Poll

Has the hackabiliy of the E4 made you buy one :  

Yes, I was already looking at the competition at a similar price, but the hack swung it to E4
249 (26.8%)
Yes, I'd not considered buying a TIC before, but 320x240 resolution at this price justifies it (as either tool or toy!)
432 (46.5%)
Yes, I was going to buy an E5/6/8 class of unit but will now get the E4
45 (4.8%)
No, but am looking out for a cheap i3 to hack
44 (4.7%)
Not yet, but probably will if now that a closed-box hack becomes is possible
159 (17.1%)

Total Members Voted: 769

Author Topic: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown  (Read 2798063 times)

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Offline mrflibble

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3225 on: January 27, 2014, 05:54:34 pm »
Question: If I make a mistake and set my system date to 2017 before installing the software ;) then the software also make a mistake and give >1000 days trial time after setting the correct time.
Is this a bug or a violation of "terms of a license"?
Let's call it an honest mistake. ;D
 

Offline Lu

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3226 on: January 27, 2014, 06:00:09 pm »
is there a downgrade firmware option ?
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3227 on: January 27, 2014, 06:10:51 pm »
@tomas123,

Regarding date shifting.......... that is very 'old school' and is normally stopped by the DEMO software. It should log the first start date and not permit a differential in date at each start if it is negative. i.e it stores 27 Jan 2017. Then when it next starts it 'sees' 27 Jan 2014....a negative 3 year error. Same occurs for month shifting. If the DEMO software does not protect itself in this way, its is open season on it  ;) Whether date shifting breaches any software user licence will depend upon the wording of the End User licence. As I stated previously, TOOLS and TOOLS+ phone home, so that could be an issue on a demo version if it date checks with 'home' at installation, and not a local RTC.

Simpler to send FLIR a review on the TOOLS software with comments and recommendations for improvement and see if they send you a TOOLS+ activation key by way of thanks  :)
« Last Edit: January 27, 2014, 06:25:14 pm by Aurora »
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3228 on: January 27, 2014, 06:16:06 pm »
is there a downgrade firmware option ?
If the purpose of an upgrade is to make it non-hackable, probably not. However until we see anything, nobody can say what will or will not be possible.
Maybe Flir are running down stock of E5/6/8 to re-launch an E8+ at E4 price - unlikely but who knows?
Youtube channel:Taking wierd stuff apart. Very apart.
Mike's Electric Stuff: High voltage, vintage electronics etc.
Day Job: Mostly LEDs
 

Offline tomas123

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3229 on: January 27, 2014, 06:33:54 pm »
@tomas123,
 Whether date shifting breaches any software user licenec will depend upon the wording of the licence.
it was only a good old joke to show how low the security level is

Why hardware manufactures like Flir don't write terms of a license for the firmware?

As I wrote here Flir software/firmware is only low secured against hacks (in relations to the hard export limits)
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/flir-e4-thermal-imaging-camera-teardown/msg370165/#msg370165

Flir must save the sensor limits inside the image processing FPGA
« Last Edit: January 27, 2014, 06:36:04 pm by tomas123 »
 

Offline mrflibble

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3230 on: January 27, 2014, 07:15:42 pm »
Anti fall-between-the-cracks repeat. ;)

@tomas123:
Does the 16-bit radiometric video work on E4? Or was that only on the E40 and up? I recall your posts about the .seq file, but IIRC that was on your E40. But if there is some way to get 16-bit radiometric video on the E4 that would be really neat!
 

Offline Lu

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3231 on: January 27, 2014, 07:42:53 pm »
Maybe this is a silly question, but how to check the firmware version ?  I just find a small dealer selling it, but he do not know the firmware version.
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3232 on: January 27, 2014, 07:57:36 pm »
Quick check method....... get the serial number and compare to the list I have produced in the Useful information thread. The serial number is on a label on the outside of the box.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/flir-e4-the-useful-information-thread/msg332428/#msg332428

If the serial number is before 6391 0xxx it should have the 1.19.8 firmware or earlier  :)
« Last Edit: January 27, 2014, 07:59:13 pm by Aurora »
 

Offline tomas123

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3233 on: January 27, 2014, 08:45:26 pm »
Does the 16-bit radiometric video work on E4? Or was that only on the E40 and up? I recall your posts about the .seq file, but IIRC that was on your E40. But if there is some way to get 16-bit radiometric video on the E4 that would be really neat!
Yes, it was a E40. We can only get the radiometric video over usb video and not as a rtsp stream.
The USB video contains multiple "streams" and the USB "Video player" must select the stream (like a usb webcam with multiple resolutions i.e. SD/HD).
The E40 delivers two video formats: a real video with display imprints and a radiometric 16 bit stream (a Flir proprietary format)
I checked it with an USB sniffer...

a interesting flir document (page 7/8)
http://www.workswell.cz/manuals/flir/hardware/A3xx_and_A6xx_models/AXXX_Control_Image_Interfaces.pdf



I have currently not a Flir E4 to hand.
Can somebody test a video recording with an E4 and Flir Tools+? This flir tools+ format is 16 bit radiometric (*.seq).

P.S.: I wrote here something about saving an internal seq.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/flir-e4-thermal-imaging-camera-teardown/msg363898/#msg363898
Nobody answered on my post :(
Where are the nerds?
Can somebody test it with an E4?
« Last Edit: January 27, 2014, 08:54:03 pm by tomas123 »
 

Offline sosdd

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3234 on: January 27, 2014, 09:28:26 pm »
Ok, I have the advanced menu installed, and I've tried several times to install the mod for my E4. Im still getting 80x60 resolution according to the info when I view a photo.

I'm quite computer literate and have no problem connecting to the camera and think I am doing everything right.
Ive seen posts of the e8.cfg file folks have punt together, but most of them are because they are having issues. Can somebody post a completely done e8 file that has worked so I can compare?

Let me guess, you installed the menu hack and assumed it's standalone (yeah, advanced user... ic)
Your personal to-do list:
a) install mike's hack (e8.cfg included there, see post #1), compute CRC01, take care e8.cfg is written lowercase on the camera (sorting order)
b) enjoy already installed menu mod :)


No I did not assume that at all. In fact I attempted Mike's hack several times with no success long before I did the menu hack.  I was just hoping to see a copy of a properly configured e8.cfg file to compare with my own. I am by no means an expert but not a novice either, (and I can read).

I just cant seem to get it to work although the installation sofware says it installed successfully. I was just hoping for a little help here.
 

jlr134

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3235 on: January 27, 2014, 09:40:09 pm »
Ok, I have the advanced menu installed, and I've tried several times to install the mod for my E4. Im still getting 80x60 resolution according to the info when I view a photo.

I'm quite computer literate and have no problem connecting to the camera and think I am doing everything right.
Ive seen posts of the e8.cfg file folks have punt together, but most of them are because they are having issues. Can somebody post a completely done e8 file that has worked so I can compare?

Let me guess, you installed the menu hack and assumed it's standalone (yeah, advanced user... ic)
Your personal to-do list:
a) install mike's hack (e8.cfg included there, see post #1), compute CRC01, take care e8.cfg is written lowercase on the camera (sorting order)
b) enjoy already installed menu mod :)


No I did not assume that at all. In fact I attempted Mike's hack several times with no success long before I did the menu hack.  I was just hoping to see a copy of a properly configured e8.cfg file to compare with my own. I am by no means an expert but not a novice either, (and I can read).

I just cant seem to get it to work although the installation sofware says it installed successfully. I was just hoping for a little help here.

Same thing happened to me. I had a incorrect CRC01 number . If you add anything extra to E8.cfg you will get  an incorrect number.
 

Offline mrflibble

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3236 on: January 27, 2014, 09:45:27 pm »
Does the 16-bit radiometric video work on E4? Or was that only on the E40 and up? I recall your posts about the .seq file, but IIRC that was on your E40. But if there is some way to get 16-bit radiometric video on the E4 that would be really neat!
Yes, it was a E40. We can only get the radiometric video over usb video and not as a rtsp stream.
The USB video contains multiple "streams" and the USB "Video player" must select the stream (like a usb webcam with multiple resolutions i.e. SD/HD).
The E40 delivers two video formats: a real video with display imprints and a radiometric 16 bit stream (a Flir proprietary format)
I checked it with an USB sniffer...

Did you also do this check with your E4? I'm guessing no, but can't hurt to double check if I understood that correctly..

Quote
I have currently not a Flir E4 to hand.
Can somebody test a video recording with an E4 and Flir Tools+? This flir tools+ format is 16 bit radiometric (*.seq).
I just did a quick check under linux to try and access another UVC stream. And it just confirms something that I had already noticed before. The Flir implementation is rather non-compliant UVC. I mean, why stop at a non-standard RNDIS implementation when you can rape more standards. Weeeey!  :scared:

Quote
P.S.: I wrote here something about saving an internal seq.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/flir-e4-thermal-imaging-camera-teardown/msg363898/#msg363898
Nobody answered on my post :(
Where are the nerds?
Can somebody test it with an E4?
Yeah, I read that in the past, but I thought it 1) only applied to the E40 at that time and 2) if not you would surely check your procedure on your E4 as well. Or is the E4 not yours, but from works or something?

At any rate, next time I happen to be in windoze I'll give video from Flirtools (flirtools+ ?) a try. Does that radiometric video feature require a license? So far I haven't really bothered all that much with flirtools, plus or otherwise.
 

Offline stefbeer

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3237 on: January 27, 2014, 09:48:05 pm »
Hey sosdd!

I was just hoping to see a copy of a properly configured e8.cfg file to compare with my own.

The e8.cfg from the latest hack info (linked in the first post) is properly configured. Even the zoom function is already enabled in the latest version. You just have to add your serial number and calculate the correct CRC01 which you append to the e8.cfg file.
Only if the serial number of the file matches the serial number of the device and the correct CRC01 checksum confirms the integrity of the configuration file, the camera will "do as it says".

Hope this helps
 

Offline tomas123

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3238 on: January 27, 2014, 10:46:12 pm »
Yeah, I read that in the past, but I thought it 1) only applied to the E40 at that time and 2) if not you would surely check your procedure on your E4 as well. Or is the E4 not yours, but from works or something?

At any rate, next time I happen to be in windoze I'll give video from Flirtools (flirtools+ ?) a try. Does that radiometric video feature require a license? So far I haven't really bothered all that much with flirtools, plus or otherwise.
I can lent a E4 from friend. Privat I only use the better E40.
I had no time to test a *.seq with the E4.

You need the flir tools+ (windows?) to record a 16 bit radiometric stream.

Offline daves

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3239 on: January 27, 2014, 10:50:31 pm »
You need the flir tools+ (windows?) to record a 16 bit radiometric stream.

Probably only way. I was trying it under VirtualDub. It will show Flir device, connect to it. It knows that resolution is 320x240. But I could not get any video preview.
I was also trying Microsoft live movie maker. Also found flir video device, but could not connect to it. I did not tried Flir+, I am not so interested in video this time.
Batch Thermal Images Editor (JPG, BMT, SNP, IRI, ISI, IS2, PGM, TIF, IMG, BMP):  https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/flir-e4-thermal-imaging-camera-teardown/msg350556/#msg350556
 

Offline Fisher

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3240 on: January 27, 2014, 11:32:50 pm »
Thanks for the post.  I have an order in to Grainger supposedly arriving tomorrow (ordered Jan. 22) and I read a post on some other site about the existence of a 2.0 firmware and I got worried.  I've scanned the latest pages of this thread and didn't see any 2.0.  I will, of course, post mine when it arrives.

Hoping someone may have a little more information on what appears to be a recall of sorts for the e series cameras.  I placed an order the other day for a flir e4.  I called midstate instruments today to check the status and was I informed they had to send all of the e4, e5, and e6 cameras back to the manufacturer. Cited problems with the devices. They had to be retrofitted, whatever that means. Seemed like a recent development so I thought someone here might know what exactly the issue was. And if it might be related to the hackability of the current units. Hoping not. Great blog here,  thanks in advance.

I just ordered one from Granger about 4 hours ago and was promised next day delivery. ( Thanks Nazar404 )

E4 just arrived from Grainger ( within 22 hours of  ordering it)

November 19 2013
Firmware  1.19.8

Did you receive the camera? Classic one: what firmware version is it?
Thanks.
 

Offline Macnasien79

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3241 on: January 28, 2014, 12:17:52 am »
I am a bit curious, i got my E4 running with all the addition, but it self still reports it as a E4 in camera information.
it says:
Model: E4 1.1
Serial: My Serial
Part number: 63901-0101
Software 1.19.8
Is that correct or is it suppose to report itself actually as an E8 ??
 

Offline CesarEscudero

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3242 on: January 28, 2014, 12:26:19 am »
I am a bit curious, i got my E4 running with all the addition, but it self still reports it as a E4 in camera information.
it says:
Model: E4 1.1
Serial: My Serial
Part number: 63901-0101
Software 1.19.8
Is that correct or is it suppose to report itself actually as an E8 ??

No, your hardware still is  "E4 1.1", you should edit that on the EEPROM, you can find how to do that on previous post (tip, use the search box)
 

Offline Macnasien79

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3243 on: January 28, 2014, 12:44:26 am »
I am a bit curious, i got my E4 running with all the addition, but it self still reports it as a E4 in camera information.
it says:
Model: E4 1.1
Serial: My Serial
Part number: 63901-0101
Software 1.19.8
Is that correct or is it suppose to report itself actually as an E8 ??

No, your hardware still is  "E4 1.1", you should edit that on the EEPROM, you can find how to do that on previous post (tip, use the search box)

The Funny part though is that i got 320*240 resolution and all the added menu functions.
That is why i am a bit confused now.
 

Offline sosdd

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3244 on: January 28, 2014, 12:45:35 am »
Hey sosdd!

I was just hoping to see a copy of a properly configured e8.cfg file to compare with my own.

The e8.cfg from the latest hack info (linked in the first post) is properly configured. Even the zoom function is already enabled in the latest version. You just have to add your serial number and calculate the correct CRC01 which you append to the e8.cfg file.
Only if the serial number of the file matches the serial number of the device and the correct CRC01 checksum confirms the integrity of the configuration file, the camera will "do as it says".

Hope this helps


Thats exactly what Im using, and what Im doing and it still won't work. Ive done it three times exactly as directed. I calculate the same CRC01 each time. It just doesn't work.

I guess I give up
 

Offline wilheldp

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3245 on: January 28, 2014, 12:47:24 am »
What text editor are you using?  It might be screwing up the line feed.
 

Offline Macnasien79

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3246 on: January 28, 2014, 12:55:29 am »
Is that maybe also the reason why Flir Tools+ does not enable the recording possibility. as my TIC got detected as E4 instead of an E8?
Thanks for everyone's support.
 

Offline mrflibble

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3247 on: January 28, 2014, 12:56:53 am »
Is that maybe also the reason why Flir Tools+ does not enable the recording possibility. as my TIC got detected as E4 instead of an E8?

AFAIK recording is not an E4 vs E8 issue.
 

Offline Macnasien79

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3248 on: January 28, 2014, 01:01:01 am »
Is that maybe also the reason why Flir Tools+ does not enable the recording possibility. as my TIC got detected as E4 instead of an E8?

AFAIK recording is not an E4 vs E8 issue.

Got it, so it might be that actually my FLIR tools is not properly installed or I found another bug.
 

Offline Taucher

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #3249 on: January 28, 2014, 01:02:01 am »
Thats exactly what Im using, and what Im doing and it still won't work. Ive done it three times exactly as directed. I calculate the same CRC01 each time. It just doesn't work.
I guess I give up
suggestion: give EZCRC01 a try, ensure you do not pack your ZIP file too deep or copy the e8.conf (lowercase e) by FTP, don't forget battery-re-insert(cold boot)


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