Author Topic: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?  (Read 2286 times)

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Offline okw

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TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« on: December 05, 2021, 03:08:39 pm »
Hi! A local company had very good Black Friday FLIR-deals, so I picked up a TG267. Only $377 ex tax (I get tax reimbursed to my company).
Yesterday I was approached by a guy to swap a C5 even stevens with a 2012 21'5" iMac I had posted. It's been listed at $410 for a while without sale.

Question is, which is a better choice for mainly lower power PCB and audio amp (higher temperatures) work? Also taking into account, the cost.
Fluke 183 dmm, Voltcraft VC 940 dmm, Tektronix TDS 1012B osc, UNI-T UTG962E func gen, Riden RD6006 ps, Tagarno Magnus HD, Mantis Elite, Weller WX 2, Weller WX 1, Weller WS 80 (my favourite).
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2021, 06:35:26 pm »
I presume you realise that the TG267 is a visual IR thermometer, rather than a Radiometric thermal camera ?

By this I mean that the TG267 uses a 80x60 pixel FLIR Lepton 2.0 thermal imaging core but that core does not offer any temperature measurement capability. For the temperature measurement that is shown on the display, it uses a conventional single pixel IR thermometer with its associated large spot size on the target. A Radiometric thermal camera, even one that uses the low resolution Lepton core, will provide the measured temperature of each and every pixel in the displayed scene. Far more suited to PCB work.

Note that I have used a Radiometric Lepton 2.5 based camera that has only 80x60 pixels and I was able to achieve good results when searching for ‘hot spots’ on PCB’s for further investigation.

Fraser
« Last Edit: December 05, 2021, 07:36:50 pm by Fraser »
 

Offline okw

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2021, 10:17:04 pm »
It confuses me. Both are 160x120, but I now see they distinguish TG267 true IR pixel imager while C5 has true thermal imager.
Sadly the C5 sold just before I asked for the iMac-trade.

Which (of all in the market) is the better choice in the $500 range for PCB work? I see many recommend E4 with 320x240 hack.
Fluke 183 dmm, Voltcraft VC 940 dmm, Tektronix TDS 1012B osc, UNI-T UTG962E func gen, Riden RD6006 ps, Tagarno Magnus HD, Mantis Elite, Weller WX 2, Weller WX 1, Weller WS 80 (my favourite).
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2021, 12:12:50 am »
You are quite correct, the TG267 is a 160 x 120 pixel Lepton so it will use the Lepton 3.0 non Radiometric core. My mistake, I was thinking of its predecessor, the TG165.

Fraser
 

Offline okw

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2021, 12:27:09 am »
But it's still a poor choice for PCB work? Or does that change everything?
What's your recommendations? I see in the forums you're quite knowledgeable on this topic
Fluke 183 dmm, Voltcraft VC 940 dmm, Tektronix TDS 1012B osc, UNI-T UTG962E func gen, Riden RD6006 ps, Tagarno Magnus HD, Mantis Elite, Weller WX 2, Weller WX 1, Weller WS 80 (my favourite).
 

Offline Fraser

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2021, 08:22:58 am »
Still no good for PCB work that requires any temperature measurements.

Look at the Uni-T UTi260b and Infiray C210. They are both detailed on this forum and performance is far better than Lepton based cameras.

I would still prefer a FLIR E4 with close-up supplemental lens for PCB work on a budget but you need to find one at a good price and upgrade it to full E8+ specification. The UTi-260B and C210 are ready to use as soon as received and just need an inexpensive ZnSe supplemental lens for close-up work (same as E4 in this respect) They are also 25fps as opposed to the E4’s <9fps which can be important for some users. For the money being asked fir them and what they provide in terms of image quality the UTi260B and C210 are definitely worth your consideration  :-+

For a dedicated PCB inspection solution there is the Dianyang CA-10 system  :-+ It uses a better imaging core than the UTI-260 and C210 and provides an excellent camera stand as part of the package. I reviewed it on this forum.

Fraser
« Last Edit: December 06, 2021, 08:47:22 am by Fraser »
 

Offline okw

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2022, 12:36:40 am »
I got my Infiray C200. Super happy. Seems very good, both image quality and build quality. Fast menus and navigation (compared to a few other cheap meters I've tried). Supplied 16GB memory card has decent read/write.
One note though. Aliexpress sellers say the C200 is an upgraded version of C210, and should be identical.
This is not true. I contacted Infiray (Iraytek) and they told me only C210 and C200Pro has computer capability, and USB video.
The C200 will simply turn up as an external hard drive when connected. The supplied USB-C cable was also super flimsy, and kept disconnecting a lot (until I wiggled it to get a proper connection). Seems odd, since everything else was such high quality. Even the case has this rubbery/velvet coating on the outside and a super nice cut foam insert. Perhaps these Aliexpress sellers are replacing the cables with cheap ones, and selling the good ones :) Nothing surprises me in China.
Fluke 183 dmm, Voltcraft VC 940 dmm, Tektronix TDS 1012B osc, UNI-T UTG962E func gen, Riden RD6006 ps, Tagarno Magnus HD, Mantis Elite, Weller WX 2, Weller WX 1, Weller WS 80 (my favourite).
 

Offline Thermal Michael

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2022, 08:41:41 am »
I remember to read a review online about Best Thermal Camera for PCB Inspection: FLIR ETS320 Thermal Imaging Camera.

Pros:

Connection via USB to Share Real Time Date
320 x 240 Infrared Detector of 76,800 Pixels
Vibrant 3” LCD
Record Standard Radiometric JPEG

Cons:

Due to the obvious short focal length and insufficient focal length change, the imaging area on the board is small (40 x 55 mm).
The plastic outer layer and display panel can make it unsuitable for professional laboratory use.

So maybe you want to take a look at this one? And let me know which one is better is you have the outcome.
 

Offline Bill W

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2022, 04:04:02 pm »
I remember to read a review online about Best Thermal Camera for PCB Inspection: FLIR ETS320 Thermal Imaging Camera.

Pros:

Connection via USB to Share Real Time Date
320 x 240 Infrared Detector of 76,800 Pixels
Vibrant 3” LCD
Record Standard Radiometric JPEG

Cons:

Due to the obvious short focal length and insufficient focal length change, the imaging area on the board is small (40 x 55 mm).
The plastic outer layer and display panel can make it unsuitable for professional laboratory use.

So maybe you want to take a look at this one? And let me know which one is better is you have the outcome.

Best maybe,  But best choice for the hobbyist ?  Price matters too.

Getting the ideal of:
  • 320x240 or more
  • 25Hz or more
  • Focus to under 4 inch / 100mm
  • Any pixel temperature
  • Radiometric / Temperature data saves
  • Stand - alone (phone-less)
  • Your preference of stream output
  • Your preference of mechanical arrangement
without a lot of spend (or the added effort in converting a core from elsewhere) is tricky.

Even the DYT CA-10, which gets pretty close, is still USD 700 or so.

 
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Offline Fraser

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2022, 05:46:17 pm »
Okay,

Do not forget about adding a ZnSe lens fir close-up working. Such a lens can greatly enhance imaging of small SMT components.

Take a look at a UTi260B being used with such a lens here…..

https://youtu.be/AmprcM6pT8c

A ready made close-up lens is available for the C2xx series here…..

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003493744197.html?_randl_currency=GBP&_randl_shipto=GB&src=google&src=google&albch=shopping&acnt=631-313-3945&slnk=&plac=&mtctp=&albbt=Google_7_shopping&albagn=888888&isSmbActive=false&isSmbAutoCall=false&needSmbHouyi=false&albcp=14261781308&albag=&trgt=&crea=en1005003493744197&netw=x&device=t&albpg=&albpd=en1005003493744197&gclid=Cj0KCQiAraSPBhDuARIsAM3Js4oKytGkY50ehxKPEbqLxKT_F5p5Lfc-FNe8AJm5j9eOl6pd3D_jt_saAmwfEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds&aff_fcid=a055582bb36148199e905e1e97f9ef8c-1642701008326-01894-UneMJZVf&aff_fsk=UneMJZVf&aff_platform=aaf&sk=UneMJZVf&aff_trace_key=a055582bb36148199e905e1e97f9ef8c-1642701008326-01894-UneMJZVf&terminal_id=c54044baaf2d43fd8c4445400d11a3fc&UTABTest=aliabtest194170_247435&OLP=10500109_f_group0&o_s_id=10500109&afSmartRedirect=y

You can make your own mounting system for your C2xx camera and buy the lens through eBay quite cheaply.

https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5137854

I personally recommend a ZnSe lens with a FL of 50.8mm  or 63.5mm for the smaller SMT components. Such a lens is not expensive and people have been designing lens mounts for various cameras that may be 3D printed.

Fraser

Fraser
« Last Edit: January 20, 2022, 06:00:32 pm by Fraser »
 

Offline Thermal Michael

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2022, 04:07:26 am »
You are right, my friend. Price or budget is definitely one of the most important factors to consider.

But I have to say that FLIR won't let you down like always.  ^-^

I remember to read a review online about Best Thermal Camera for PCB Inspection: FLIR ETS320 Thermal Imaging Camera.

Pros:

Connection via USB to Share Real Time Date
320 x 240 Infrared Detector of 76,800 Pixels
Vibrant 3” LCD
Record Standard Radiometric JPEG

Cons:

Due to the obvious short focal length and insufficient focal length change, the imaging area on the board is small (40 x 55 mm).
The plastic outer layer and display panel can make it unsuitable for professional laboratory use.

So maybe you want to take a look at this one? And let me know which one is better is you have the outcome.

Best maybe,  But best choice for the hobbyist ?  Price matters too.

Getting the ideal of:
  • 320x240 or more
  • 25Hz or more
  • Focus to under 4 inch / 100mm
  • Any pixel temperature
  • Radiometric / Temperature data saves
  • Stand - alone (phone-less)
  • Your preference of stream output
  • Your preference of mechanical arrangement
without a lot of spend (or the added effort in converting a core from elsewhere) is tricky.

Even the DYT CA-10, which gets pretty close, is still USD 700 or so.
 

Offline okw

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2022, 11:48:53 am »
Anyone knows the screw dimension of bottom mount of the C200? I tried an M6 bolt which seemed perfect, but it goes in only a few millimeters, then stops. So I take it the thread pitch is not the same. Anyone with info here?
Also, anyone have suggestions for a mount for measuring PCBs? I now have a chemistry stand with clamps.
Fluke 183 dmm, Voltcraft VC 940 dmm, Tektronix TDS 1012B osc, UNI-T UTG962E func gen, Riden RD6006 ps, Tagarno Magnus HD, Mantis Elite, Weller WX 2, Weller WX 1, Weller WS 80 (my favourite).
 

Offline ConKbot

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Re: TG267 or C5 for PCB work?
« Reply #12 on: February 01, 2022, 02:17:38 pm »
Anyone knows the screw dimension of bottom mount of the C200? I tried an M6 bolt which seemed perfect, but it goes in only a few millimeters, then stops. So I take it the thread pitch is not the same. Anyone with info here?
Standard tripod mounts are 1/4-20UNC  1/4" being 6.35mm, and 20tpi is 1.27 mm pitch, so  a M6x1.25 may get in a few turns before binding.
 


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