Author Topic: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread  (Read 4333054 times)

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69525 on: September 15, 2020, 09:24:32 pm »
A D83 if I'm not mistaken.  :popcorn:

You are mistaken. But close-ish :)



Still can't believe I got that for 50 quid. I walked away from that hamfest with change from 100 quid (!)
 
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69526 on: September 15, 2020, 09:26:27 pm »
A D83 if I'm not mistaken.  :popcorn:

You are mistaken. But close-ish :)



Still can't believe I got that for 50 quid. I walked away from that hamfest with change from 100 quid (!)
OK, both use a Tek CRT.  :)
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69527 on: September 15, 2020, 09:29:30 pm »
Correct. I also never want to see another D83 again after doing that ass transplant on that last one  :-DD
 
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Offline TorinoFermic

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69528 on: September 15, 2020, 10:33:53 pm »
Well, I managed to acquire my Keithley 236 and HP 34401A at bargain prices at evilBay. They both work great, one is wrong item from the listing but the seller has refunded me some money and that's fine. The meter looks it could be in calibration, not that I care about sending to a lab unless you think I need ?

With taxes/shipping, HP cost me 388 USD, Keithley at around 480 USD. But I can say I bought 34401A at 300 USD and Keithley 236 for less than 420 USD.  :-DMM

Do I earn a cookie for these ?  :D


Pictures notes :

1st :This meter came damaged from shipping and is wrong listing, so I am sure I could repair the black screw with my 3D printer.
2nd : Keithley 236 is confirmed to be fully working, but albeit out of cal.  :phew:
3nd : Here's my 34401A on the tower of meters.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2020, 10:36:04 pm by TorinoFermic »
 
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Offline Cerebus

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69529 on: September 15, 2020, 11:12:09 pm »
I've found one of Saskia's Junior School pictures:

Anybody got a syringe I can use to squeeze the magic smoke back into this?
 
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69530 on: September 15, 2020, 11:27:36 pm »
A D83 if I'm not mistaken.  :popcorn:

You are mistaken. But close-ish :)



Still can't believe I got that for 50 quid. I walked away from that hamfest with change from 100 quid (!)
OK, both use a Tek CRT.  :)

Yep, he got that 7603 for a song. Then he found an SA plug-in for it needing some repair. Got that fixed and it worked perfectly. He played with it for maybe a week and then stated he had no room for it and sold it.  :palm:
« Last Edit: September 15, 2020, 11:29:43 pm by med6753 »
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69531 on: September 16, 2020, 02:40:58 am »
A D83 if I'm not mistaken.  :popcorn:

You are mistaken. But close-ish :)



Still can't believe I got that for 50 quid. I walked away from that hamfest with change from 100 quid (!)
OK, both use a Tek CRT.  :)

Yep, he got that 7603 for a song. Then he found an SA plug-in for it needing some repair. Got that fixed and it worked perfectly. He played with it for maybe a week and then stated he had no room for it and sold it.  :palm:

Hes either mastered his TEA or he cant be trusted...  :-DD

For some inexplicable reason, if I see a 7603 I get an urge to buy it. I have done well avoiding most of them, but I still have three at home.  :-//

I have justified it by saying I need one for different functions, so one has an SA, one a curve tracer and one is just a scope. All I need is one with the digitiser plugin, just because...   ::)
 

Offline cyclin_al

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69532 on: September 16, 2020, 03:45:47 am »
It's not the manufacturers fault. The regulations on exhaust gas and fuel consumption is what forces the car companies to require so much monitoring, realtime engine adjustment and exhaust treatment systems. No car company wants a vehicle that has so much complexity that it keeps having issues. That just makes them look bad, even if they do profit from the repair.

McBryce.

No. Just NO. I lived and worked as a mechanic through the smog-strangled 80s, and while that WAS a low point in automobile manufacture... modern closed-loop EFI engines are just plain hands-down better, in every way. More efficient, more power per kilo, and because they aren't running with a crankcase full of carbon coke blowby from running rich half the time, the engines last longer almost in every application. Oil changes are cleaner at 5 and 10k intervals than a carbureted V8 was at 3K, and all that not-wasted oil and carcinogenic blowby waste is better for the environment too, not JUST the cleaner air.

Say what you want about the cars themselves, but design life for a iron-cylinder-wall V8 was 80K miles before it started to burn oil, and it required carb/ignition tuneups during that usage and the timing chain was running on borrowed time. Nowadays, if we don't get twice that from a 4-banger with nothing but regular oil changes, there's something fucking WRONG. I've seen with my own eyes cars running well with 160,000 on the original spark plugs!

I agree that the car companies have managed to turn OBD into a clusterfuck of software obfuscation... but that does NOT mean that OBD/OBDII was a bad idea. It just means that these bastards are such utterly selfish greedy shitheads they could fuck up a wet dream. |O

mnem
 :horse:

You may have mis-understood the point I was trying to get across. I agree 100% with everything you say, I was just trying to point out that there are reasons why these things have happened and they were not done to make the car unrepairable for the end user nor for any other "evil industry" reasons. They were done to satisfy legal requirements and market requirements. I have worked in the automotive electric/electronic industry for over 27 years, going from schematic design right up to strategic planning, so I have seen the changes first hand. I haven't always agreed with where things were going, neither for the end user, nor for the industry, but I understand why they had to happen anyway.

McBryce.

I totally agree with what both of you are saying.  My own case demonstrates it clearly.  I can compare my first and third trucks.
The first is from 1996, was a half-ton with minimal equipment.  Powerplant was a 4.3l v6 engine with 5-speed manual transmission.  Fuel economy was 27 l/100km on a good day on the drive between Toronto and my parents' place.
My third and current truck is from 2015, is a half-ton with lots of extras including crew cab and long cargo box, 4x4, air conditioning, etc.  Powerplant is a monster overkill 5.7l with 8-speed automatic transmission.  Fuel economy is 12.9 l/100km on the same drive as above, including carrying the family and dog (which is too big to be a miniature horse).
So the technology clearly gives a huge boost in both power and fuel economy.  What is not to like about that?

Now, open the hood of both trucks.  The new truck only has the windshield wiper fill, the engine oil fill and the battery visible.  Everything else is concealed by covers that are secured with a variety of different security bits.  Not only will doing anything void the warranty, but it takes approximately 20 different driver bits just to see anything before being able to plan out the actual work.  Also, switching to winter wheels for half the year causes the dashboard displays to alarm incessantly; the winter rims are still OEM just not matching the serial numbers of the stock summer rims; absolutely frustrating!  The old one was a dream for adding extra lights front and back and a power point in the cargo box.  Clearly marked were two extra terminals on the fuse fox rated for 100A each.  Right to repair and to customize/accessorize is a huge concern of mine.  Warranty on the new one will be over soon, so I might be able to report back next summer just how bad it has gotten.

The good old days of the old truck?  They were good old days!  I took that truck on trips to go skiing, mountaineering, rock climbing, cycling, more cycling and so on.  The truck was not great at all, but the greatness was what we did with our vehicles in our younger days.  The rock climbing trip was awesome, but driving to the crag was where I discovered the truck would jounce on steep gravel roads and the transmission would pop out of gear.  Nowadays, SWMBO gets concerned going 5 km/h over the speed limit (the normal flow of traffic around here is 20 over the limit), since we have a kid in the back seat.  Yes, the driving experience was better in the past, but not at all due to the vehicle. :popcorn:

I have no problems with OBD/2.  It is just a straight-forward message protocol; I really do not think the obfuscation lies therein.  Request a parameter and receive the data; it is pretty simple.  I think OBD ran on J1850 on the old truck, but not sure since I never needed it.  Repair the truck and normal operation would resume.  OBD2 runs just fine as well on CAN-BUS on the new truck.  It does the same thing as the old truck.  However, it is all the other stuff running on the CAN-BUS or on other buses that is obfuscated.  For example, enabling the heated seats is done by some secret command over the CAN-BUS, but the secret code costs $10,000CAD :wtf: from the dealer; no thanks!  Those simple code readers are almost all using a ELM327 (or counterfeit) PIC that reads the OBD codes on the various signal protocols; they work pretty much the same on the old truck as on the new truck.
However, if you go lower-level to CAN-BUS, then things get interesting in the new truck.  Disassemble the air vent just to the left of the centre console sound system control and fish out the CAN-BUS connector hidden inside.  That allows reading and sending things like door locks and so on.  Those code readers do not work here.  The only way is to have full control of your device on the CAN-BUS and then reverse-engineer the messages.  My device for this is a Carloop.io; however, it only does CAN-BUS; I am borrowing from that design to do ISO9141 and KWP and I hope to finish that some day in the future, not sure when... :=\

Getting back on topic, there is a TDS3024B on auction with 15 hours remaining for those in Canada:

https://www.gcsurplus.ca/mn-eng.cfm?snc=wfsav&sc=enc-bid&scn=370290&lcn=518820&lct=L&srchtype=&lci=&str=1&lotnf=1&frmsr=1&sf=ferm-clos
It would be an upgrade on my bandwidth, but funds are short since someone crunched the front bumper of the car while parked at the grocery store.  Maybe the resident dwagon would be interested?  Maybe Kosmic as well, but the shipping distance might make it expensive. 
[EDIT: who is our TEA member in the vicinity of Montreal?  All I found searching back was @mnem's Montreal Steak seasoning and now for some reason I am hungry at midnight!]
My past purchases from this source have all been good units, but there is no guarantee of that.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2020, 03:57:07 am by cyclin_al »
 
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Offline srb1954

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69533 on: September 16, 2020, 05:17:17 am »
A D83 if I'm not mistaken.  :popcorn:

You are mistaken. But close-ish :)



Still can't believe I got that for 50 quid. I walked away from that hamfest with change from 100 quid (!)

An excellent buy.
The whole unit seems very clean and tidy - you don't often see a 7000 series scope without any broken knobs.
 

Offline mansaxel

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69534 on: September 16, 2020, 05:51:09 am »

I have justified it by saying I need one for different functions, so one has an SA, one a curve tracer and one is just a scope. All I need is one with the digitiser plugin, just because...   ::)

And one to fix the others.

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69535 on: September 16, 2020, 06:46:34 am »
A D83 if I'm not mistaken.  :popcorn:

You are mistaken. But close-ish :)



Still can't believe I got that for 50 quid. I walked away from that hamfest with change from 100 quid (!)
OK, both use a Tek CRT.  :)

Yep, he got that 7603 for a song. Then he found an SA plug-in for it needing some repair. Got that fixed and it worked perfectly. He played with it for maybe a week and then stated he had no room for it and sold it.  :palm:

Let’s extrapolate that out with some further info. The SA was a complete bastard to fix and it scared me owning it as the entire thing is crammed full of unobtanium parts all of which are nearly impossible to get to. Secondly that was pre SWNLMBO eviction and there was clearly a steaming great big issue for her. It wouldn’t be an issue now but I’m not going there again  :-DD

Edit: to be clear. Looking after one 7L12 based SA would require 2x 7603 mainframes, 2x 7B53 timebases, 2x 7L12 analysers, extender cards and balls the size of the moon.

Edit 2: playing "find the shorted tant" to show what a PITA these plugins are:

« Last Edit: September 16, 2020, 08:09:26 am by bd139 »
 
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69536 on: September 16, 2020, 07:12:47 am »
Top side of the pcb:


Interesting, you got an original agilent 1822-0639 in there. When you leave it connected to your PC, does it become hot? Is it still working ?

I'll test this this evening and will let you know.

I did some testing yesterday (e.g. compiled all the stuff from sourceforge for linux-gpib) and left it connected to my PC over night. Had a look at it this morning and it stays cool. No signs of getting warmer.
“Chaos is found in greatest abundance wherever order is being sought. It always defeats order, because it is better organized.”            - Terry Pratchett -
 
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Online med6753

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69537 on: September 16, 2020, 08:45:44 am »

Let’s extrapolate that out with some further info. The SA was a complete bastard to fix and it scared me owning it as the entire thing is crammed full of unobtanium parts all of which are nearly impossible to get to. Secondly that was pre SWNLMBO eviction and there was clearly a steaming great big issue for her. It wouldn’t be an issue now but I’m not going there again  :-DD

Edit: to be clear. Looking after one 7L12 based SA would require 2x 7603 mainframes, 2x 7B53 timebases, 2x 7L12 analysers, extender cards and balls the size of the moon.

Edit 2: playing "find the shorted tant" to show what a PITA these plugins are:



Good morning. Just busting your nut sack.  :P  ;D It just seems a shame after all that work it had to go. But we understand and we got your back pal.  :-+

In other news. It's freaking chilly in here. About 8 C outside. An early indication of things to come. Shut the living room window and snapped on the heater. The Type 535A.  ;D The Type 1A2 plug-in needs some additional burn-in time anyway so it benefits and I stay warm.  ;D

And speaking of plug-ins for both the Type 535A and 561B. After working on quite a few of them over the past few months I noticed a common pattern with all these vacuum tube units. The more you use them the quicker they warm up and stabilize. I'm sure there's probably several factors affecting this but I think all those years sitting has allowed oxides to collect on the tube cathodes which are being slowly burned off. Not sure but something is definitely going on.  :-//

 
An old gray beard with an attitude.
 
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69538 on: September 16, 2020, 09:04:19 am »
Appreciated  :-+

Wish it was cold here. 27oC today  >:(

re plugins warming up, possibly right. I noticed that the old valve radios I used to hack around with as a kid warmed up quicker after being used regularly. I know some of it was burning moisture out of caps, transformers etc, but tubes are mysterious in their short term and long term ageing characteristics.
 

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69539 on: September 16, 2020, 09:16:21 am »
Same here, 27°C. I hate the summer time, can't await it's end.

@med: I'd change my temperatures here any time to your 8°C  :D
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69540 on: September 16, 2020, 09:31:57 am »
Same here, 27°C. I hate the summer time, can't await it's end.

@med: I'd change my temperatures here any time to your 8°C  :D
Exactly that, I went to Mildenhall and Lakenheath yesterday expecting to get some good photos, nah, Mildenhall was dead and Lakenheath kicked off rather late and then because of the wind direction, used the wrong runway and thus no real photo opportunities and what put the tin hat on it was the fact that it was a blistering 31oC, so I'd swap your lovely 8oC in a heart beat, I like summer temperatures at all.
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Online med6753

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69541 on: September 16, 2020, 10:50:55 am »
We certainly had our share of +30 C temps here this Summer which is reflected in my electric bill.  :scared: So this dose of cool is welcome relief. By the end of the month I'll pull the A/C unit out of the window and into the closet until next May.
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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69542 on: September 16, 2020, 10:59:21 am »
And today finish painting the ceiling in the living room. I thought I had enough paint but ran out just short so off to the home improvement store yesterday afternoon for more. Within the next month or so start on the walls which is going to be so much fun moving everything.  :palm:

My next TEA project has been purchased but hasn't shipped yet. But the seller seems a little sketchy about specific questions I'm asking them and I worry I may get a steaming pile. We'll see and I'll share when I get it.
An old gray beard with an attitude.
 
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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69543 on: September 16, 2020, 10:59:31 am »
...Getting back on topic, there is a TDS3024B on auction with 15 hours remaining for those in Canada:   
https://www.gcsurplus.ca/mn-eng.cfm?snc=wfsav&sc=enc-bid&scn=370290&lcn=518820&lct=L&srchtype=&lci=&str=1&lotnf=1&frmsr=1&sf=ferm-clos

It would be an upgrade on my bandwidth, but funds are short since someone crunched the front bumper of the car while parked at the grocery store.  Maybe the resident dwagon would be interested?  Maybe Kosmic as well, but the shipping distance might make it expensive. 
[EDIT: who is our TEA member in the vicinity of Montreal?  All I found searching back was @mnem's Montreal Steak seasoning and now for some reason I am hungry at midnight!]
My past purchases from this source have all been good units, but there is no guarantee of that.

Yeah...  its up over $400 now with 8 hours to go. As Kosmic has said, Tektronix on there usually goes considerably higher than fleaBay and then there's a bunch of fees on top of the sale price.

Closing gavel $$$ will probably be scary... :scared:

mnem
*crawls back into bed*
 

Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69544 on: September 16, 2020, 11:12:12 am »
From the IF IT DOESN'T BLEED, IT DOESN'T LEAD Dept...




https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/15/us/tallest-mohawk-record-trnd/index.html

Hey, I'll take my wins where I can get 'em... a news story with no body count.  :-+

mnem
*mostly harmless*
« Last Edit: September 16, 2020, 02:57:07 pm by mnementh »
 

Offline Kosmic

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69545 on: September 16, 2020, 01:25:43 pm »
Getting back on topic, there is a TDS3024B on auction with 15 hours remaining for those in Canada:

https://www.gcsurplus.ca/mn-eng.cfm?snc=wfsav&sc=enc-bid&scn=370290&lcn=518820&lct=L&srchtype=&lci=&str=1&lotnf=1&frmsr=1&sf=ferm-clos
It would be an upgrade on my bandwidth, but funds are short since someone crunched the front bumper of the car while parked at the grocery store.  Maybe the resident dwagon would be interested?  Maybe Kosmic as well, but the shipping distance might make it expensive. 
[EDIT: who is our TEA member in the vicinity of Montreal?  All I found searching back was @mnem's Montreal Steak seasoning and now for some reason I am hungry at midnight!]
My past purchases from this source have all been good units, but there is no guarantee of that.

Don't forget the TDS3024B has 10K of memory.
 

Offline Kosmic

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69546 on: September 16, 2020, 01:30:16 pm »
Top side of the pcb:


Interesting, you got an original agilent 1822-0639 in there. When you leave it connected to your PC, does it become hot? Is it still working ?

I'll test this this evening and will let you know.

I did some testing yesterday (e.g. compiled all the stuff from sourceforge for linux-gpib) and left it connected to my PC over night. Had a look at it this morning and it stays cool. No signs of getting warmer.

Thanks! I suspect it's coming from the TMS9914 chip I have on mine.
 

Offline Kosmic

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69547 on: September 16, 2020, 01:40:38 pm »
...Getting back on topic, there is a TDS3024B on auction with 15 hours remaining for those in Canada:   
https://www.gcsurplus.ca/mn-eng.cfm?snc=wfsav&sc=enc-bid&scn=370290&lcn=518820&lct=L&srchtype=&lci=&str=1&lotnf=1&frmsr=1&sf=ferm-clos

It would be an upgrade on my bandwidth, but funds are short since someone crunched the front bumper of the car while parked at the grocery store.  Maybe the resident dwagon would be interested?  Maybe Kosmic as well, but the shipping distance might make it expensive. 
[EDIT: who is our TEA member in the vicinity of Montreal?  All I found searching back was @mnem's Montreal Steak seasoning and now for some reason I am hungry at midnight!]
My past purchases from this source have all been good units, but there is no guarantee of that.

Yeah...  its up over $400 now with 8 hours to go. As Kosmic has said, Tektronix on there usually goes considerably higher than fleaBay and then there's a bunch of fees on top of the sale price.

Closing gavel $$$ will probably be scary... :scared:

mnem
*crawls back into bed*

Other than taxes there is no fees. Shipping is normally expensive with them though (They only ship small items). It's better to fetch the item yourself.
 

Offline 25 CPS

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69548 on: September 16, 2020, 02:01:36 pm »
Other than taxes there is no fees. Shipping is normally expensive with them though (They only ship small items). It's better to fetch the item yourself.

If you're within reasonable distance, for sure.  I did that with a VNA, a signal generator, and a counter all with the 6 GHZ range extender option a couple of years ago and made a (long) day trip to Ottawa out of it with a nice return drive on Highway 7.

I just took a browse through the auction listings and it looks like that scope is the only piece of test equipment in Justin Trudeau's garage sale right now so I don't anticipate another road trip to Ottawa unless that changes.
 

Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #69549 on: September 16, 2020, 02:22:55 pm »
Other than taxes there is no fees. Shipping is normally expensive with them though (They only ship small items). It's better to fetch the item yourself.

If you're within reasonable distance, for sure.  I did that with a VNA, a signal generator, and a counter all with the 6 GHZ range extender option a couple of years ago and made a (long) day trip to Ottawa out of it with a nice return drive on Highway 7.

I just took a browse through the auction listings and it looks like that scope is the only piece of test equipment in Justin Trudeau's garage sale right now so I don't anticipate another road trip to Ottawa unless that changes.

Yeah... it's a good 8 hours round trip to me... while a younger me would gladly go just for the experience, it'd have to be a total steal to make me not think twice about cost of gas vs shipping, etc.

I could have sworn I saw all sorts of disclaimers re: brokerage fees, handling, etc the last time I actually placed a bid... I was actually relieved someone else bought the tables I was bidding on.  :-//

mnem
 


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