Poll

Has the hackabiliy of the E4 made you buy one :  

Yes, I was already looking at the competition at a similar price, but the hack swung it to E4
239 (26.4%)
Yes, I'd not considered buying a TIC before, but 320x240 resolution at this price justifies it (as either tool or toy!)
425 (46.9%)
Yes, I was going to buy an E5/6/8 class of unit but will now get the E4
43 (4.7%)
No, but am looking out for a cheap i3 to hack
41 (4.5%)
Not yet, but probably will if now that a closed-box hack becomes is possible
158 (17.4%)

Total Members Voted: 781

Author Topic: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown  (Read 2635588 times)

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Offline Sofia

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7650 on: January 28, 2016, 01:55:58 pm »
Flir probably done in version 2.11.0 anti downgrade  :(
« Last Edit: January 28, 2016, 05:48:24 pm by Sofia »
 

Offline Chanc3

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7651 on: January 28, 2016, 04:36:32 pm »
Do FLIR post change logs anywhere? They used to have an RSS feed, but it is no longer used :(
 

Offline sonic.bionic

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7652 on: January 29, 2016, 09:01:12 am »
Hello,

yep, i just tried to order new Flir E4 and seller told me that all new cameras are now equipped with 2.11.0. firmware....
So, i will have to wait to see is it possible to downgrade this firmware or not...  :box:





 

Offline ixfd64

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7653 on: January 30, 2016, 04:30:56 am »
Looks like there's a 2.11.0 up on the website now.

Here we go again...

Offline man_of_stars

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7654 on: January 30, 2016, 11:57:23 am »
I have successfully downgraded from 2.11.0 to 2.3.0 SW and installed the hacks.

I ordered my camera Jan 11th and it took almost 3 weeks to arrive, apparently FLIR wanted to
ship with newest SW.

I used Win 10 for the downgrade, FlirTools version 5.3.15320.1002.
Hack was done with Win 7 Ultimate 32-bit laptop.

I don't have any evidence from the 2.11.0 as I was too excited to try if the downgrade will work or not.
Believe me or not, it worked for me :) Thank you all for the instructions and support!

I noticed that there is new version for FlirTools available v. 5.4.15351.1001 it was published 20th Jan, I did not dare to try that one.



 

Offline dazler

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E4
« Reply #7655 on: February 01, 2016, 09:49:00 pm »
How does the hacked e4 compare to the therm-app as far as reading temp of walls, ceiling and to see the studs.
As in the video of mjlorton it was easy to see the studs and hand heat signature with the therm-app but not so much with the regular not hacked e4.
 

Offline encryptededdy

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7656 on: February 02, 2016, 01:55:53 am »
Not the same environment but if you look in the Therm-App thread you'll find the TA has better sensitivity at detecting smaller temperature difference than the E4/8, mainly due to the lens on the E4/8 being terrible.
 

Online Bud

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7657 on: February 02, 2016, 03:27:23 am »
You can see the studs with the doctored E4.
Facebook-free life and Rigol-free shack.
 

Offline -jeffB

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7658 on: February 02, 2016, 02:23:53 pm »
Handprints are easy with the hacked E4, too. This is from two seconds of contact on a heavy hardwood table top. (Fingers were cold, as you can see from the shot of my hand.  :D )
 

Offline böjebba

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7659 on: February 02, 2016, 09:21:23 pm »
I just want to say thanks to everyone that have made it possible to make a useable thermal camera from the Flir E4. Without the possibility to increase the resolution, I had not even considered to buy a Flir.
I bought the Flir E4 in January that came with Firmware 2.8. Followed the instructions and the links in the first post to downgrade to 2.3 and install the hack and the extra tools.
Used Virtualbox with Win 7 32 bit all way.
My only issue was the USB-ports in Virtualbox.  It worked a lot better with the Virtualbox extension pack  :P

Once again, THANKS!
 

Offline targit

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7660 on: February 03, 2016, 07:54:51 am »
Hi, I have a FLiR E30 which I imported from a U.S. Supplier and its the full 30 fps version.
I would like to know if anyone else has done the E30 to E60 "conversion" on a 30 fps unit without it being then restricted to 9 fps. I can't find an explicit reference to fps in the config files ( I could have missed it ).
I don't know if the frame rate is hardware or software limited, but I would assume (don't like doing that) if it is a security requirement that it would be set by the hardware. Does anyone know this for sure?

Thanks
 

Offline Chanc3

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7661 on: February 03, 2016, 08:10:29 am »
I have fiddled about with both the older and newer generation E60s, both 30Hz models and have not reduced it at all. As long as you have a backup, you should be fine.

Sent from my ONE A2003 using Tapatalk

 

Offline targit

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7662 on: February 03, 2016, 08:28:44 am »
Thanks for that!
I'll give it a go with a bit more confidence now  :)
And thanks to the all guys who worked this out in the first place.
 

Offline targit

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7663 on: February 03, 2016, 11:05:48 am »
Hi, upgrade done and all working, even seem to have the wifi module and lamp ( can just see the lamp through the plastic cover + have connected to my phone over wi-fi ) I am thinking there is probably a camera under there too, if anyone has managed to remove that cover, could they share how they got it out, I could not find a teardown on the E30 - E60 series, and I think I would have to bugger up the bottom rubber on the handle to remove the screen/keypad/battery cover part ( last 2 screws are under a glued on section of rubber ) which I may do if its absolutely necessary to get the visible camera cover off.
Thanks again :)
 

Offline Chanc3

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7664 on: February 03, 2016, 11:13:01 am »
Could you confirm what firmware and model number the e30 is? I think the cover around the digital camera and lamp is just glued on...

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Offline targit

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7665 on: February 03, 2016, 11:31:37 am »
Hi, Part number is 49001-1601 model is E30 0.10 "software" (firmware I think) version is 2.23.14
Thanks
 

Offline dazler

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7666 on: February 03, 2016, 06:57:22 pm »
thank for the photos, it does look way better than the regular e4.

this is the video I was talking about

at around min 26 you can see the therm-app finding stud on the wall
at 28:30 the flir e4
at 30:00 the handprint.

I wonder how would a hacked e4 performed in that same scenario.

As the e4 goes for around 1k and the therm-app for 1.6k I might not need that much detail.
but don't know if I will later regret not spending that extra $ and get the therm-app.
 

Offline man_of_stars

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7667 on: February 03, 2016, 08:22:09 pm »
From what I can see, enhanced E4 outperforms the therm-app significantly!
 

Offline targit

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7668 on: February 04, 2016, 06:07:51 am »
Hi, just spent a few hours stripping the whole camera down in order to find out how that lens was held in, and you are right, it's just bloody glued on |O
I had convinced myself there was a screw holding it in place, and didn't want to trash the cover by snapping it, so I dismantled the whole thing ( have lots of photos if anyone else wants to see whats inside ) to discover there were no screws under the camera/LED/WiFi boards. So with glue being the only possibility, I pried the cover off with a jewelers screwdriver and that was all I needed to do in the first place ( just like Chanc3 said ). :palm:
 

Offline Chanc3

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7669 on: February 04, 2016, 07:49:19 am »
Sorry! I should have checked ours, but both of them were out of the office on jobs. Glad you worked it out though. Will make future repairs nice and easy Haha

Sent from my ONE A2003 using Tapatalk

 

Offline targit

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7670 on: February 05, 2016, 03:45:46 am »
Hi, No worries Chanc3, it was an interesting way to kill a few hours anyway  :-/O
If anyone else is doing the E30 upgrade, here are some pics of whats under the cover and one way to make the holes and refit it. after drilling the holes out I filed with a fine needle file and the results look OK without getting  too fussy over the finish inside the holes.
 

Online Bud

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7671 on: February 05, 2016, 07:05:31 am »
This is a sample of a handprint viewed with the doctored E4

26.avi
Facebook-free life and Rigol-free shack.
 

Offline encryptededdy

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7672 on: February 06, 2016, 06:26:05 am »
From what I can see, enhanced E4 outperforms the therm-app significantly!
mjlortons video seems to have a ~3 degree temp delta, whereas the image by Bud has a ~8 degree temp delta.

Same with the handprint, jeffB's image has a 8 degree (celcius) delta whereas mjlortons video shows a 2 degree delta.

Here's a comparison using very small temperature deltas.

Therm-App:

Noise and resolution test


FLIR Hacked E4, Hacked E40, FLIR One (G1):
a sensitivity test
Flir E40 (hacked 320x240), Germanium (?) lens


Flir E4 (hacked 320x240),  Chalcogenide Glass lens


Flir One => Lens FOL 2 (80x60)


As you can see at low temperature deltas the Therm-App does much better than the hacked E4 and is near the hacked E40.

Still not the same target temperatures though (only the same delta), so still not a super accurate comparison.

Please note that I used the Therm-App and the included lens (with f/1.1 aperture), whereas mjlorton used the Therm-App TH and it's included lens (with f/1.4 aperture, much darker).
 

Offline Bill W

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7673 on: February 06, 2016, 03:39:46 pm »
Those seem to show up that that E4 hack has only sorted out the resolution and not the 'added' noise, while the E40 hack may have also sorted out the noise.
Standard specs for NETD (which are at f/1.0, at the sensor, under sensor test conditions of course, so not like it is used in the camera with an f 1.3 lens !):

E4 = 150mK
E8 = 60mK
E40 = 70mK
E60 = 50mK

Just being a Chalcogenide lens is not the issue, f number could be or it is image 'dishancement'.  Indeed the E4 noise is very blotchy suggesting a low resolution itself which contributes to what is for a 320 a rather horrid image. 

Bill

Online Fraser

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Re: Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown
« Reply #7674 on: February 06, 2016, 05:05:47 pm »
As Bill W has stated, the noise generator destroys the E4 performance and that was FLIR's intention for that budget model.

I manually edited my noise generator setting in the configuration file of my FW 1.19.8 E4 camera and the noise was reduced dramatically. I think I set the injected noise to 5mk in the belief that some noise was possibly needed in the image processing stages. IIRC the E60 also has its noise generator set to 5mk when shipped. I have to upgrade my second E4 soon so will try a setting of zero for the noise generator.

Fraser
 


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