Sencore LC102 & LC103 Capacitor & Inductor Analyzer

[coromonadalix]

loll    i wanted to decode the lc102 lcd drivers and put an glcd  or something as an backlight'ed  lcd ....  since they are 32bit shift registers

i'm pretty darn sure   you can  upgrade the core cpu to something else

[ehoernchen]

You all stole my secrete project I was planning to do once I was retired: design an open source LC103. 

I can't be happier to see something is moving in this direction.

I can suggest to create a github repo and a new thread.

It's a white gloves luxury project!

 

To make an opoen source hardware project with an github repo out of it is a good idea. Let's see what is all necessary.

[ehoernchen]

 The U30 captures look good. at least the first bytes are according to specification. I translated them to hex file. As captured and padded to the full length of the 17128.

[ehoernchen]

The U21 capture looks good as well. I translated it also to hex files with and without 0x00 padding.

[coromonadalix]

the lc102 lc103   could be remastered with newer mcu  etc ..

just a matter of managing all the I/O's  pins,  the main ADC,  you can guess all the ranges and functions switching  etc... 

redo all calculations in the mcu code and communications thru rs232, Usb, Esp32  ...

You have excellent projects and the teensy lcr project who could be a base to work on,  or many arduino ones, can even use some stm32 dev boards, plenty of power and code memory.  I want to buy an 16 ports logic analyzer and sniff an lc102 for a start  ... seems way easier to start with ?

lucky for us we do have the schematics,  sure the 103 has many i/o peripherals chips in it, and the fpga ...   

[Zucca]

redo all calculations in the mcu code and communications thru rs232, Usb, Esp32  ...

All I would ask is an ETH LXI interface. Or not? Remotely turning on 1KV could be not the best feature to have.

[aarons]

I think I'd like the standard set of kelvin BNC connectors so we can use the various fixtures made for those, instead of having to use test leads. Also remembering the lead calibration values, computing Q, and a single button you can press to run multiple tests and displaying all parameters at once.

[coromonadalix]

Lc103  cal software   repost   7 days


https://limewire.com/d/KjRrF#sTpbg4OcUy

[ci11]

A quick heads-up for LC103 users:

I recently found that mine could no longer generate the high voltage needed for leakage tests. No matter what I set the required voltage to, it would not generate more than 2V out. Looking at the PCB, the largest heatsink is on Q9, a BU508A, and measuring it shows that it shorted. The BU508A is substituted by a slightly different package, the BU508AW, which fits just fine in the existing heatsink. Replacing this part, along with its current-limiting resistor R91 and diode D19 got it working again. The D19 BYD77G diode is no longer available but it can be substituted by a Diotec RAL1G.

Hope this is helpful to some of you.

[BU508A]

Yeah, sometimes some of us are failing¹.     




¹Especially the ones in the horizontal deflection / HV part of old TV sets.
I have replaced many of them.

[ci11]

Yeah, sometimes some of us are failing¹.     




¹Especially the ones in the horizontal deflection / HV part of old TV sets.
I have replaced many of them.

Touché!

[michalzi]

Hello guys, it's now ac couple of years ago that this initial post started and the CAL-Software for the LC103 was distributed several times inbetween.
Was anybody of you inbetween been able to finally perform a successful calibration (correct wording: adjustment)  on an LC103?

What's the today's level of experience with LC103 calibration/adjustment?

The reason for my question is, that I was asked to repair/calibrate a broken LC103 and I really would like to know the chances for being successful before I agree to this repair ;-)

Marc DL8ABE

[HighVoltage]

My LC103 is spot on for the calibration and there was no need to change anything. So, therefore I have not even installed the software.

[coromonadalix]

Hello guys, it's now ac couple of years ago that this initial post started and the CAL-Software for the LC103 was distributed several times inbetween.
Was anybody of you inbetween been able to finally perform a successful calibration (correct wording: adjustment)  on an LC103?

What's the today's level of experience with LC103 calibration/adjustment?

The reason for my question is, that I was asked to repair/calibrate a broken LC103 and I really would like to know the chances for being successful before I agree to this repair ;-)

Marc DL8ABE

It took quite a while to get a software copy,  thks to the poster

go ahead install it and check if you have everything to do the job ....   you need reference parts too,  and that was another topic ...  the software is a part of it

Im not quite convinced we have everything to do the job  ....  i had no time to play with the software  since i have other lcr's

so the chances as of now is NONE

Others members haven't reported ...

[michalzi]

go ahead install it and check if you have everything to do the job ....   you need reference parts too,  and that was another topic ...  the software is a part of it

That's what I also learned. The biggest roadblocks are supposed to be the several (?) "calibration boxes" that Sencore does refer to in his calibration procedure document. And as I understand that, even these boxes have been controlled by "IEEE" (so says the manual; maybe they mean IEEE488=GPIB=HPIB?), so possibly not replaceable by a manually operated standard capacitance or resistor decade box.

go ahead install it and check if you have everything to do the job ....

I cannot, as I have no LC103 here around to play with and to try a computer connection. There are very very rare here in germany. This broken LC103 I am talking about would come from the USA to me, so high shipping costs involved. Thatswhy I only would accept the repair "job", if I really have a chance for success. Anything else would not be fair to the seller and his expenses.

so the chances as of now is NONE

Yep, that was my feeling as well as I crawled through this post. 

However, this place here is obviously one of the most experienced one's for the LC103, so best chances -if any- then here!

Marc

[coromonadalix]

send it to me  loll          i'll check it for free,   could be supply issues, relay issue, something simple, and well check on how to ship it to you

there is some leaked / dumped eeproms to get at least the highest found version

yes the famous boxes / references kits     

to me i would not be surprised they are the same as for the lc102,   controlled parts values / precision for sure etc ...   they are the same beasts,  the 103 does  in place serial or parallel part check,  but basically they have the same core functions,

but 103 is way more sophisticated in the mcu parts i/o extenders on the main pcb ....

[ci11]

Here's my 2¢'s worth having just restored my LC103 and had a chance to compare it with my normal LCR, a Stanford Research SR720.

For servicing capacitors, the LC103 has one function that makes it invaluable: an easy to use facility for leakage testing and capacitor reforming. This is especially indispensable when dealing with vintage axial caps that are hard to replace. There are other LCRs that do this but none as effortlessly and informatively as the LC103. For measuring capacitors though, the LC103 is not at the top of the heap as its inherent and displayed precision is not as good as many bench LCR's, and there is no provision for 4-wire measurements or in-house calibration routines.

The LC103 was aimed at service applications and for precise measurements - likely the reason for a calibration - I'd use another instrument.

[michalzi]

Thanks for explaining, but as I already own an LC102, I do not need to be convinced 
I even made a few small youtube videos during its repair, so in general I know the main priciple how it measures. I always considered the lots of trimpots as positive attribute- as it definately proofed during alignment.

So as I was offered the LC103 for repair, I still hesitate, if that would be really a progress for me- or causing me trouble in case of needed alignment, that I cannot do due to missing cal environment.

Any other comments that may convince me to say "yes"? 
Marc

[coromonadalix]

the 102 103  for general use are easily replaced,    as mentioned   you can reform caps and test  caps at high voltage up to 1kv, no others do that,  for serial / parallel test even some cheap ones can do that and do offer more resolution,  or precision if you choose bench ones

the 102 103 i would say,  are of specific use(s) and go in the farad ranges,   waaaay overpriced used

[the_director]

Any chance the cal materials/software could be shared again? I haven't checked this thread in some time and see I missed the link a few months ago 

[coromonadalix]

i may re upload it,   not at home ...  will do later

and guys   for the 103     

some  on the groups.io  sencore lc103 threads   https://groups.io/g/SencoreOwnersGroup/topic/117969402?

There was some huge progress,  some have reversed eeproms, labview package  and other things, found some cal commands and with the shared sw package from here   

They have rebuilt the SW interface and other functions ...   for a lc103  it's around 40 steps or more ?   not released at the moment

maybe it will work with the 102,  but the 102  need an IB72 interface witch is very rare,  and the 102  is trimpot based for the adjustments  loll

there was some clone attempts on that interface   but was never completed

attached is a possible interface made from the groups.io member ...   

[coromonadalix]

cal software link   6 days left

https://limewire.com/d/GOdo8#jBbxslKUik

[coromonadalix]

a github repo  has been created  by DOM   in the Sencore 103 threads on groups.io,  thks to this guy 

Many things there,  FW  decompilation and analysis,  annnnnnd    loll  some modern app  in python ...     

https://github.com/zombu4/Sencore-LC103

do read : 
https://github.com/zombu4/Sencore-LC103/blob/main/all_reverse_engineering/modern_app/lc103-modern-cal/docs/HUMAN_READABLE_FULL_CALIBRATION_PROCEDURE.md

[coromonadalix]

someone did a dissasembly of the lc102 fw  and came up with some infos

http://tauntek.com/LC77.htm


what is the wave screen pictured 


files from this page  attached

EDIT :  apparently its from  modelsim

[ehoernchen]

For everybody interested, I build a battery, based on LiIon for my LC102. It does not charge internally but via a dedicated USB-C port.
I attached the STLs as zip file.

Edit 9.6.26:
Cover is modified, New zip file