Author Topic: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread  (Read 14826937 times)

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Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124875 on: July 02, 2022, 11:14:21 am »
<snip>
point taken.

ebay does say:

For parts or not working: The item does not function as intended and is not fully operational. This includes items that are defective in ways that render them difficult to use, items that require service or repair, or items missing essential components. See the seller's listing for full details

however, it does seem like maybe there was some misdirection going on?   when some one keeps telling you to look at the pictures of the outside of the box and then the problem is on the inside, it does make you wonder.

BUT i would not jump on the seller with both feet until he has had a chance to respond.  like you say.....the guy who did the packing might be a drone and may not have a clue.  hopefully there is a responsible adult around who will see the dragons pictures and realize that their written description was incomplete and did not properly describe the condition of the item.
Exactly, if I thought the seller was a real chancer, I'd have gone straight to eBay myself in this instance, but I don't believe that is the case.

I recently brought a calculator on the bay of evil, not working and the seller did explain this to be fair and showed a photograph of a broken battery connector and this was the condition statement
Condition:
For parts or not working For parts or not working
“Not currently working as the battery connector is damaged - Listed as for repair - With box & papers ”... Read more


When I received, it I replaced the battery connector, but the display had a major fault on the last 2 digits, segment "A" of the 7 segment displays was not functioning which meant that the only digits you could rely 100% on being correct was the number 4, all other digits require segment "A" to display correctly. I messaged the seller directly and asked if he could offer any assistance in this instance. He responded with a £5 partial refund, which I was happy with. Job done.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2022, 11:16:27 am by Specmaster »
Who let Murphy in?

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Offline Vince

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124876 on: July 02, 2022, 11:21:15 am »
In your case everything seems perfectly normal and legit to me, unlike in Dragons' case...
 
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Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124877 on: July 02, 2022, 11:39:25 am »
ebay does say:

For parts or not working: The item does not function as intended and is not fully operational. This includes items that are defective in ways that render them difficult to use, items that require service or repair, or items missing essential components.

 See the seller's listing for full details
[...]

To me this means that yes, a missing board or other essential part is acceptable... SO LONG as the seller mentions it and the buyer therefore can know what he is buying !!!
Which sounds only fair and logical for both parties....

In this case the missing board was not mentioned nor even visible in the pictures, so that's breaching the terms to me ?!   :-//

I think Dragon has a case...
I also believe dragon has a case, but should have given the seller a chance to rectify it as it clearly is a mistake in my view and it is all to easy to assume the seller has our level of knowledge, and knew about it, but I really doubt that in this instance. I think that the listing was done by a staff member know may have been told to test it and see if it powered up and then list accordingly. If you look closely at mnem's photos, you can clearly see the power supply and logic board are there and connected, so the fact that the display board is missing, would not have stopped the unit from powering up the lights as can be seen in the photos. The listing did state that the unit powered up the lights, not nothing on the screen, hence the listing was for parts / repair. I would not have expected a staff member or the average seller to attempt to go further than that and look inside the unit.
Who let Murphy in?

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Offline Specmaster

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124878 on: July 02, 2022, 11:45:20 am »
In your case everything seems perfectly normal and legit to me, unlike in Dragons' case...
Yes, but I was dealing with a private seller, Dragons is a corporate company who specialise in the marketing and selling of medical equipment, thus a high chance that the testing / listing is the result of a drone running in autopilot mode. :palm:
Who let Murphy in?

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Offline Vince

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124879 on: July 02, 2022, 11:48:02 am »
ebay does say:

For parts or not working: The item does not function as intended and is not fully operational. This includes items that are defective in ways that render them difficult to use, items that require service or repair, or items missing essential components.

 See the seller's listing for full details
[...]

To me this means that yes, a missing board or other essential part is acceptable... SO LONG as the seller mentions it and the buyer therefore can know what he is buying !!!
Which sounds only fair and logical for both parties....

In this case the missing board was not mentioned nor even visible in the pictures, so that's breaching the terms to me ?!   :-//

I think Dragon has a case...
I also believe dragon has a case, but should have given the seller a chance to rectify it as it clearly is a mistake in my view and it is all to easy to assume the seller has our level of knowledge, and knew about it, but I really doubt that in this instance. I think that the listing was done by a staff member know may have been told to test it and see if it powered up and then list accordingly. If you look closely at mnem's photos, you can clearly see the power supply and logic board are there and connected, so the fact that the display board is missing, would not have stopped the unit from powering up the lights as can be seen in the photos. The listing did state that the unit powered up the lights, not nothing on the screen, hence the listing was for parts / repair. I would not have expected a staff member or the average seller to attempt to go further than that and look inside the unit.

Yes I agree, no matter how sure you are that the seller is fishy and dishonest, I always play it "dumb and polite" in my first message, just in case I got carried away and as you said the seller simply is more clueless than he is dishonest. This also plays in your favour if you later need to get a third party involved, as you can show that your reaction was calm and legit, measured, rather than trying to roast the seller from the get go and abuse the system just to get your scope for free ! Which then would make YOU look like the bad guy and turn things around against you !

THEN, depending on how the seller responds to that first kind message, I can now really judge his mindset and level of honesty, and adjust accordingly, and start getting really angry and escalate things a step further...
« Last Edit: July 02, 2022, 11:53:37 am by Vince »
 
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Offline BU508A

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124880 on: July 02, 2022, 12:08:53 pm »
Fuck forgot to bid on the Bourns ones  :palm: :palm: :palm:

Ah well - congratulations anyway  :-+

I, on the other hand, succeeded with my bid.   :palm:  :-DD

“Chaos is found in greatest abundance wherever order is being sought. It always defeats order, because it is better organized.”            - Terry Pratchett -
 
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Online AVGresponding

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124881 on: July 02, 2022, 12:11:49 pm »
Just scored a large size pcb holder for not very much.



Would this help you in your noise experiments, BD?  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/225044498502





This is rather nice:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/225047056319





I'll be interested to see what this makes:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/165550752303





Nice old Iwatsu:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/175334245668





Some nice old displays:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/165549041536  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/165549083783

 



This Tek plug-in extender got relisted:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/165556872123





Three of these, two from the same seller, who confusingly uses the same pic for both, and describes them as "power supplies":  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/134160123847 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/134160125091 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/134160161724





Somewhat overpriced curiosity:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/255609684670





Some test leads for BD to lowball:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/275366904661





Lifetime supply of wing knobs:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/165553976756





More extenders, HP this time, and seriously overpriced for a DIY kit:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/225049711179





Big old Thurlby linear supply:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/314053175832





Some TE that ties in with a discussion in another thread:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/225050658214





Yet more old Thurlby TE:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/284879685900





Metcal station for reasonable money:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/175337512281

nuqDaq yuch Dapol?
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Offline BU508A

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124882 on: July 02, 2022, 12:17:33 pm »
Incoming TE for next week:

Gossen MetraWatt METRAhit 18C, including the test leads, clamps and manual.

(picture from the seller):
“Chaos is found in greatest abundance wherever order is being sought. It always defeats order, because it is better organized.”            - Terry Pratchett -
 
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Offline srb1954

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124883 on: July 02, 2022, 12:34:14 pm »
Seen today on Ebay UK, anybody requiring a 50Mhz LA, starting bid of only £15...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/255609408885
WTF is this?
It's just a bit of patina. ^-^
 
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Offline PA0PBZ

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124884 on: July 02, 2022, 12:43:00 pm »
Seen today on Ebay UK, anybody requiring a 50Mhz LA, starting bid of only £15...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/255609408885
WTF is this?
It's just a bit of patina. ^-^

Yeah, nothing to worry about  :-DD It may or may not be missing a fan, but at least the display board is there  :-+
Keyboard error: Press F1 to continue.
 
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124885 on: July 02, 2022, 12:44:53 pm »
Ok this may offend some eyes so I will apologise here. 3776A has arrived. Damp box badly packaged but survived fine.

It is missing a couple of boards and the power supply does not come up so it’s scrap anyway.

This was only bought to strip for parts. It has been deconstructed to hardware and PCBs already. Lots of American screws and HP parts galore.

As arrived



Boards in situ



Guts post removal. These are stacked with very very nice parts.



We have precision resistors and capacitors here



Lots of HP leaf springs, LED displays and bubble displays!



Some rather rare bit slice processors



Also huge box of hardware and case components.

If anyone needs any bits out of this Google for the service manual, look through and and PM me and I’ll send them to you for postage cost.
 
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Online xrunner

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124886 on: July 02, 2022, 01:08:32 pm »
Those buttons and parts of buttons might be worth keeping if they are the type I think they are.
I told my friends I could teach them to be funny, but they all just laughed at me.
 
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124887 on: July 02, 2022, 01:10:36 pm »
Yeah they are the spring ones. All have good action too. 

Think I got enough TTL in there to build a clock  :popcorn:

£17.49 including deliver certainly not complaining.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2022, 01:12:19 pm by bd139 »
 
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Online factory

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124888 on: July 02, 2022, 01:26:04 pm »
Would be interested in the colored card extractors/guides, got some broken ones and no spares, will look through the manual this evening.
Find any RIFA madness inside? I can't see any in the pictures.

David
« Last Edit: July 02, 2022, 01:27:37 pm by factory »
 

Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124889 on: July 02, 2022, 01:31:15 pm »
Couple of Y RIFAs and a large hand grenade inline filter on the back panel  :scared:

Cool I will dig them out. Let me know if you need any other bits. Some of the rails are cracked and brittle so not sure how good they are.
 

Online factory

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124890 on: July 02, 2022, 01:39:04 pm »


This is rather nice:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/225047056319




Some nice old displays:


Somewhat overpriced curiosity:  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/255609684670



]


That PSU is nice, the Thander DMM is Japanese made, but not sure who by.
Oh and those displays were already on my list, probably won't get them as they always attract a lot of interest & bids these days, people go crazy on untested ones too.  :palm:

David
 

Online tggzzz

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124891 on: July 02, 2022, 01:43:44 pm »
Normally when I'm driving and see a BMW, I scowl.

Today I smiled, because the numberplate was S70P BS.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
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Online factory

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124892 on: July 02, 2022, 01:44:59 pm »
Couple of Y RIFAs and a large hand grenade inline filter on the back panel  :scared:

Cool I will dig them out. Let me know if you need any other bits. Some of the rails are cracked and brittle so not sure how good they are.

Thanks, will check the manual tonight, it is a lot newer than what I normally add to my collection, so not sure what else might be useful to me.

I'm guessing the little transformer? on one of the boards, is something to do with the telecomms input/output for isolation and not PSU related.

David
 

Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124893 on: July 02, 2022, 01:48:05 pm »
Couple of Y RIFAs and a large hand grenade inline filter on the back panel  :scared:

Cool I will dig them out. Let me know if you need any other bits. Some of the rails are cracked and brittle so not sure how good they are.

Thanks, will check the manual tonight, it is a lot newer than what I normally add to my collection, so not sure what else might be useful to me.

I'm guessing the little transformer? on one of the boards, is something to do with the telecomms input/output for isolation and not PSU related.

David

Yeah probably balanced to unbalanced or isolation. Whole thing is 600 ohms oriented.

This was 1988 -> 1995 approx. I think this one is around 1994.

I was mostly after the displays, precision resistors/capacitors and some of the JFETs in it. The rest is just bunce :)
 
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Online factory

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124894 on: July 02, 2022, 01:52:54 pm »


Seen today on Ebay UK, anybody requiring a 50Mhz LA, starting bid of only £15...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/255609408885
WTF is this?

Well it's pretty obvious, it's some kind of screen saver, to protect the precious CRT !  8)

Cracked picture bulb or screen protector? CRT doesn't look broken inside though, strangely their other house-clearance TE & medi-gear all looks in good condition.
Also I'm a few weeks late for the old Beckman counter they had, wonder if anyone saw it & bought it.  :-//


David
« Last Edit: July 02, 2022, 01:55:08 pm by factory »
 
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Offline bd139

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124895 on: July 02, 2022, 02:01:09 pm »
I saw that and went ooh, ahh and then ran away  :-DD

Got two of these in that HP. Paid for itself already!

 
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Online factory

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124896 on: July 02, 2022, 02:05:50 pm »
Uggghhh...

Okies... anybody got any tech ref on the monitors used in these HP scopes? I understand the difference between the two implementations is the 54621D and family use 32-grayscale palette, while the 54600A and family use a 2-grayscale palette.

54645A/54600A use HP 2090-0316/DataRay CDM-7SF191, the 54621D uses HP 2090-0384/DataRay CDM-7SX191. My searches in the available HP SMs and on the internet turned up bupkis.

Before I go guessing based on poking around with my scope, does anybody here have actual pinouts and or schematic for these monitors?

Tomorrow I figured I'd start looking at the  CLIP package from the 54645A and see what I can find there. Maybe lookit the video chip on each and see if I can find some datasheets.  :-//

mnem
 :=\

I'm would be surprized if they aren't interchangeable, they look to be standard bought-in monochrome monitors to me, the different greyscaling would be something done in the video processing, on the mainboard and the output just a video signal.
Certainly I saw the video signal on the diagrams for the 54645A, that was posted a few weeks back. I think the other connections are power (+15V?), an external pot for brightness, can't remember what else there is. The chip on the Hitachi CDM-7SF191 board in my 54615B is a uPC1379C, this is a sync signal processor IC intended for small B/W & color TVs and does the vertical & horizontal stuff, that is done by more discrete parts on the earlier scope displays (the only one that a diagram seems available for).

David
« Last Edit: July 02, 2022, 02:09:58 pm by factory »
 
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Offline McBryce

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124897 on: July 02, 2022, 02:15:43 pm »
Seen today on Ebay UK, anybody requiring a 50Mhz LA, starting bid of only £15...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/255609408885
WTF is this?

Plus the medical costs to recover from the multi-resistant super infectious fungus that you breath in after opening the case?

McBryce.
30 Years making cars more difficult to repair.
 
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Online factory

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124898 on: July 02, 2022, 02:20:17 pm »
Another grey box* red box (for a change) arrived today.  8)


*I often get the comment "not another grey box" when large parcel(s) arrive.

David

Racal SA 540 Universal counter


Yes the SA540 I posted on here in April I think, ended up talking myself into buying it, after contacting the seller about shipping. The seller was very helpful, I asked them to chuck away the cable & three pin mace, which they did, as the Plessey connector needed rewiring anyway. It's in really nice condition, but being Racal will probably need many replacement transistors.
It was definitely worth the wait, shame I can't leave positive feedback, as it took a little longer than ebay provide for leaving feedback.



P.S. Has anyone seen a manual for this version? I do have them for the slightly more common, four & six digit versions.

David
« Last Edit: July 02, 2022, 02:23:20 pm by factory »
 
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Offline mnementh

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Re: Test Equipment Anonymous (TEA) group therapy thread
« Reply #124899 on: July 02, 2022, 02:30:38 pm »
<snip>

gotta' agree with the dragon on this one.

with those two T-15 screws missing from the back the cabinet will almost fall off on its own.  (don't ask how i know)

even if you did not know there was supposed to be a display board inside, how could you not notice the ribbon cables hanging loose inside?

will be interesting to see how it all plays out.

edit  just looked and there are supposed to be 3 screws back there.  mine is missing one.


Agreed about the screws and the ribbon cable hanging loose etc, but I'm talking about the dragons claim that it is "not being as described", if you actually read the sellers description of the item, it fits the description precisely as the seller states

   "Condition:    
   
Overall Condition    AS-IS (Please view all pictures)
Cosmetics    Please view all pictures
Completeness    As seen in pictures
Functionality    AS-IS (Powers on / Unable to test further)"


They do mention that it was missing the handle, hence why I asked the dragon "Have you powered it up?, did the lights come on? ", if so then it matched the description as the seller also states that the unit is as shown in the photos. I was playing "Devil's advocate".

Now I may be totally wrong here, but I suspect that the seller is not a one-man band and so it is a reasonable assumption that the item might have been tested and packed by someone who does not have a clue what they are doing, maybe a school-leaver etc., the back may not have come off while they were wrapping it, therefore they would not have known the ribbon cables were hanging loose inside, who knows  :-// :-//

Because we don't have the right to pre-inspection of the auction, the burden of accurate description is on the seller. Failure to disclose egregious deficiencies is a breach of the seller's contract with the buyer and with eBay. Dealing in good faith is required; it's right in the terms of use.

You can't claim ignorance of the missing part when you are in the business of selling TE as whole and for parts, which this seller definitely is. You especially can't claim ignorance (even though it is quite manifest here; the part robbed from this unit ruins this scope and the scope it was installed into) when you rob parts out of a unit, then throw the remains into a box such that the bubble wrap is the only thing holding it together.  :palm: And the fact that he disclosed the missing handle is proof that the seller understands they have the burden of accurate description.

Bottom line is that this is exactly the kind of situation that the eBay Dispute Resolution process was created for. If the seller doesn't make it right, I will send it back on my own dime, and shove it up his arse with PP dispute resolution and negative feedback. I can eat $30 to make that happen.

And then of course there's the fact that he's lost everybody in here as a potential customer, as it is quite obvious this seller does not deal honestly. He's already proven that just by trying to sell this pile of shit as a oscilloscope with some actual value, even as a parts unit.

Remember, there's a reason this unit was chosen as a donor for the monitor PCB: there is obviously something else wrong with it as well, so the mainboard is likely not a good part either. So "Unable to test further" is an outright lie; this unit was tested, found defective, and robbed for parts.

TL/DR: This seller got caught playing the Caveat Emptor game. That makes them an untrustworthy vendor, and the folks in here need to know this.

mnem
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