Products > Test Equipment
What is the best way to test a circuit design with surface mount parts?
tggzzz:
--- Quote from: pcprogrammer on October 13, 2022, 04:01:13 pm ---
--- Quote from: Mechatrommer on October 13, 2022, 03:50:40 pm ---
--- Quote from: Fungus on October 13, 2022, 03:32:46 pm ---
--- Quote from: Mechatrommer on October 13, 2022, 02:01:10 pm ---what is more flexible than a breadboard?
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https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32916867562.html
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i assume you are joking ;D (flexible is in term how easy we change circuit without solder/desoldering hazard.)
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But both tggzzz and nctnico were writing about reliability which is gained by using solder. Solder-less breadboards are good for many hours of debugging your design due to improper connections.
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... don't forget the wonders of ground bounce when, given long inductive wire connections, "too many" outputs simultaneously change. There's nothing like an intermittent pattern-sensitive fault to hone your debugging skills :)
Ditto loosely coupled mutual inductors forming a transformer[1]
Ditto capacitors forming new and challenging feedback loops.
[1] example from a Tektronix 184. At least Tek included the inductors in the schematic; the horseshoe is L70, the wire hoop partially hidden behind it is L69, and their mutual inductance forms a transformer
nctnico:
--- Quote from: Mechatrommer on October 13, 2022, 04:36:57 pm ---
--- Quote from: pcprogrammer on October 13, 2022, 04:01:13 pm ---Solder-less breadboards are good for many hours of debugging your design due to improper connections.
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what prohibits you from making improper (wrong) connection on perfboard? none! make sure the breadboard and jumper pins are clean and know its limitation (not for power connection and inductive/capacitive sensitive circuitry) btw i have both bread and perf board in stock, i use which one more suitable. if i need very quick verification, breadboard is the one i grab.
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For quick verification I use a simulator.
tautech:
--- Quote from: Ben321 on October 13, 2022, 10:27:28 am ---
--- Quote from: Fungus on October 13, 2022, 10:08:24 am ---
--- Quote from: Ben321 on October 13, 2022, 10:04:24 am ---
--- Quote from: Fungus on October 13, 2022, 10:01:56 am ---You can buy them by the hundred in Aliexpress:
https://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?SearchText=smd+pcb
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That site just sells cheap Chinese junk. I'd prefer major electronic component distributors like Mouser or Digikey.
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The ones on mouser/digikey are probably made in the same factory, they just have more middlemen.
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Stuff you see on Alibaba doesn't even say what company made it. At least on the sites I listed it says the name of the manufacturer. Also I think that Mouser and Digikey are direct distributors for most electronics manufacturers. They buy products from the manufacturer, then sell to the consumer. Same as Alibaba. Except with Alibaba you don't know if it's a legit company, or some no-name shady business selling it through Alibaba on behalf of the real manufacturer, concealing the identity of the manufacturer.
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It seems you have lost your roadmap so let's put you straight.
Alibaba = business to business contact portal.
AliExpress = retail Alibaba portal used by sole traders and some business too. Equivalent to eBay that also sell some cheap Chinese junk.
A little less of your incessant China bashing please.
Mechatrommer:
--- Quote from: nctnico on October 13, 2022, 05:51:21 pm ---
--- Quote from: Mechatrommer on October 13, 2022, 04:36:57 pm ---
--- Quote from: pcprogrammer on October 13, 2022, 04:01:13 pm ---Solder-less breadboards are good for many hours of debugging your design due to improper connections.
--- End quote ---
what prohibits you from making improper (wrong) connection on perfboard? none! make sure the breadboard and jumper pins are clean and know its limitation (not for power connection and inductive/capacitive sensitive circuitry) btw i have both bread and perf board in stock, i use which one more suitable. if i need very quick verification, breadboard is the one i grab.
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For quick verification I use a simulator.
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snort, yeah i forgot that i used simulator before hand. but simulator cant replicate real life, and not every part available in simulator. but thats off topic. btw i usually go perfboard when i want more permanent (working) circuit that i dont bother send to pcb house to make, for one off self hobby use. if we want argue most reliable circuit, real pcb is the way, but then its off topic again.cheers ;)
noisyee:
When I was in school, I used that kind of PCB SMD to DIP adapters a lot. They worked fine, OK, in most situations.
In other situations, like Op amps with more than tens of MHz GBW, or modern high-speed digital devices, they cause more problems than convenient. |O Many technics were developed to solve that problems, like soldering a solid copper plate under that adapter, flying decoupling capacitors over the chip and so on :palm: Chip sockets would perform even worse in those situations, and they are expensive too.
Now I'm almost done with that adapters since PCB manufacturing is so much cheaper and faster than the old days. As for simple prototype verification, you can buy or design some specialized circuit model boards, like the Arduino and the TI DIYAMP-EVM. Breadboarding with them are much better than with a universal SMD to DIP adapter.
https://www.ti.com/tool/DIYAMP-EVM
And of course you can make some home-made PCB, the only problem is they requiring some chemicals or CNC machines.
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