Infiray and their P2 Pro - discussion

[Fraser]

My reviews take a lot of time and effort to produce. If I cannot post it here then there is no point spending time on it. I will just send the P2 Pro review sample camera back to Infiray and take the financial hit on the phones and other bits that I bought for the review.

Fraser

[tomasis]

How about a Youtube video? You have a lot of knowledge to share!  I would follow you there.

A link to your blog in your signature?

[Fraser]

I am a relative “Old timer” at 55 years of age so You Tube video creation is not really in my realm of activities. I tend to like studying reviews, associated still images and maybe the odd MP4 video capture. Sometimes You Tube makes absorption of fine details harder for me and if there are no high resolution still images it can be harder to study imaging performance. This is what I said to Infiray when I discussed reviewing their camera with them. They seem to agree that I still have something to offer via a written review that contains lots of nice still images. I can still add video captures to show moving image performance as well

If I were to be ‘forced’ off this forum I would likely do as Bill_W did and create a specialist forum of my own but I really do not want to go down that path unless forced to. This is normally a friendly place to chat about all things thermal imaging related. Outside this corner of the forum I have recently witnessed some unpleasantries relating to the Test Equipment Anonymous thread and other areas of the forum seem to be getting less friendly than I remember from past visits to them. Could the ‘storm’ outside have somehow found its way into our quiet forum area and Infiray have taken the ‘hit’ as they were in the firing line.

I may well be over blowing the incident in my mind, but today I saw, what I consider to be, an aggressive over reaction to a situation by a man I respect. That kinda shocked me. It is his forum though and he can do as he likes with it. Words like “infested” relating to Thermalengineer and Rambo Sonny posts in one thread  did seem a little extreme though ! Oh well life goes on. We shall see what tomorrow brings and I will go back to more important matters 

Fraser

[chemary]

I have seen a new thermal imager https://www.topdon.com/products/TC001 with similar specs and cheaper than Infiray P2 Pro as seen here https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/TOPDON-TC001-Thermography-Mobile-Phone-Thermal_1600574245000.html . There is very little information and all reviews I could find are produced by the own company or Youtube videos that also seem sponsored by the brand. The thing is I decompiled the APK and I found libraries from Infisense so probably they use Infiray Core, it also contains what it seems a firmware file called P2-256-V3.03-20220402.bin and the P2 reference made me think if is some sort of rebrand of the same thermal imager. What do you think?

[Fraser]

The P2 is “only” a cased version of the Infiray Tiny1-b. Manufacturers of thermal camera dongles have a limited choice of cores to use in these units. The main miniature cores coming out of China are from Infiray (S0 and Tiny1-x) and Guide Sensmart (TIMO).

The Topdon could easily be using either the Tiny1-x or TIMO 256. You have found references to Infisense in the app so the Tiny1-x core looks to be the most likely candidate for the core. I will have to try Topdon software with the P2 Pro

Fraser

[tomasis]

Fraser, I understand. The Web is so large. You will find a way to make some share somehow. 


Chemary, it looks same. Even the firmware. P2 Pro latest version is V3.05 Topdon is a good brand. I have heard about it from car repair shops.

[Fraser]

Topdon also do a Windows PC program …. It will be great if it works with the P2 Pro 

I need to find time tonight to test this

Fraser

[Fraser]

No joy on the Topdon Windows Software yet. I will need to look at this further though.

Fraser

[Fraser]

No joy on using Windows BlueStack 5 Android emulator with the P2 Pro App either

I need to look into Windows drivers etc but certainly not 'Plug & Play' on a windows PC at the moment.

Fraser

[thetan76]

It looks like Topdon Tc001 has smaller lens.

[gabiz_ro]

I take a look at TCView
Looks like install libusbK for device VID_0BDA&PID_5830 but that HW ID seems to be of some Realtek camera.
Take a look in device manager maybe windows ignore libusbK driver and use default camera drivers.

[Fraser]

Thetan76,

The Topdon does not have a lens protection window.

Looking at the Topdon camera and then at the Tiny1-b core that is within the P2 Pro, the lenses appear to be of similar size.

The Topdon camera appears very large if the small size of Tiny1-x is considered.

Fraser

[thetan76]

Well, even if the hard ware of Topdon is the same its firmware could be different.

[thetan76]

By the way, what is the P2 Pro lens diameter?

[Fraser]

Part of the Tiny1-c and Topson .inf files for interest. Note the difference between VID and PID entries.

Tiny1-c

; Module Name: Tiny1C.inf
; Description: Installation inf for Tiny1C device.
;
; THIS CODE AND INFORMATION IS PROVIDED "AS IS" WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY
; KIND, EITHER EXPRESSED OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO THE
; IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND/OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR
; PURPOSE.

[Strings]
DeviceName = "Tiny1C"
VendorName = "Realtek Semiconductor Corp."
SourceName = "Tiny1C Install Disk"
DeviceID   = "VID_0BDA&PID_5840"
DeviceGUID = "{31F311E2-8739-E459-AFB8-4FA4C7A71DAB}"

[Version]
Signature   = "$Windows NT$"
Class       = "libusbK Usb Devices"
ClassGuid   = {ECFB0CFD-74C4-4f52-BBF7-343461CD72AC}
Provider    = "libusbK"
CatalogFile = Tiny1C.cat
DriverVer   = 04/28/2014, 3.0.7.0
DriverPackageDisplayName = "Tiny1C"

; ============== Class section ==================
[ClassInstall32]
Addreg = LUsbK_Class_AddReg

[LUsbK_Class_AddReg]
HKR,,,0,"libusbK Usb Devices"
HKR,,Icon,,-20

The Topdon TC001

; Module Name: TC001.inf
; Description: Installation inf for Infiray Falcon001 5830 device.
;
; THIS CODE AND INFORMATION IS PROVIDED "AS IS" WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY
; KIND, EITHER EXPRESSED OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO THE
; IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND/OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR
; PURPOSE.

[Strings]
DeviceName = "TC001"
VendorName = "TOPDON TECHNOLOGY Co.,Ltd."
SourceName = "TC001 Install Disk"
DeviceID   = "VID_0BDA&PID_5830"
DeviceGUID = "{1B280601-7F68-5BF3-07CA-DC822CCACC26}"

[Version]
Signature   = "$Windows NT$"
Class       = "TC Usb Devices"
ClassGuid   = {ECFB0CFD-74C4-4f52-BBF7-343461CD72AC}
Provider    = "TOPDON"
CatalogFile = TC001.cat
DriverVer   = 04/28/2014, 3.0.7.0
DriverPackageDisplayName = "TC001"

; ============== Class section ==================
[ClassInstall32]
Addreg = LUsbK_Class_AddReg

[LUsbK_Class_AddReg]
HKR,,,0,"TC Usb Devices"
HKR,,Icon,,-20

[Fraser]

Thetan76,

No need for different firmware. The Tiny1-x series is a fully formed USB camera solution and an OEM just needs to use ID codes in the core to prevent use of their software on other Tiny1-x core based cameras. This is done on the S0 core and its associated software that I have. The OEM can even limit which variant of an Infiray core the host software will work with. This helps OEM's to offer differing products with different capabilities that use the same core hardware and different host software.

Fraser

[thetan76]

Ok, what about Linux users?

[Fraser]

I do not represent Infiray so cannot comment on future Linux support. As far as I am aware the P2 Pro is currently an Android only product.

Regarding the P2 lens, the following specifications are given by Infiray:

Focal Length : 3.2mm
Aperture : F1.1
FOV : 56 Degrees x 42.2mm Degrees

Fraser

[thetan76]

So, according to the data the lens is 3.5 mm. It is really small though.

[Fraser]

P2 resolution = 256 x 192 pixels. Pixel size = 12um

256 x 12um = 3072um
192 x 12um = 2304um

So the Microbolometer is also very small !   

[chemary]

Fraser have you tried the Android application on a real device? I have searched on the apk the device ids from windows drivers and it contains an XML (com.topdon.tc001/res/xml/ir_device_filter.xml) with references to both devices, so maybe the Topdon application can "see" the Infiray P2

Code: [Select]

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>
<resources>
    <usb-device product-id="0x00005840" vendor-id="0x00000BDA" />
    <usb-device product-id="0x00005830" vendor-id="0x00000BDA" />
</resources>

[Fraser]

Chemart,

Thank you  I have not tried the Topdon Android App with the P2, but will do so tomorrow.

I was hoping for an easy “win” on the a windows software front as such would make the P2 Pro more user friendly when mounted on a desk stand as PCB analyzer.

More from me when I find some spare time. I need to start on my review of the standard P2 Pro configuration. I managed to get it working on all four of my Galaxy phones. It even seems to run well on the S5, which is good To use it with phones equipped with a micro USB port, it is important to find an adapter that is truly OTG compatible. Many of mine were not ! Once I found an OTG compliant Micro USB to C type adapter, all was well 

Fraser

[EEVblog]

Wow, that would fly in the face of everything I thought this forum stood for !
Dave, if you go so far as to lock and ban all threads relating to Infiray that appears to be Censorship of the worst kind. Please do not do this ! I have seen nothing done or said by Infiray that would make me consider them truly harmful to this forum. There are many posters who reduce the signal to noise ratio on this forum… do we ban them all for that ? I love this forum and the thermal imaging area of it. Blatant Censorship will drive me away though.

As posted in the other thread:
Astroturfing will not be tolerated on this forum.
Infiray have created mant FAKE accounts and pretended to be users giving reviews and comments and asking questions etc.
Do you seriously think I shoud allow this because they are giving away free cameras for review?

[EEVblog]

It is the “threat” against new Infiray related posts that I found most worrying. Not what I expect to see in an open society. I hope I have just misunderstood what Dave was meaning by his comment regarding new Infiray posts. It does need some clarification please.

I will NOT go ahead with banning Infiray threads on this forum, I just said that thier actions made me think about doing it. Astroturfing really pisses me off and is not tolerated on this forum.
Feel free to create new Infiray threads and posts, but I will be cracking down and banning every post and account that is an astrofurf.
Infiray have been warned before and have oversteeped the boundries, their employees and paid shills are not welcome here.

They offered me money to advertise in this forum and I turned them down because astroturfing disgusts me. I will not take their money and they are banned.

[EEVblog]

I see that “Rambo Sonny” has been banned. He made no secret of his affiliation with Infiray and was running a reviewer giveaway of 5 Infiray P2 Pro cameras in a thread that is now locked. The reviewer selection was to be tomorrow. I presume there is some connection between Rambo Sonny and the members accused of Astroturfing ? Why else would he deserve a ban. Is it permanent or just a warning ban as given to those who break the rules ?

"RamboSonny" was hiding ehind a @qq.com email address, did not declare his affiliation, and posted classic astroturfing posts like "I heard that Infiray released..." etc.