Author Topic: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?  (Read 17335 times)

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Offline DougSpindler

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With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« on: January 27, 2018, 02:29:11 pm »
Trying to decide if should buy the DS-1054Z, the SDS1000X-E, or something else?  I’m a computer/technology instructor who is teaching a semester long technology (STEM) class to talented high school students.  Yesterday I was given a budget to purchase a scope and need to make a purchase decision in a few days.

My skill digital electronics skill level is on the order of a hobbiest/tinkerer.  (Just looking for a basic scope.). (Not sure if I need four channels.)
The class I’m teaching the students is based on Audrino so if the scope has the ability to decode that would be a big+1.  (I am teaching students about fames, packets and protocols.)

I will never master all of the features of the scope I will be pucchansing is one more intuit that the other?
I plan on having student use the scope with their Arduino projects to give them experience using a scope need something they can learn quickl, play around with and not destroy.

Not sure if I need four channels.  But if it’s four channels vs. packet decoding (UART, SPI) I would favor the decoder.

Other pluses with be HDMI output so I could connect to a video projector.
LAN port?  Is there software which allows remote front pannel controls?  WHich would prevent students from breaking the knobs?
Does one have a larger display?  Or make better use of the screen real estate? 

Would greatly appreciate your thoughts.

(Sorry for the cross post, but I need to make a purchase descesion in about a day.)

Thank you very much.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2018, 02:56:04 pm by DougSpindler »
 

Online nctnico

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglet scope?
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2018, 02:38:45 pm »
Get the Rigol DS1054Z as it seems the Siglent still has bugs in the protocol decoding and the worst thing for a student is equipment which throws them curve balls. A step up are the scopes from GW Instek. These are more expensive but it doesn't hurt to contact GW Instek about educational discounts. It wouldn't surprise me if they can compete (GDS2072E for example) and then you'll have a scope which is more capable compared to the DS1054Z.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline Hydron

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglet scope?
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2018, 02:53:03 pm »
The 4 channel SDS1x04X-E siglent option has remote screen/controls, none of the other options do. I've never used the Siglent in person, only the Rigol, so I can't comment about the decodes etc.
 

Offline DougSpindler

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglet scope?
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2018, 02:55:23 pm »
Does the Rigol have decoding abilities?
This is education.  When i say I have a budget of $400 it’s $400.  Any more and some administration official won’t get their pay bouns. 
« Last Edit: January 27, 2018, 02:58:50 pm by DougSpindler »
 

Online nctnico

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglet scope?
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2018, 03:05:11 pm »
Does the Rigol have decoding abilities?
This is education.  When i say I have a budget of $400 it’s $400.  Any more and some administration official won’t get their pay bouns.
Education is also the magic word to get discounts so it helps to call around! Getting a Keysight scope might not be out of the realm of possibilities as well. I suppose hacking the scope is out of the question so your choices aren't far apart when it comes to bandwidth.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline DougSpindler

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2018, 03:16:43 pm »
No time to call around for ed discounts.  My dept chair found some unspent money on Friday that others don’t know about yet.  If I can spend fist, I’ve got it.  If I have to call around for an ed discount I will lose the funds to someone else.  Isn’t education smart?
 

Online rsjsouza

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2018, 03:27:06 pm »
One warning: just be sure the free bundle options are still valid on the distributors:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/buysellwanted/rigol-ds1054z-on-sale-$349-with-options-tequipment/

If not, make sure your university will not frown upon you "hacking" the oscilloscope to get these options. Also, if you are unable to "hack" it, keep in mind it is only a 50MHz scope.
Vbe - vídeo blog eletrônico http://videos.vbeletronico.com

Oh, the "whys" of the datasheets... The information is there not to be an axiomatic truth, but instead each speck of data must be slowly inhaled while carefully performing a deep search inside oneself to find the true metaphysical sense...
 

Offline DougSpindler

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #7 on: January 27, 2018, 03:40:38 pm »
So would you suggest I go with the Rigol?   I’m teaching “hacking”....  So there’s no problem with me hacking the scope.  Other reason to buy “quicK’ is before some buireacrat starts aksing silly questions to delay the purchase.

Does the Rigol have the decoding of SPI, serial/UART etc?
 

Offline DougSpindler

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2018, 03:53:06 pm »
Rigol’s web site says it comes with the software bundle and the lower price of $349.

Arrr.  Wish Dave would make a video comparing them.  Sounds like the Rigol is nearing end of life.  But the Siglent is new and has some software bugs.  Which one?
 

Offline SkyMaster

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2018, 04:29:47 pm »
Which one?

At $349, buy the DS1054Z; and you will sleep well at night.

 :)
 
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Online Fungus

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2018, 04:36:38 pm »
Does the Rigol have the decoding of SPI, serial/UART etc?

Yes. It's an option but currently every Rigol distributer seems to be offering it for free.

If you can't get the special offer then don't worry, all you need to do press the right sequence of buttons on the front panel and it will appear.  :)

You can also get 100MHz bandwidth and a bunch of other stuff using the same procedure.

As for Rigol vs. Siglent: 4 channels wins IMHO.

 
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Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2018, 04:39:55 pm »
No time to call around for ed discounts.  My dept chair found some unspent money on Friday that others don’t know about yet.  If I can spend fist, I’ve got it.  If I have to call around for an ed discount I will lose the funds to someone else.  Isn’t education smart?
I'm putting this on a tile.
 
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Offline rf-loop

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2018, 04:56:20 pm »

 When i say I have a budget of $400 it’s $400. 
Because this,  go to Rigol DS1054Z. It give still lot of educational features including 4 channels with this price (under USD 400 in US).
There is others with lot of more power and performance if buidget is not so tight limit and if it can stretch some amount. But, with absolute 400 limit -> this Riglol.
If practice and theory is not equal it tells that used application of theory is wrong or the theory itself is wrong.
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Offline Old Printer

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2018, 04:56:43 pm »
Rigol’s web site says it comes with the software bundle and the lower price of $349.

Arrr.  Wish Dave would make a video comparing them.  Sounds like the Rigol is nearing end of life.  But the Siglent is new and has some software bugs.  Which one?
All newly released scopes in the low price market will have bugs, the Rigol had/has them depending on who you ask. They take time to get worked out. What used to get done in R&D before release is now put on the user to find, then they fix, maybe. The 1054 is more mature, the new Siglent may have the potential to be a better scope after some firmware fixes that may or may not get done to the users satisfaction. I still like the Analog Discovery for students, considering the extra tools available, let them drag their stuff to your desk :)  but I get it, I want a "real" scope too :)
 
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Offline rstofer

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2018, 04:57:23 pm »
Rigol’s web site says it comes with the software bundle and the lower price of $349.

Arrr.  Wish Dave would make a video comparing them.  Sounds like the Rigol is nearing end of life.  But the Siglent is new and has some software bugs.  Which one?

Why do you suggest end-of-life?  They just got the last of the bugs out a few months back and now it's easy sailing.  Rigol absolutely owns the entry level scope market and all they have to do is crank out scopes and rake in cash.

Siglent, OTOH, is the new kid in town and there are known firmware issues.  The question is:  How long until they're fixed?  Has anybody heard about a firmware upgrade?

Call TEquipment and see what they have to say about the bundle of options.  If you let their home page cycle long enough, you will see the offer of free options.

https://www.tequipment.net/

$348 with $745 in free options.

I don't see how you can beat this deal!

 
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Offline rstofer

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #15 on: January 27, 2018, 05:04:20 pm »
I still like the Analog Discovery for students, considering the extra tools available, let them drag their stuff to your desk :)  but I get it, I want a "real" scope too :)

I consider the AD to be a bit fragile.  I sure wouldn't turn an unsuspecting AD loose on a class full of students.

OTOH, I do like the features and, of course, the 27" display.  Portability is easily solved with a laptop.  In that regard, it is better than a real scope because no power strip is required.  This might actually be handy for outdoor robotics projects.

For the OPs application, the DS1054Z will be an excellent choice.
 

Online rsjsouza

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #16 on: January 27, 2018, 06:42:17 pm »
So would you suggest I go with the Rigol?  I’m teaching “hacking”....  So there’s no problem with me hacking the scope. Other reason to buy “quicK’ is before some buireacrat starts aksing silly questions to delay the purchase.

Does the Rigol have the decoding of SPI, serial/UART etc?
In this case, you can't go wrong with the Rigol, as hacking brings you everything including the higher bandwidth of bandwidth 100MHz.

If you couldn't hack or the bundle was not available, the DS1054Z value would be greatly reduced when compared to similar offerings.
Vbe - vídeo blog eletrônico http://videos.vbeletronico.com

Oh, the "whys" of the datasheets... The information is there not to be an axiomatic truth, but instead each speck of data must be slowly inhaled while carefully performing a deep search inside oneself to find the true metaphysical sense...
 
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Offline imidis

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #17 on: January 27, 2018, 07:32:15 pm »
Yeah, Rigol

Gone for good
 

Offline DougSpindler

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2018, 02:51:28 am »
I want to thank each and everyone of you for your advice.  Not only did you help me, but you are helping educate the next generation...  Who knows one might be a future employee of yours.


This is the first time I'm teaching high school studnts.  (These kids are smart, really smart.)  Expect them to he in the fourms oen day.  And I have one 8th grader who is just brilliiant.

The outcome of the class is to teach studnets about computers, programmingm, comptuer networking and cyber-secuirty,  I found this video on YoutTube whihc is perfect.   https://ru-clip.com/video/vXBfwgwT1nQ/arcade-scam-science.html
The lesson the guy in the vidoe is teaching high school studnets is perect.  Is it morally/legaly acceptatble to "hack" a machine that's cheating you?

So starting with the Arduino.  Will teach them programing to get the lights to flash in sequence.  (Simulate the game.)  Then buid the photo-detector circuit.  Next they will have to write an smartphone appp and quickly realize if the app is to communicate w8ith the arduino they will need to learn networking.  (I hope you find that as clever as I think it is.) 

Wish me luck.  When I showed the video to my studnts they were really excited.

 






 

Offline alsetalokin4017

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #19 on: January 28, 2018, 03:31:35 am »
Typing a serial number into a keygen on a web page, then entering the resulting unlock code into the scope... is hardly the kind of "hacking" that will actually teach anyone anything about "hacking".
The easiest person to fool is yourself. -- Richard Feynman
 

Offline DougSpindler

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #20 on: January 28, 2018, 04:43:13 am »
Typing a serial number into a keygen on a web page, then entering the resulting unlock code into the scope... is hardly the kind of "hacking" that will actually teach anyone anything about "hacking".

It teaches it can be done.

Love the Feynman quote.
 

Offline Keysight DanielBogdanoff

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #21 on: January 28, 2018, 06:05:29 am »
No time to call around for ed discounts.  My dept chair found some unspent money on Friday that others don’t know about yet.  If I can spend fist, I’ve got it.  If I have to call around for an ed discount I will lose the funds to someone else.  Isn’t education smart?

Keysight does 15% for education, no haggling needed :). Good luck with your new class!
 

Offline TK

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #22 on: January 28, 2018, 06:33:51 am »
Another good option for a classroom scope is the Micsig TO1104.  The fully loaded model (4 channels, 100MHz, battery, HDMI, WiFi, serial protocol decode, 500uV, 28Mpts) is around $475 on amazon.  You can use the HDMI port to show the scope display on a large LCD TV, monitor or projector.
 

Offline DougSpindler

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #23 on: January 28, 2018, 07:06:49 am »
No time to call around for ed discounts.  My dept chair found some unspent money on Friday that others don’t know about yet.  If I can spend fist, I’ve got it.  If I have to call around for an ed discount I will lose the funds to someone else.  Isn’t education smart?

Keysight does 15% for education, no haggling needed :). Good luck with your new class!

Thanks for the sugestion.  Do you know which model I shouold consider?  I've been looking on their web site and it's confusing.  Are you recomending the EDUX1002A Oscilloscope: 50 MHz, 2 Analog Channels?  Can only find one review and a YouTubeo saying the frame decoder has issues.  Why would I want to go with this over the Rigol?  Everyone else has said buy the Rigor.
 

Offline DougSpindler

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Re: With a budget of $400 - Rigol or Siglent scope?
« Reply #24 on: January 28, 2018, 07:50:52 am »
Another good option for a classroom scope is the Micsig TO1104.  The fully loaded model (4 channels, 100MHz, battery, HDMI, WiFi, serial protocol decode, 500uV, 28Mpts) is around $475 on amazon.  You can use the HDMI port to show the scope display on a large LCD TV, monitor or projector.

This looks intereting but there are no knobs.  It's a touch screen.  Horrible for teaching.  Studnets and I will point to the screen to discuss something only to find we changed settings.  I really like my Windows 10 touch screen comptuer.  But using it as a teaching tool is horrible.  Drives me and students crazy. 

 


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