$300 Reward. Therm-app simple (I assume) repair

[Tonyt310]

I really hope someone  can help. This has been a nightmare. My USB power port came undone and NOBODY will repair it because they dont want to be liable if it doesnt work.  Company that makes the therm app is in Israel and they will not supply a part # . They said I have to send to Israel, I've tried doing that  twice only to have Customs send it right back.  It's a $2,000 camera app that actually works great for what I use it for.   I give up after this. . Hoping someone has an answer and I will gladly pay that $300 for someone who knows what they are doing to fix it. It seems like an easy any cell phone guy fix it job. 5 people said No. One guy looked at it and said the port needs to be saudered upside down or something. It's all chinese to me I just want this camera app back.
Heres one of my thermal camera videos , hope you enjoy it. I enjoy nighttime thermal video making.

https://youtu.be/cbh98EdIYic

Tony Trutanich

[wraper]

I repaired such cases. If it's only connector which came off, it's an easy fix. If it came off together with pads from PCB, repairing it is annoying but can be done as well. I could repair it but you would need to declare low customs value, otherwise it will be taxed heavily on import. Not that is costs full value in it's state of paperweight. Post a clear photo of connector showing it's wider side (where it was soldered). That would give a clue how severe the damage is.
If PCB itself is not damaged, there should be plenty of people in US who could do the job.

[Fraser]

This is the sad state that the World is coming to. People not willing to do challenging repairs 

This is a job that any component level repair tech worth their salt should be able to tackle. If not, their skill set is lacking in some way. I would happily take on such a repair even if PCB damage was involved.

Sadly the rejection by the US customs is not unexpected. I had a thermal camera held by them for quite some time while they checked whether it was legal to export it. In your case, this is an example of how you can import a certain thermal camera into the USA but local regulations prohibit its export. You are fortunate that it was not confiscated. The only way to get it back to Israel is to lie on the customs declaration regarding the nature of the item or call it a “Pyrometer”. I do not recommend such action as it will lead to confiscation and trouble if you are caught !

I am so sorry that you are having trouble finding a tech willing to help you. Hopefully you have now come to the right place to find help though. There are some very skilled USA based techs on this forum. You can also advertise this job on the general forum as it is ‘just’ a soldering repair. If the damage to the PCB is so serious as to be unrepairable then there is a final option...... get the tech to carefully unplug the microbolometer from the PCB and send just the damaged PCB back to Israel and describe it honestly on paperwork as a “broken camera PCB for repair”. Do not mention thermal camera ! It us just an Israeli PCB containing non-controlled chips ! The manufacturer can then repair the PCB and return it to you to be reunited with the microbolomter and the camera casing. You would need to contact the manufacturer to agree this course of action of course and they could refuse. Any calibration data can be transferred onto a brand new PCB if such is required. Repairing a PCB is often more expensive than replacing it in simple PCB designs.

If the cameras calibration file is downloaded from the manufacturers servers, upon installation on a phone, then they could just sell you a new PCB that any decent tech could install for you. The most expensive parts of the camera are the microbolometer and the lens.

Good Luck

Fraser

[Fraser]

By the way, the comment regarding the upside down connector is no problem. The USB micro connector comes in different case styles for different ways of mounting it on a PCB. It can come in a format designed to be soldered on the underside surface of the PCB but it also comes in a version that solders on the top of the PCB, whilst keeping the connector orientation the same. These ‘under PCB’ connectors are not rare and, if needed, can be purchased. The original connector needs to be inspected for damage but may be still fit for service so could be refitted. The new connector cost less than a $1.

I attach some pictures that show the different PCB mounting options for a micro USB socket I also include a large picture of your specific connector format.

Looking at your pictures, you have a top mount (reversed) micro USB connector.

Fraser

[Mechatrommer]

surely brooken and jennam cant fix that (sounds like broke into jahannam thing ) but are you serious with $300? too many hands that can do that here, just pick your destination...

[Kosmic]

Just send it to Louis Rossmann

https://www.rossmanngroup.com

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCl2mFZoRqjw_ELax4Yisf6w

He is in NewYork, and can repair almost anything. On top of that we might be able to watch the repair on youtube 

[Kosmic]

Just send it to Louis Rossmann

https://www.rossmanngroup.com

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCl2mFZoRqjw_ELax4Yisf6w

He is in NewYork, and can repair almost anything. On top of that we might be able to watch the repair on youtube 

He fixed a Tektronix TDS694C once. That was pretty entertaining 

[IwuzBornanerd]

So the housing does not support the USB connector at all?!  That looks to be the case in the op's photo.  So all they did was put a completely surface-mounted connector on the board & expose that to the stress of repeated plug & un-plug?  Heck, even the "el-cheapo" Seek has a bulkhead USB connector.  It looks like the Therm-App USB didn't even have a through-hole flange to hold it to the board.  How inexcusable is that!? 

After seeing that photo I ran a search of blog titles to see if there was a tear-down that would prove or disprove what I think I'm seeing & I didn't find any better photos, BUT I did find another topic
   https://www.eevblog.com/forum/repair/therm-app-usb-port-pad-repair/msg1481910/#msg1481910
where someone else had this same problem & he said the pads were lifted.  He also was looking for someone to repair it but there are no replies.

You are in L.A.?  Aren't there plenty of nerds nearby? I would think you must know someone nearby who could at least examine it and make an assessment regarding repair.  Oops, I see somebody did make an assessment; okay.

[Mechatrommer]

It looks like the Therm-App USB didn't even have a through-hole flange to hold it to the board.  How inexcusable is that!? 

mini USB jack like that doesnt have through hole flanges. its only the 2 big surface mount pads on the side. children are the most creature that can easily destroy those..

[wraper]

It looks like the Therm-App USB didn't even have a through-hole flange to hold it to the board.  How inexcusable is that!? 

mini USB jack like that doesnt have through hole flanges. its only the 2 big surface mount pads on the side. children are the most creature that can easily destroy those..

Yes they do have through hole pins. Either 2 or 4. Using connectors without pins is asking for trouble. Connectors with pins barely ever get torn off. And it's micro USB, not mini.

[VeryFastSnail]

I do own a microsoldering buisiness and if you think that thisn is really hard thing to solder, then you dont even want to see what I’m used to soldering under microscope. I would fix it in 30minutes, but the main problem is that I’m living in europe, Lithuania to be exact and I would love to help you, but I think it is not worth for you to send it to me... but if you need some help, drop me a pm.

P.S I would recomend to ditch that micro usb nonsense of a connector and use cable that ia soldered straight to pcb, I know I know, it’s kind of a ghetto solition, but it would include cable stress relief and would outlive you.

[wraper]

I would fix it in 30minutes

If it was torn off without pads. Otherwise it can be really annoying to fix. For example data line pads completely gone and they went directly into internal layers, and nothing exposed to attach bodge wires.

P.S I would recomend to ditch that micro usb nonsense of a connector and use cable that ia soldered straight to pcb, I know I know, it’s kind of a ghetto solition, but it would include cable stress relief and would outlive you.

Tell me a fairy tale how cable is supposed to miraculously hold there. And to what particularly will you attach that stress relief. Also I really doubt there is anything big enough on PCB to what you can solder relatively thick wires.

[Bicurico]

Two years ago I started to repair expensive equipment as a hobby but quickly dropped out of it.

While some repairs are really easy even at amateur level like myself, some repairs are really difficult (though I do have hot air soldering station, oscilloscope, signal gen, spectrum analyzer, etc.).

The main problem is this:

Exchanging a 50 cents part that requires four solder points, even small ones, is a piece of cake.

But if the PCB belongs to a 5000 Euro equipment, any error on that 50 cents part might cause a 5000 Euro loss!

And it often starts with a solder point, then suddenly too much heat and the PCB trace pops up, then you seek another point on that trace and suddenly you realize you screwed up.

Taking this risk for free, for friendship, for a small amount of money is simply not worth it. If you make the repair happen: yeah! You are a great guy for 5 minutes. If you screw things up, which happens in seconds, you are an a**hole for the rest of your life.

I guess this is the real reason why so many people refuse to do the job.

Regards,
Vitor

[IwuzBornanerd]

@Bicurico
Excellent assessment!  I was going to say that fear of the unknown could be a factor but I think you "nailed it".  Screwing up with your own stuff doesn't piss off anyone but yourself, but you accept that risk on your own.  Anyone who asks for such a repair needs to understand and accept the risks.

@wrapper also good points.  I had thought of the vias-in-pads situation as well.  While I have drilled into pwb's on occasion to access internal traces and (more frequently) ground, it is all too easy to drill too far.  And I was always drilling on boards I had the layout plots for.


As for the unknown aspect:

Isn't there a teardown of one of these somewhere?  Or are they too expensive for anyone to want to break into?

Does anyone on here know what it takes to get one apart?  Do they just snap together or are they screwed, glued or "fused" together?

I think the chances of the connector's pads still being intact on the board are near zero, so one can expect to have to attach any replacement connector to other exposed copper with wires and either epoxy the connector to the board or turn it into a makeshift bulkhead connector so that the stress in the future would be borne by the housing rather than the connector-to-pwb adhesion.  I would try to do the latter, as I expect future stress on the connector with it epoxied to the board would cause more pwb damage.

[Ultrapurple]

The ThermApp is made from a two-part aluminium casting that's held together with four ordinary cross-head screws, one of which is covered by a 'warranty void' label.

There is an excellent set of teardown photos of the ThermApp found by EncryptedEddy.

Inside the Therm-App (pictures not mine).

[Ultrapurple]

I have always taken some care with my ThermApp cameras to avoid stressing the connector for the reasons stated by the OP. Some time ago I found a 6" or so micro USB male to male curly lead on eBay and I've been using those exclusively - it basically means there is no stress on the sockets on the ThermApp or on the phone. Obviously if you bang the connector itself that's another matter.



A right angle connector may help but I've never seen those on a curly cable (and of course they might not bend the 'right' way).

[Fraser]

They put a lot of solder around that micro connector !

[Mechatrommer]

which is a good thing! thats is where mechanical load is supposed to be transferred to where it clings. if anything has to be broken, thats the first place its gonna be.

[Ultrapurple]

They put a lot of solder around that micro connector !

Yes - I expect that's to reduce the number of warranty claims for broken connectors ... 

I'm mildly surprised they didn't put in a whole load of vias to make it even more mechanically sound. It looks to me as though only L1 would have to be moved, at worst. Perhaps later revisions of the board have been finessed like that.

[wraper]

They put a lot of solder around that micro connector !

That's not solder but some sort of glue.

[Bud]

These dicky micro USB smt connectors is a bad bad bad practice which sadly is used by even manufacturers like Flir.

[Mechatrommer]

i think you should discuss that why with usb consortium. or maybe full sized usb port should be reimplemented in smartphones and mini mini devices.

[Fraser]

Wrapper,

Well spotted sir  Yes, upon closer inspection they have used a translucent epoxy like material at the rear of the connector. As has already been stated, there are more robust mounting options for the Micro USB connector and they use through hole ‘legs’ on the connector shroud. That might mess up someone’s pretty multi layer board layout though 

When I first saw the Micro USB connector on the FLIR E4, I was unimpressed, and said so. I have never been a fan of that connector but others have told me that I need to get with the program as Micro USB is well designed for mobile platforms. Hmmmmm, still not impressed with it 

Fraser

[Ultrapurple]

One day all of this will be contactless and done over radio links.

Except maybe the DC power...

[IwuzBornanerd]

 Thank you @Ultrapurple for the photos!

I can't tell if there are traces coming off the connector but given the proximity of L2 I'd guess the vias are in the pads.  Not good for repair.

Whether it be adhesive or blobs of solder on that connector, it means they had to "hand touch" the assembly & if they did that then there is no excuse for not having a through-hole part which had to be hand placed.  ...Of course they probably had to hand-insert the sensor module too.

The sad part about the connectors with the through-hole pins is that the pins are not long enough to go through most cheap boards.  The pins on the Amphenol parts I looked at on DigiKey are 0.8mm long and the ones on the Molex parts are only 0.6mm.  Neither one will go through the typical .062" board or even one half that thick.  So while it is still better than strict surface mount, it won't have the effect of a "rivet head": of solder on the bottom side of the board keeping the pin from pulling out.  I wonder if maybe the part can be machine placed only if the pins are that short.  I have seen the plating pulled out of pwb holes but I don't recall if it was only under the heat stress and impatience of rework or if it was during "normal" use.
 
Another thing that would help in this case is if there were a "boss" on the housing that touched the top of the connector so there would not be a lifting force on it when stressed, but with manufacturing tolerances only some units would have just the right contact, with no clearance & no stress on the board.