Used ISG Infrasys Elite XRHR Firefighting Thermal Camera on Ebay

[basecase]

While I was looking for thermal cameras to repair/salvage, I came across this https://www.ebay.com/itm/324977590615
ISG Infrasys Elite XR, which is a firefighting thermal camera apparently. After digging a bit deeper, I realized that the camera might have a 384 x 288 50Hz microbolometer at its heart.
For less than $200, I decided to gamble. Fast forward to today: the unit that arrived was in remarkably good condition. Minor scuffing from use, but the lens was mostly scratch-free. No sign of corrosion on the battery terminals either, and the LCD appeared intact. Good start, but still need to power it on.

After searching around for a bit, I found some battery refurbishing services claiming that the battery voltage was 12V. After disassembling the camera to figure out which terminal is the positive one, I hooked it up to a RDTech DPS5005, set output to 12V, and crossed my fingers. To my surprise the camera was actually functional! Shutter(s?) clicked periodically, LCD screen had no crack or burn-in, hot-spot tracking functioned, and no artifact was displayed. The feed was remarkably low-noise (compared to my HT-19's Seek Mosaic at least), and the responsiveness was almost real-time. While I can't take stills to verify the resolution, the camera came with a "100K Hi-res" sticker, so I do believe it indeed had a 384 x 288 50 Hz core inside.

Good stuff.

Album.

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Edit 1 TL;DR: Did some research on what ISG was making. Found a bunch of manuals and brochures, but not for all recent products (i.e. couldn't find anything for XRHR). See the Google Drive link for a bunch of documents.
Elite XR without 100K Hi-res stickers have 320 x 240 VOx sensor. Elite XRHR, E380, X380 definitely have 384 x 288 ASi sensor based on the X380's Operating Manual.

Link to the documents.

Edit 2: Added some more partial-disassembly pictures of the camera. See Edit 5.

Edit 3: Bought 2 more. 2 Elite XR's arrived. Partial disassembly album.

Edit 4: Consolidated all the high-resolution pictures I have taken + some other I saved for reference related to the Elite XRHR and Elite XR here.

Edit 5: Full disassembly.
-----------------

After some more digging around, I found a 2015 market survey report from the Department of Homeland Security that basically is a catalog of most of the emergency-response tailored thermal cameras available on the market at the time (see attached).
This document listed the specifications of a lot of thermal cameras including the ISG Infrasys Elite XR, which supposedly had a 384 x 288 sensor.
Now, going back to the original seller with all of the ISG Infrasys stuffs, they do have a bunch of Elite XR's up for sale. What's intriguing is that all of the XR models without "100K Hi-res" stickers all have their serial numbers ending in XR.
The ones that do have the sticker, mine included, have their serial numbers ending in HR. Both variants are listed as Elite XR, so this led me to believe that the one in the DHS' report is actually the one with the Hi-res sticker.

Here are some examples:

XR no sticker:
K1K-1138XR
K1K-1002XR
K1K-3698XR
4994-XR

XR with sticker:
K1K-3032HR
The one I bought has serial number K1K-2279HR.

-----------------

Based on Wayback Machine's capture of ISG's website (bless this service), this is my estimate of ISG's product history:

1992: Founding of ISG.

~1999: Site created.

Pre-2001: K-90 Talisman, K-90 Enforcer, Firefinder.

2001-2002: K-80 Firecam introduced. Very similar chassis to the XR. First instance of this particular platform being used.

2002-2003: K-90 Talisman XL, K-1000 Elite Firecam (Minicam?, same chassis as K-80), K6800 Spectra Scan, K-I Sentry introduced.

2004: K-1000 Elite Lite introduced. Used FFB160 sensor (160x120). K-1000 probably used the FFB320 (320 x 240) based on this, and the fact that ISG claimed the K-1000 Elite has 76800 pixels in the 04/28/2006 snapshot.

~2005: K-1000 Elite rehash?.

2008: Elite XR introduced. Looked exactly like the XR no sticker cameras from above. K-85ST came out with 160 x 120 sensor and wireless streaming.
Elite XR's Operating Manual claimed it had a 320 x 240 VOx microbolometer.
K-1000 Elite's Operating Manual from this time also claimed the same thing.
Also, first mention of Infrasys. This was probably the year they merged or started partnering.

2012: E380 introduced. First mention of 100K sensor. Operating manual claimed 384 x 288, but not what the sensor type is. E380N variant came out later, but was essentially identical.

2013: X380 introduced. Probably the same core as the E380, but with cold spot tracker and wider temperature range (down to -40C).
XRHR Introduced. Claimed to have 100K sensor as well. Suspect X380, E380, and XRHR to have 388 x 284 ASi sensors based on SD1000/K1000 manual.

11/21/2014: Scott Safety acquired ISG Infrasys.

~2014: SD1000/K1000 either were introduced, or rehashed with new sensors.

2015: Site redirected to Scott Safety.

[Fraser]

Well done 

It sounds like you have yourself a decent camera at an excellent price  Retired Fire Fighting cameras have much to offer provided they have not been abused and totally wrecked. Your camera sounds like it has coped very well with the rigours of being a firefighting tool 

Enjoy

Fraser

[Bill W]

Of wider interest, the seller has quite a few similar ISG / Bullard / MSA fire service cameras in the 'battery missing' condition.  Cheap source of (probably) decent cores.

As the ISG's are from US use they could well be set up as 320x240 60Hz NTSC rather than the PAL 384x288 50Hz UK/EUR region setup.  Scope on the BNC video ?

Some, but maybe not those branded '100K', could have the ITC VOx core like this:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/thermal-imaging/mystery-raytheon-camera/msg3534294/#msg3534294

Bill

[Fraser]

The E380 that they sold in December was a bargain ! The X380 was not a bad deal either.

I no longer search for thermal cameras like I used to so as to avoid temptation ! There are some excellent deals to be had on eBay when a Fire Service refresh their thermal camera kits and the old cameras go to Government auctions, then end up on eBay for us to pick through. As I have said previously, the hermetically sealed nature of fire fighting cameras often means that the cores protected within their casings are in cosmetically pristine condition, just like when they left the factory many years ago.

The missing battery situation is common as many disposal processes require that batteries be removed for recycling as hazardous waste. A pity as replacements can be rare and expensive fir some less common camera models.

I must avoid returning to my old ways of scouring eBay for such great value cameras ! That said, the UTi260B has, IMHO, become the ‘darling’ of hobbyists as it is new, compact and very capable for the price being asked in China.

I am still on the look-out for another Bullard Eclipse camera if anyone spots one of those please.

Fraser

[basecase]

Of wider interest, the seller has quite a few similar ISG / Bullard / MSA fire service cameras in the 'battery missing' condition.  Cheap source of (probably) decent cores.

As the ISG's are from US use they could well be set up as 320x240 60Hz NTSC rather than the PAL 384x288 50Hz UK/EUR region setup.  Scope on the BNC video ?

Some, but maybe not those branded '100K', could have the ITC VOx core like this:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/thermal-imaging/mystery-raytheon-camera/msg3534294/#msg3534294

Bill

Yea. Seller has quite a lot of thermal cameras for sale. The IR window alone is of great interest to me since I wanted to film stuffs heating up from inside a vacuum chamber.

As for the BNC output, I have no clue what I am looking at (see attached). Scope's input wasn't terminated with a 75 Ohm resistor, but I don't even think adding that would somehow make the camera's output look like NTSC or PAL. In the event that the output can't be digitalized, I guess I'll have to split the video out from the controller board onto an external RCA jack. Already drilled a hole on the chassis for an external power adapter, so it shouldn't be too hard to pass another cable through.

[ArsenioDev]

Oh looks like a failure of the filter on the output, I had two that I refurb'd have that issue, I just directjacked off the feed to the screen. Still working on figuring out where the parallel video output is to get me a cleaner signal.

[basecase]

Oh looks like a failure of the filter on the output, I had two that I refurb'd have that issue, I just directjacked off the feed to the screen. Still working on figuring out where the parallel video output is to get me a cleaner signal.

That's interesting. Sounded like a common failure for this type of camera.
I got 2 more units coming, so I'll probably do a tear-down and poke around to see if the core's output can be digitalized.

[Bill W]

As there is a 16.7 ms period there, it is indeed NTSC / 60Hz / 240 line output.

It is possible ISG windowed down a 384x288 sensor to 320x240 (324 x 243 ?) , yet still claimed a 100k pixel sensor for 'marketing'  reasons.

Equally could be an odd mix as some variations on this camera model had native driven PAL video LCD's.

You'd need to start checking the field of view (screen vs external video) and timings of LCD and external video to be sure.


Bill

[ArsenioDev]

Oh looks like a failure of the filter on the output, I had two that I refurb'd have that issue, I just directjacked off the feed to the screen. Still working on figuring out where the parallel video output is to get me a cleaner signal.

That's interesting. Sounded like a common failure for this type of camera.
I got 2 more units coming, so I'll probably do a tear-down and poke around to see if the core's output can be digitalized.

W/r/t digitalizing, On the backside of the FPGA board, I am PRETTY sure the FFC connector on there is for parallel outputs. Also, if you can figure out how to boot this thing without the bulky rear board that'd be great because one of mine is dead and it's depressing.

[basecase]

This ebay seller managed to do it. You could take a look and see how he's done it:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/334290552851
https://www.ebay.com/itm/334283192359

The man's chopping up ISG X380's instead of the Elite XRHR, but it's pretty much the same core.

[ArsenioDev]

Nope, those are the NTSC output. I have 4 of those cores on my bench. That dual rank samtec at the back ALMOST CERTAINLY has the parallel out. Will do some investigation with the other crew when they're back in town.

[basecase]

Nope, those are the NTSC output. I have 4 of those cores on my bench. That dual rank samtec at the back ALMOST CERTAINLY has the parallel out. Will do some investigation with the other crew when they're back in town.

Misunderstood your response. I thought you meant the display's controller board.
I'll take a look once the cameras arrived.

[basecase]

As there is a 16.7 ms period there, it is indeed NTSC / 60Hz / 240 line output.

It is possible ISG windowed down a 384x288 sensor to 320x240 (324 x 243 ?) , yet still claimed a 100k pixel sensor for 'marketing'  reasons.

Equally could be an odd mix as some variations on this camera model had native driven PAL video LCD's.

You'd need to start checking the field of view (screen vs external video) and timings of LCD and external video to be sure.


Bill

Thank you for the breakdown of the oscilloscope screen capture. I'll probably tap into the internal display's direct input some time later after I figured out how to make the camera portable again.
Right now I'm trying to power the thing using a QC2-capable power bank tricked to output 12V using a DIY QC2 trigger solution (this, but with MSP430G2553). Sort of worked, but my implementation is a bit buggy.

[StarrFluff]

This ebay seller managed to do it. You could take a look and see how he's done it:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/334290552851
https://www.ebay.com/itm/334283192359

The man's chopping up ISG X380's instead of the Elite XRHR, but it's pretty much the same core.

Well hey im the one who bought that first ebay listing. Got an offer to grab it for $150, which seems like a ripping good deal for a thermal camera core of this capability. Powered it up today and it works fine.

So is the board on the back of the camera housing hermetically sealed or is it just bolted on to the back? Trying to figure out how to take this thing apart without breaking anything. I will take some pics of the boards here soon so its easier to talk about specific things.

[Fraser]

The only down side to the ISG cameras is their use of an in-house designed and built core. I own a few ISG cameras and they work well. My favourite is the E380 that has an ‘organic’ shape, similar to the Bullard Eclipse format, but larger.

The bespoke imaging core electronics package sadly means that the user/experimenter is very limited in terms of what can be reconfigured on the core. There is a hidden menu on the later models but, just as with the earlier ISG designed cores, an ISG factory utility software is needed to make more significant changes to the core. On the E380, the hidden menu just controls things like the temperature units, heat seeking mode, Zoom and Freeze frame functionality. From memory, a ‘clean display’ mode with no overlay graphics is not offered in that menu.

There is little, to no information available on these ISG cores as ISG have not released such and are unlikely to do so. Fire fighting cameras that contain COTS imaging cores are a better choice for those wishing to reconfigure the camera, or imaging cores, behaviour as more technical information is likely to be available. My E380 is a lovely camera that I bought because I liked its design. It would not be my first choice if I wanted to repurpose it in a way that required a clear display with no overlay graphics or other deep reconfiguration of the core.

My teardown of the E380 is to be found here…..

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/thermal-imaging/isg-e380-rugged-modern-qvga-lawfiresecurity-camera-a-look-inside-by-fraser/

Fraser

[basecase]

This ebay seller managed to do it. You could take a look and see how he's done it:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/334290552851
https://www.ebay.com/itm/334283192359

The man's chopping up ISG X380's instead of the Elite XRHR, but it's pretty much the same core.

Well hey im the one who bought that first ebay listing. Got an offer to grab it for $150, which seems like a ripping good deal for a thermal camera core of this capability. Powered it up today and it works fine.

So is the board on the back of the camera housing hermetically sealed or is it just bolted on to the back? Trying to figure out how to take this thing apart without breaking anything. I will take some pics of the boards here soon so its easier to talk about specific things.

That's nice. I got the offer as well, but that was after buying the XRHR. At least you'll get the comfort knowing that the core worked instead of having to wait for the thing to arrive and hope that it does.

I updated the Imgur album in the first post with more images.
The display controller board is hot glued onto a frame that is then screwed onto the back of the camera.

That back got an O-ring that goes around the frame. Removing that back is very easy since all the screws are there. Just take off the first 4 visible screws to peel back the strap holder, and the rest of the screw holes will be visible.

[basecase]

The only down side to the ISG cameras is their use of an in-house designed and built core. I own a few ISG cameras and they work well. My favourite is the E380 that has an ‘organic’ shape, similar to the Bullard Eclipse format, but larger.

The bespoke imaging core electronics package sadly means that the user/experimenter is very limited in terms of what can be reconfigured on the core. There is a hidden menu on the later models but, just as with the earlier ISG designed cores, an ISG factory utility software is needed to make more significant changes to the core. On the E380, the hidden menu just controls things like the temperature units, heat seeking mode, Zoom and Freeze frame functionality. From memory, a ‘clean display’ mode with no overlay graphics is not offered in that menu.

There is little, to no information available on these ISG cores as ISG have not released such and are unlikely to do so. Fire fighting cameras that contain COTS imaging cores are a better choice for those wishing to reconfigure the camera, or imaging cores, behaviour as more technical information is likely to be available. My E380 is a lovely camera that I bought because I liked its design. It would not be my first choice if I wanted to repurpose it in a way that required a clear display with no overlay graphics or other deep reconfiguration of the core.

My teardown of the E380 is to be found here…..

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/thermal-imaging/isg-e380-rugged-modern-qvga-lawfiresecurity-camera-a-look-inside-by-fraser/

Fraser

Thanks for the information. That teardown will be a good point of comparison for when I'm doing the same thing with the XRHR.

[Early]

I picked up one of these to tinker with. With the lens on top what is the orientation of the battery power on the terminal below?

12V right and negative left?

Also, the unit I received has no HI-RES markings and the serial ends in XR. I can post some photos once I get it opened up.

[ArsenioDev]

BE VERY CAREFUL NOT TO REVERSE POLARITY, THERE IS NO INPUT PROTECTION. I'd recommend pulling off the screen, the terminals are marked internally with polarity.

[Bill W]

If the 'negative' is also camera 0V, that should be connected to BNC outer/GND (or at least a lot nearer a short than the positive).

Might be worth a check that way.

[basecase]

I picked up one of these to tinker with. With the lens on top what is the orientation of the battery power on the terminal below?

12V right and negative left?

Also, the unit I received has no HI-RES markings and the serial ends in XR. I can post some photos once I get it opened up.

Seller probably had mixed lot of XRHR and regular XR without charger or battery. XR by itself is still pretty good for the price, but it's a shame the seller didn't bother to differentiate the models. Try to work out something with the seller if you feel slighted I guess. I'm happy with whatever they sent as long as the cameras worked (fingers crossed). Refer to the attached images for how I set up the camera.

If the 'negative' is also camera 0V, that should be connected to BNC outer/GND (or at least a lot nearer a short than the positive).

Might be worth a check that way.

Also, interesting development regarding video output. When I opened the camera back up to take picture of how I wired it, I noticed that the video output wasn't even wired the entire time!
That BNC connector is somehow picking up noise from the display controller board!

[cynfab]

I haven't posted for a while but after seeing the first post in this thread and Fraser's response (THANKS!!),
I ordered one (should have gotten 2 or 3  ). It arrived today.
Was 100K sticker version with a S/N ending in HR.

----->>>WARNING!!!<<<------- Don't try to power these up without opening them first!

Mine had the 4 nuts that hold the two core boards together just rattling around in the housing,
and the boards were only partially plugged together.
If one of those nuts was sitting on the wrong place, Bad Things (tm) might have happened!

Once reconnected, the camera operates very nicely, I'm quite happy. Only a couple of dings in the germanium window (lens is perfect, not even any dust)
and the insides are spotless (except for the loose nuts) The BNC video output was missing a cable to somewhere
just like the original post, gotta probe around and find out where it goes.
Under 12V power it draws ~300ma.

Lots of interesting stuff in this camera, many connectors (some very very tiny) with few or no connections.

[cynfab]

Drat...wrong picture...

[basecase]

I haven't posted for a while but after seeing the first post in this thread and Fraser's response (THANKS!!),
I ordered one (should have gotten 2 or 3  ). It arrived today.
Was 100K sticker version with a S/N ending in HR.

----->>>WARNING!!!<<<------- Don't try to power these up without opening them first!

Mine had the 4 nuts that hold the two core boards together just rattling around in the housing,
and the boards were only partially plugged together.
If one of those nuts was sitting on the wrong place, Bad Things (tm) might have happened!

Once reconnected, the camera operates very nicely, I'm quite happy. Only a couple of dings in the germanium window (lens is perfect, not even any dust)
and the insides are spotless (except for the loose nuts) The BNC video output was missing a cable to somewhere
just like the original post, gotta probe around and find out where it goes.
Under 12V power it draws ~300ma.

Lots of interesting stuff in this camera, many connectors (some very very tiny) with few or no connections.

I'm glad sharing the ebay find brought you some joy. It looked like you got lucky and were sent the XRHR.
I'm guessing the nuts got loose due to a lot of vibration, but at least the camera worked fine for you.

Regarding the connectors, I think most of those on the FPGA board are for internal testing/configuration while those on the expansion board are for display + different types of feature that the final product might have.
The XRHR, E380, and X380 all shared the same core and controller boards, but they don't have the same level of connectivity.

For example:
The XRHR doesn't have anything plugged into the connector adjacent to the header pins (see attached). However, Fraser's E380 has a connector plugged into it with a bunch of wires going to the DIN(?) connector on the side of the unit. The X380 has a USB port, so on that unit this connector probably goes there.

Also, thanks to this eBay seller, the wires going into the LCD panel are identified if you're interested in getting the component output but didn't want to probe the pins.

3.5'' TFT COLOR LCD Screen Module  320 X 480 from thermal camera universal PAL OR NTSC
These are used in good working condition LCD displays out of x380 3m Thermal cameras.
They have a composite NTSC or PAL input on two short wires in back
Voltage is 5vdc to 13vdc
There is a plastic mount around the screen , but it can be removed and this could be mounted in a box or other for use.
Wires on Back:
Red: Positive 12vdc
Black : Negative or ground
Purple: Ground (for video)
White: + Video in  (composite NTSC or PAL input - auto selected)
These are great for projects or mini displays for use in a car.
BUYER PAYS SHIPPING $8 VIA USPS PRIORITY MAIL WITH TRACKING
PLEASE SEE MY OTHER LISTINGS

[cynfab]

Thanks for the info on the display connections. It would be interesting to see the connections inside others from this camera series, I wonder how much of the core can be re-configured by jumpers. It would be nice to have a USB connection.