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True analog scopes

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Wallace Gasiewicz:
I still think that analog scopes offer easier use at low frequencies. However I am using an Agilent 5820 500 MHz Digital scope and possibly the newer probably cheaper scopes could have better low freq uses. Maybe they are better than my Agilent in this respect.
I limped into the 21st century with my Agilent purchase, it took a while getting use to it but now I use it almost exclusively. At RF Freq, it far out performs my old Tek and HP scopes.
I have also seen some impressive FFT traces for some of the newer scopes that I am unable to get my Agilent to produce on the screen. I use a Spectrum Analyzer for this.
Also I am unable to get a usable display of a Transistor Curve Tracer, which is a snap on my analog scopes.
Maybe the new scopes are better than most people like me think because people like me are using older digital scopes that can be out performed by lesser brand newer scopes?
Possibly someone can enlighten me about this.
I still think you can get a real good analog scope at a Hamfest for less than $100, I passed a new looking, working 400 MHz Tek scope (with probes and manuals) up for around that price just recently. (because I passed up that deal, I am expecting to be banned from the TEA Thread)
For audio work you can pick up a 10-30 MHz scope for a few bucks.
I am quite cognizant about the potential for needed repairs even if the unit works well when purchased however.
The fancier the old scope is, the more there is that can go bad and the greater the chance that there are unusual parts that cannot be found. The low MHz scopes are quite easy to fix usually.

vk6zgo:

--- Quote from: tggzzz on December 17, 2022, 09:24:33 am ---
--- Quote from: tautech on December 17, 2022, 06:43:19 am ---
--- Quote from: H713 on December 17, 2022, 06:14:00 am ---
--- Quote from: tautech on December 16, 2022, 07:36:59 pm ---With that vast experience what do you recommend for
1. The hobbyist with little or no scope experience ?
2. The young professional, say the EE student with limited resources ?

--- End quote ---

In both cases, it depends on what you can get.

--- End quote ---
Are you living in the same world as the rest of us ?
In 2 weeks I can something from anywhere in the world......1 week from China.

It's not about what you can get but instead the best instrument for today's and future use....they are not expensive.
The hobbyist might pick some CRO boat anchor use in their twilight years however to advise the EE's of tomorrow to get one is just downright irresponsible.

--- End quote ---

No, it is not irresponsible. I will leave others to comment on whether a Siglent scope salesman is being "responsible" when they say that, or whether there is some other motivation.

One of the best definitions of an engineer is "someone that can do for £1 what any fool can do for £10".

Frequently during a professional career people will have to make do with what's already available because

* you need it now, not in a month's time
* money has to be used for other necessary equipment
* it won't pass the purchase request process
* it is back at base, not here in the field
* boss says you don't need it
* there is nothing that is capable of doing the jobI've seen all of those, and had to find workarounds.

Might as well get engineers to think creatively from the outset. That's not true for technicians, of course - and vive la différence!

--- End quote ---

Funny, my experience has been the opposite.

Engineers tend to have "tunnel vision"----they decide some particular thing is the problem, & doggedly pursue that, even to the point of redesigning perfectly functional equipment.

Techs have the advantage of working on multiple pieces of equipment from varying manufacturers over time & can often "zero in" on a problem by comparing how manufacturers of various devices do things.

Of course, this is you have real technicians, not the "monkey see, monkey do" trained poor substitutes sadly so common today.

vk6zgo:

--- Quote from: Mechatrommer on December 17, 2022, 07:37:19 pm ---
--- Quote from: tggzzz on December 17, 2022, 07:11:37 pm ---Frequently during a professional career people will have to make do with what's already available because

* you need it now, not in a month's time
* money has to be used for other necessary equipment
* it won't pass the purchase request process
* it is back at base, not here in the field
* boss says you don't need it
* there is nothing that is capable of doing the job

I've seen all of those, and had to find workarounds.

Might as well get engineers to think creatively from the outset. That's not true for technicians, of course - and vive la différence!

--- End quote ---
if your company cant afford $400 DSO, i suggest find another company because they surely cant make raise to your salary accordingly... i've also encountered such situation during my short time working as practising (profession) eng... but there is difference/limit between working to the limit and asking the impossible... and every workaround has its catches... be it money, space or time... you wont get anything far with $1 tools, let alone going into GHz region, unless you want to work full time as dumpster diver, but again, the catch is... time... one of it... concrete example will prove me wrong... ymmv.

--- End quote ---

It's not logical, but it happens!

One employer I had, who was more rational than many others, would let me change a $1200 27" professional standard Trinitron picture tube, or even a $12000 output tube for a NEC TV Tx on my own authority, but required me to get a $100 "petty cash" purchase authorised.

tautech:

--- Quote from: Wallace Gasiewicz on December 18, 2022, 12:06:06 am ---I still think that analog scopes offer easier use at low frequencies.

--- End quote ---
Please educate us how.  :-//

tggzzz:

--- Quote from: vk6zgo on December 18, 2022, 12:07:25 am ---
--- Quote from: tggzzz on December 17, 2022, 09:24:33 am ---
--- Quote from: tautech on December 17, 2022, 06:43:19 am ---
--- Quote from: H713 on December 17, 2022, 06:14:00 am ---
--- Quote from: tautech on December 16, 2022, 07:36:59 pm ---With that vast experience what do you recommend for
1. The hobbyist with little or no scope experience ?
2. The young professional, say the EE student with limited resources ?

--- End quote ---

In both cases, it depends on what you can get.

--- End quote ---
Are you living in the same world as the rest of us ?
In 2 weeks I can something from anywhere in the world......1 week from China.

It's not about what you can get but instead the best instrument for today's and future use....they are not expensive.
The hobbyist might pick some CRO boat anchor use in their twilight years however to advise the EE's of tomorrow to get one is just downright irresponsible.

--- End quote ---

No, it is not irresponsible. I will leave others to comment on whether a Siglent scope salesman is being "responsible" when they say that, or whether there is some other motivation.

One of the best definitions of an engineer is "someone that can do for £1 what any fool can do for £10".

Frequently during a professional career people will have to make do with what's already available because

* you need it now, not in a month's time
* money has to be used for other necessary equipment
* it won't pass the purchase request process
* it is back at base, not here in the field
* boss says you don't need it
* there is nothing that is capable of doing the jobI've seen all of those, and had to find workarounds.

Might as well get engineers to think creatively from the outset. That's not true for technicians, of course - and vive la différence!

--- End quote ---

Funny, my experience has been the opposite.

Engineers tend to have "tunnel vision"----they decide some particular thing is the problem, & doggedly pursue that, even to the point of redesigning perfectly functional equipment.

Techs have the advantage of working on multiple pieces of equipment from varying manufacturers over time & can often "zero in" on a problem by comparing how manufacturers of various devices do things.

--- End quote ---

I explicitly decided to be a "jack of all trades and master of none" in preference to "world expert in a niche". I've designed low noise analogue electronics, digital, semi-custom, micros, protocols, hard realtime software, soft realtime software, data analysis software. I have avoided databases (except to replace them with something less overweight), and haven't done much RF.

One problem is the same for techs, engineers, accountants, lawyers, clerks etc. Do you have "10 years experience" or "1 years experience repeated 10 times".


--- Quote ---Of course, this is you have real technicians, not the "monkey see, monkey do" trained poor substitutes sadly so common today.

--- End quote ---

Ditto engineers :(

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