear at the T E A forum
Any time of year (any time of year) you can find it here
</chorus>

1. verse

On a small messy workbench, lots of blinkin' gear
Warm smell of hot soldar, rising up in the air
Up ahead on the ebay, used stuff show up oh dear
I get excited what it could be
I need another test(ing) gear

There it was can't looking away
I heard the alarming bell
And I was thinking to myself
This could be heaven or this could be Hell
Then I clicked on the offer and it was on it's way
There were voices in the loudspeakers
I thought I heard them say

<CHORUS>

2. verse

The item arrived the other day, it got it's handles bent
Otherwise it was in a good shape, I will show it to a friend
I will go for some advice, sweet fixing sweat
Some repair to remember, lots of curse, no regret

So I wrote to the TEA group
"Look! This is all mine!"
They wrote, 'we haven't seen this gear here since twothousand-nine'
And still those voices are calling from far away
Wake you up in the middle of the night
Just to hear them say

<chorus>
Welcome to the T E A forum
Such a lovely place (such a lovely place)
Such a lovely space
They livin' it up in the T E A forum
Lots of instruments (lots of instruments), want adjustments
</chorus)

3. verse

Scopes in the cupboard
Next to voltmeters, likewise
And they wrote, 'we are all just gadgeteers here, of our own device'
And in the TEA forum
They collecting all the gear
Fixing all of them which is imprecise
With their habit of an engineer

Last thing I remember, I was
Power off the store
I had to find the exit back to the life I lived before
'Relax' wrote the TEA group
We are programmed to conceive
You can check out any time you like,
But you can't never leave!'

<lots of electric guitar playing and clicking relays>

Edit: typos

That is awesome!!!!

A toast to BU.  Let us raise our glasses and quaff a tasty beverage as we shout Huzzah, Huzzah, Huzzah!!

PS: I prefer the redone version on the Hell Freezes Over album as compared to the original.  I really like the opening.

[mnementh]

   don't you just hate to break a promise to yourself?   said 4 years  ago when we downsized and moved......"no more tube radios".

walked away from this POS radio and almost made it 50 ft before turning around and offering the guy 20 bucks (this morning at the berryville hamfest).   in my defense.......somewhere between 1965 and 1967 my old man came home with the brother to this one.  AND HE GAVE IT TO ME!   he supervised my first ever electronic repair when we replaced a filter cap. (of course it was a bodge and we only replaced one cap in a multi-section electrolytic).  lost track of that radio some time in the early 80's.

this one hums too and the bfo (cw switch) does not seem to work.  if i'd found this one last summer the old man coulda' helped me fix it too........  oh well...... he was ornery, stubborn, and didn't seem to realize WWII was over and the world had changed.......and i miss him.

ps  yeah i know.  non-polarized plug and it is a transformerless death trap.   was maybe 12 the first time i plugged it in wrong and got knocked on my ass touching the hot chassis.  will find a way to re-cord the bitch before actually using it.

Lessons of a lifetime. For me it was hand-winding a 3KV transformer for an 80m linear onto the core out of a battery charger for my grandfather; what I wouldn't give to hear his rough, gravelly voice over my shoulder one more time, even if it was just bitching me out for the latest bit of dumbassery I'd committed.

Using EOL windows is like bagging a redhead. And we all know where that leads 

Marriage and two beautiful children? 

mnem
*Almost awake enough to start troubleshooting that effing Ryzen build*

[factory]

TEA is really a plague! 

Once I sneaked around ebay (yes, here the evil starts) I stumbled over a
HP 3460A meter. A 6 1/2 digit nixe tube digital voltmeter for EUR 120.- in "for parts only / defect" condition.

I couldn't resist and pulled the trigger. 
Now I can't wait until it arrives.   

This is the evil thing:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/202722194710

picture of it:


I hope that the surprises won't be that nasty. We'll see.

Now I'm looking for a service manual which doesn't cost a fortune for shipping...

There is no end of this road, is it?      

The 3460A is only 5 1/2 digit unless you got the H04 option, but the standard 5 1/2 version does accept the option PCB's for the 3461A AC/ohms converter.

It comes with no power cord and it has this weird oval HP connector.
But, surprisingly, a guy is offering some of those cords, so I ordered two of them:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/202531165401

Picture:

Be sure that's actually an HP cord - there are TWO varieties of oval connector and they are wired differently.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/repair/replacing-hp-oval-style-power-connector/

Also see the PH-163 info & PDF linked from the Electronics Miscellany section in the "points of interest" in the first post. The European mains plugs fitted to those leads are not polarized, so it's 50/50% chance of getting the live/hot connected to the fuse/switch side of HP test gear anyway.

David

P.S. Did anyone buy the HP 2402A manual? I'm curious to what serial number range it covers.

[med6753]

Using EOL windows is like bagging a redhead. And we all know where that leads 

Marriage and two beautiful children? 

mnem
*Almost awake enough to start troubleshooting that effing Ryzen build*

That's the exception rather than the rule. 

[factory]

Finally some time for TEA indulgence.  At a hamfest a few months back, I found a B+K 501A curve tracer. The seller had no idea if it worked and gave it to me for twenty-five bucks.  I put it on the shelf when I got home, lured by the siren call of some of the more complex gear in the repair queue. I pulled it out tonight to see if it worked (and if I could remember how to set up a scope in XY mode)...



[snip}

I am going to snuggle with the manual and get reacquainted with how these things work. After I do that, I will decide if I want to tear it completely down, and check to see if all the parts are still in tolerance given that the caps and carbon comp resistors are, I dunno, forty-five years old. 

Oh, one neat feature... the 501A has two sets of sockets so you can match transistors, whether of the same type or complementary.  And the sweep voltage goes up to 100V, so it will handle power transistors.

That was a very good price, I paid quite a lot more for my Heathkit IT-1121.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/test-equipment-anonymous-(tea)-group-therapy-thread/msg1766804/#msg1766804

Very handy for testing/comparing old obsolete components to find more readily available ones, also great for checking unusual parts such as tunnel diodes.

David

P.S. I'm curious to see what is inside the Leader LTC-905, which is the only other small vintage curve tracer I've seen for sale in the UK.

Leader LTC-905 photo as per requested 

Just catching up again, thanks for those pictures of the Leader curve tracer, looks much easier to service the PCB than with the Grief-kit, I really ought to check how many components are past their use by date or drifted out of tolerance.

David

[factory]

Once owned by Kierkegaard:

Ebay title:
HP 606A Rack Mounted / Existential Signal Generator Power Up

eBay auction: #352737876458

Completely missing either the standard case or rack mount case, the front panel is the same for both, the line filter & serial number is on the case too. 

On the matter of tubes, this turned up on ebay here: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/362703413572 ... wondering if I should try and save it before it is pillaged!

Did you manage to save it? That seller had lots of nice stuff.

This Dana 5330 voltmeter listed on ePay.com in the wrong category may be of interest here, it has nixie bulbs:
eBay auction: #254237958335

David

[mnementh]

In Other News...

The new MB is in the box and cables made up; it POSTs and boots to BIOS. BUT... The damn USB ports are now all flaky as hell; mouse freezes up and keyboard acting like there’s a key pressed and held most of he time.    This after it performed flawlessly on the bench for more than an hour while I puttered around setting up the fans and CPU pump and stuff.    It took half an hour of unplugging/replugging mouse/KB to complete a BIOS update... I can’t even get into the “Tweak” submenu to tune the OC.    Done all the usual troubleshooting; new mouse/KB, different PSU...

I’m on the road doing family stuff; when we get home I’ll  strip it down to RAM & CPU... again.

mnem
   Okay... I think I’ve bled enough for this bleeding edge.

It was the effing nvme/M.2 drives. Either slot occupied makes it do this. 

Oklay... must be some conflict on the PCIE bus.     I wonder what stupid setting they left on by default that I missed the first time I read TFM.

mnem
Nice pants.

[Cubdriver]

This Dana 5330 voltmeter listed on ePay.com in the wrong category may be of interest here, it has nixie bulbs:
eBay auction: #254237958335

David

Damn you!!!       

 
-Pat

[Neomys Sapiens]

I have another question for the TEA hivemind.

I want to buy/build a shielded low-ish Thermal EMF cable with banana jacks at each end. Nothing to volt-nuttery, but something better than a couple multimeter leads.
I have seen Pomona make individual low EMF leads, but nothing as a single shielded cable (that I can see).

Anyone got any suggestions?

Use a triaxial cable (if not metrology grade, maybe 1553B cable), or a nice flexible shielded, twisted pair like MIL-W-22759. You can select from bare, tinned, or silver-coated wire and various insulation variants.
Add good plugs and give it a try.

[syau]

Finally some time for TEA indulgence.  At a hamfest a few months back, I found a B+K 501A curve tracer. The seller had no idea if it worked and gave it to me for twenty-five bucks.  I put it on the shelf when I got home, lured by the siren call of some of the more complex gear in the repair queue. I pulled it out tonight to see if it worked (and if I could remember how to set up a scope in XY mode)...



[snip}

I am going to snuggle with the manual and get reacquainted with how these things work. After I do that, I will decide if I want to tear it completely down, and check to see if all the parts are still in tolerance given that the caps and carbon comp resistors are, I dunno, forty-five years old. 

Oh, one neat feature... the 501A has two sets of sockets so you can match transistors, whether of the same type or complementary.  And the sweep voltage goes up to 100V, so it will handle power transistors.

That was a very good price, I paid quite a lot more for my Heathkit IT-1121.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/test-equipment-anonymous-(tea)-group-therapy-thread/msg1766804/#msg1766804

Very handy for testing/comparing old obsolete components to find more readily available ones, also great for checking unusual parts such as tunnel diodes.

David

P.S. I'm curious to see what is inside the Leader LTC-905, which is the only other small vintage curve tracer I've seen for sale in the UK.

Leader LTC-905 photo as per requested 

Just catching up again, thanks for those pictures of the Leader curve tracer, looks much easier to service the PCB than with the Grief-kit, I really ought to check how many components are past their use by date or drifted out of tolerance.

David

I ended up buying a 54600B so as to capture the screen