Author Topic: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal  (Read 717516 times)

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Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #25 on: September 26, 2014, 02:25:37 am »
Just had a reply to an email enquiry - apparently not shipping outside US & Canada until next year!
..of course we don't know if/when they are actually shipping in US/Canada?
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Offline frenky

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #26 on: September 26, 2014, 02:58:56 am »
I've read in one of the online articles that they will start shipping in two weeks.
At the same time they will put apps on google play and apple store.

Later in the fall the module will also be  available on amazon.
(At that time it will be possible to get it trough mail forwarding companies such as shipito.com )

Next year they will also release API for developers to make their own apps.
 

Offline ixfd64

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming..
« Reply #27 on: September 26, 2014, 04:11:25 am »
Really disappointing that they don't ship to Europe. |O
(I tried to order trough shipito.com but order on thermal.com didn't go trough because my credit card address was different from shipping address...)

You could try asking a trusted member of this forum to order it for you instead.

Offline frenky

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #28 on: September 26, 2014, 04:20:17 am »
Well my enthusiasm is somewhat gone now.
I'll wait for a few months to see what first customers say about it...
 

Offline mjlorton

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #29 on: September 26, 2014, 04:23:03 am »
This is becoming a very interesting area...

At one of our recent Charged Conversation meetups (http://www.meetup.com/Charged-Conversation/) Chris Gammell and myself met Erik Beall (https://hackaday.io/hacker/22940).

He has developed the Hema-Imager (http://www.hemaimaging.com/) which is another low cost cell phone / tablet thermal imager. He ran a Kickstarter (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/ebeall/hemaimager-accessible-thermal-imaging-for-smart-de/posts/945690) but missed his goal. He is going to have another attempt.

I'll be doing an interview with Erik in October and another video where he talks about the design and shows how it's put together. There's a great deal that's happened in the background that I hope he'll be able to talk about...

There's another related product release at the end of this month that I will cover.

Mike (mikeselectricstuff), if you want to get your hands on a Seek thermal imager...let me know and I'll do whatever I can to assist.

Cheers,
Martin.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2014, 05:21:56 am by mjlorton »
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Offline sacherjj

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #30 on: September 26, 2014, 06:05:25 am »
I just ordered the Android version.  We have found the FlirOne very usefully for many tasks, with the exception that you need an iPhone. 

I didn't get a shipping estimate, but the confirmation emails had this:

Quote
Thank for your order! Due to the extremely high demand for our products, we are currently experiencing a 5-7 business delay in the shipment of your order. In order to minimize transit times, items may ship separately from multiple locations, and all shipped items may not be reflected on this confirmation.

Scene temp range is -40C to 330C.  It will be interesting to see what information is available when looking at hot plate reflow and other soldering.  It can detect high enough to see it.  The FlirONE is 0C to 100C.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2014, 06:21:17 am by sacherjj »
 

Offline miguelvp

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #31 on: September 26, 2014, 08:08:01 am »
I also ordered the Android version, and to answer to eneuro's comment in:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/crowd-funded-projects/m-thermal-imager-real-or-fake/msg519628/#msg519628

Quote
however it is a pitty it works only under Android?

They do have an IPhone version as well, same price $199 and it should work even with the new IPhones not stuck to the 5s like the Flir module.



 

Offline Legit-Design

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #32 on: September 26, 2014, 08:08:29 am »
repost from the other thread?



anyways, looks like their noise reduction isn't as advanced as the Flir (One) Lepton Mike was showing off.
 

Offline Alexei.Polkhanov

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming..
« Reply #33 on: September 26, 2014, 08:43:39 am »
The other interesting aspect is at what point will the US manufacturers manage to persuade their leaders that restrictions on higher framerates are harming business more than they are protecting anyone from anything.
Applications like firefighting need a decent framerate, and once the kit becomes sufficiently small and cheap it will be impractical to control.

Totally true. I found someone selling on ALI Express last week - "high res" 640x480 sensor assembly, 70FPS, "only"  :) $900 each. 10 were available. 
384×288 sensors at 50FPS are easily available - shipping worldwide. I am wondering if these can be overclocked to 60FPS. I searched last year - there were none for sell with these frame rates. I can only imagine what will be available next year! I think Chinese company that makes/sells them is called "JIR" ... .

http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/M700-thermal-image-sensor-cheap-thermal_1899090531.html?s=p
 

Offline miguelvp

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #34 on: September 26, 2014, 08:53:57 am »
We'll see in Fall,But isn't it Fall yet?

Bit confused about why some are calling it a pre-order, seems like a regular order to me, but as long as I get it in time to winterize my house, I'm good.

 

Offline marshallh

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #35 on: September 26, 2014, 08:55:02 am »
Ordering is now back online.

Got one on the way
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Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming..
« Reply #36 on: September 26, 2014, 08:57:39 am »


Totally true. I found someone selling on ALI Express last week - "high res" 640x480 sensor assembly, 70FPS, "only"  :) $900 each. 10 were available. 
Almost certainly a bogus listing

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Offline marshallh

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #37 on: September 26, 2014, 08:58:52 am »
Order number 72X here
« Last Edit: September 26, 2014, 09:11:11 am by marshallh »
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Offline Alexei.Polkhanov

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming..
« Reply #38 on: September 26, 2014, 09:26:25 am »


Totally true. I found someone selling on ALI Express last week - "high res" 640x480 sensor assembly, 70FPS, "only"  :) $900 each. 10 were available. 
Almost certainly a bogus listing
I am not familiar with Chinese market. Would they create bogus listing just to check the demand? Does it mean they pretty much ready to start shipping or may not even close to it? This one looks like a real deal to me for example: http://hbjir.en.alibaba.com/product/618597547-214483688/Infrared_IR_Thermal_imaging_Camera_Core_Module.html or http://hbjir.en.alibaba.com/product/637449470-214483688/zoom_camera_module.html

I have seen 384×288 sensor but did not ask guy who was showing it how much he paid. He brought it from a "trip to china for entrepreneurs" organized by Vancouver business school few months ago.
 

Offline miguelvp

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #39 on: September 26, 2014, 09:31:32 am »
Infrared as in night vision can be achieved with NIR sensors IR lighting and visual spectrum filters very cheap. I know they are calling those Chinese sensors Thermal, but maybe they are bending the truth of what they are capable of, or maybe there is a cheaper technology that truly does thermal, but unless they show what the sensor sees, it's probably bogus.
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #40 on: September 26, 2014, 09:36:41 am »
A lot of ALIexpress sellers are chancers who place speculative listings, and then try to obtain items if they get an order, and if they can't, then cancel the order, and though you get a refund a couple of weeks later, you can lose out if the exchange rate has changed in the meantime.

Or they ship something totally different, and you then have to try to get redress through Aliexpress's dispute resolution, which IME is a joke - 7 weeks to be promised a partial refund after the seller admitted they'd sent the wrong item, claimed it was equivalent (despite them still listing both the ordered and shipped items) and admitting they won't sell the correct item in 1-offs. And also out of pocket from import duty on higher cost item.

Always read actual seller feedback (ignore percentages etc. - these are misleading), and steer clear of any that have no or bad feedback
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Offline miguelvp

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #41 on: September 26, 2014, 09:37:50 am »
For example the last link you posted shows the range as:
8~12 um

That is farther than NIR but not really FIR it's in between and closer to NIR than FIR within the  MWIR range:

http://www.edmundoptics.com/technical-resources-center/optics/the-correct-material-for-infrared-applications

How good will it be for imaging? not sure, it's good for spectroscopy (Edit: but used with lasers)

Edit2:
Actually according to wiki
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infrared
it belongs to LWIR (long wave infrared) good to measure human body heat, still I would like to see an image of the sensor before buying it.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2014, 09:44:46 am by miguelvp »
 

Offline Hypernova

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #42 on: September 26, 2014, 03:07:02 pm »
The other interesting aspect is at what point will the US manufacturers manage to persuade their leaders that restrictions on higher framerates are harming business more than they are protecting anyone from anything.
Applications like firefighting need a decent framerate, and once the kit becomes sufficiently small and cheap it will be impractical to control.

Totally true. I found someone selling on ALI Express last week - "high res" 640x480 sensor assembly, 70FPS, "only"  :) $900 each. 10 were available. 
384×288 sensors at 50FPS are easily available - shipping worldwide. I am wondering if these can be overclocked to 60FPS. I searched last year - there were none for sell with these frame rates. I can only imagine what will be available next year! I think Chinese company that makes/sells them is called "JIR" ... .

http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/M700-thermal-image-sensor-cheap-thermal_1899090531.html?s=p


For a legit Chinese company Dali is probably it: http://www.dali-tech.us/products/lt3-lt7-series-50.html

Personally I'm surprised that the Chinese cameras aren't more popular.
 

Offline eneuro

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #43 on: September 26, 2014, 04:46:57 pm »
OK. Moved from other Mu topic.

206x156 array, it's real, and only $199. This one could be a game changer.
Probably it does not have any reliable calibration between frames like Flir, but is looks quite compact for some apps, however it is a pitty it works only under Android?


There are some developers tools  http://www.thermal.com/developers.html , so maybe it will be possible to run this thing under Linux, like I used to use other cameras with OpenCV for automatic image processing in one of my projects.

Maybe, it could be possible to run this Seek Thermal on old fashion x86 PC using this Android-x86 4.4
Quote
"Key features include a KMS (Kernel Mode Setting) enabled Linux kernel 3.10.x LTS, Wi-Fi support, battery status, V4l2 camera support, G-sensor, bluetooth, suspend, resume, audio though ALSA, and mouse wheel support."

It looks like this Android-x86 Just Might Make a Good Linux Desktop Alternative is in active development and usable, so just downloading this CD iso file to test this Android version on old PC and turn it into live thermal video wi-fi streaming device with OpenCV postprocesed video in real time  8)

There is Android OpenCV , so this Seek thermal camera looks guite interesting for the moment and if it had V4l2 camera support it could be maybe possible to run it under Linux and capture each video frame under OpenCV without Android overhead?

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Offline miguelvp

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #44 on: September 26, 2014, 05:06:59 pm »
however it is a pitty it works only under Android?
IPhone as well, also $199.

Pitty it doesn't work on my blackberry ;)
kidding will use the wife's phone or my NVidia Shield 1st gen.
 

Offline amyk

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #45 on: September 26, 2014, 07:43:23 pm »
Those Chinese sensors are made by http://suncti.com/en/products.aspx and appear to be an "Uncooled amorphous silicon FPA" which is slightly different from the vanadium-oxide in the FLIR Ones.

Presumably these are not subjected to the same export restrictions since they're not US-developed.

I also found this one selling on TaoBao - what appears to be a 384x288 for  <$500 USD: http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=38681766798&spm=2014.21554143.0.0
 

Online Fraser

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #46 on: September 26, 2014, 08:59:45 pm »
ITAR regulations apply across teh Worlf fopr particpating states, namely thiose who signed up to the Wassenaar Arrangement:

http://www.wassenaar.org/

China is not shown as a member of the arrangement so presumably can do as they like, BUT if you are an OEM in a country that is part of the Wassenaar Arrangenement, your products will be ITAR liable even if you use the Chinese sensors. Its all about the product capability and technology and not about where it is actually manufactured.

Aurora
« Last Edit: September 26, 2014, 09:10:57 pm by Aurora »
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #47 on: September 26, 2014, 09:03:44 pm »
About shipping of Seek Thermal module. This is from facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Seek-Thermal/628554970550411

[user]when are you guys shipping?

[Seek Thermal] Hi Dat, The cameras will ship when the apps go live in their respective app stores. We estimate that that will be 1-2 weeks for Android and shortly thereafter for iOS.
 

Offline firehopper

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #48 on: September 26, 2014, 11:17:35 pm »
About shipping of Seek Thermal module. This is from facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Seek-Thermal/628554970550411

[user]when are you guys shipping?

[Seek Thermal] Hi Dat, The cameras will ship when the apps go live in their respective app stores. We estimate that that will be 1-2 weeks for Android and shortly thereafter for iOS.

so that means any shipping option other then the standard isnt worth it :) unless you really want it the next day after they start shipping.
 
 

Offline miguelvp

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #49 on: September 27, 2014, 12:22:21 am »
so that means any shipping option other then the standard isnt worth it :) unless you really want it the next day after they start shipping.

I did select standard because it was free shipping :)
 


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