Author Topic: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal  (Read 750728 times)

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Offline ez24

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1975 on: August 24, 2015, 07:57:33 pm »
I have read through 26 pages of this thread and I will keep reading but I just wanted to check if anyone might have tried to do the same as I want to do with this sensor and get a analoge output.

I have been ...  on-topic but the analoge video out part might be a little bit on topic :)

Edit: is raspberry pi and using the audio port for analoge video out an option or isn't it possible to use the PI to read video from the sensor?

I suggest you start a new post and re-word your question.  This post is much too long to make any sense.  I think you will get more answers if you put more of your question in the title.  If you do somehow let me know.  The animal rescue is interesting.  Also set your country flag via your profile, members appreciate this.  I suggest this title :  "Can you use a Pi drone with a Seek Camera for remote animal rescue?"  Then paste your project into the post.  Good luck
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Offline encryptededdy

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1976 on: August 24, 2015, 08:13:30 pm »
If you can afford it, take a look at the FLIR Vue. It's specifically designed for UAVs and has a variety of lens option, uses the same video out connector as a GoPro and has the same mounting points as a GoPro.

It's $1500 for the 320x240 and $3000 for the 640x480 (which is extremely cheap for a 640 core), however I understand that if you're looking for $250 cameras then that is probably out of your price range.
 

Offline minim

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1977 on: August 24, 2015, 08:26:52 pm »
Thank you for the input Aurora. I did find someone that used a raspberry pi for extracting pictures from this camera but it wasn't possible to find out if he was successful in doing so or if it was just a proof of concept picture (raw without filtering and if it was pictures or video output).

The SAR team I mentioned use that FLIR TAU camera you mentioned. I've added a video of typical use and how they managed to find cows. You don't think the Seek thermal would be good enough for this?


ez24, I'm sorry but english is not my native language so I'll ask for some clarification. Was my post to long with to much info or is this thread to long? Should I make another thread for my question or another post in this thread with less info?

I added the flag, thanks for suggesting that.

ecryptededdy, A good suggestion, but it was kind of out of my price range. If going that high I would have to try to recoup some of it from my "customers" and I really wanted to just provide this as a free service for local farmers and maybe the SAR team here locally. The quad setup alone will be $1500-2000 already so the budget would get a big dent with one component at the same price. 
 

Online mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1978 on: August 24, 2015, 11:51:21 pm »
This is pretty close to what you want - Lepton based composite output camera based on Lepton sensor.
http://diydrones.com/profiles/blogs/dronethermal-mav-cameras-almost-ready
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Online Fraser

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1979 on: August 25, 2015, 02:03:46 am »
Good spot Mike. An impressive project and finished product. I only hope the second generation Lepton becomes available for such projects.

Aurora
 

Offline ez24

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1980 on: August 25, 2015, 02:05:46 am »
mikeselectricstuff

I think you should be given an award but since I do not have one  :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+ :-+

You have the most reply's to a question I have seen  132 pages of answers !

Good job
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Offline minim

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1981 on: August 25, 2015, 05:52:39 am »
This is pretty close to what you want - Lepton based composite output camera based on Lepton sensor.
http://diydrones.com/profiles/blogs/dronethermal-mav-cameras-almost-ready

Nice find! This using the seek sensor (higher res) would be perfect. I've seen that people have troubles spotting things at distance due to low resolution with the lepton sensor. I will try to read more up on it tho and see if that can fit my use.
 

Offline encryptededdy

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1982 on: September 01, 2015, 10:28:44 am »
Interestingly Seek have started referring to their cameras as the Compact and Compact XR.

Is this a harmless name change or does it suggest a new product (ie. non-compact) is coming soon?



 

Offline the1snm

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1983 on: September 02, 2015, 11:56:30 am »
Interestingly Seek have started referring to their cameras as the Compact and Compact XR.

Is this a harmless name change or does it suggest a new product (ie. non-compact) is coming soon?


Now that is an interesting find, I see that the Seek homepage and products page have also made the change and use the compact term. I'd reckon that we may see a new larger unit coming soon...

Steve
 

Offline minim

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1984 on: September 04, 2015, 10:57:56 am »
Would be nice if seek thermal started selling their camera cores also like flir is doing so they can be developed by users to the needs. Currently flir only sells the core of the flir one 80x80 chip and not the new ones :/ would be perfect to get the seek thermal resolution instead of that  :)
 

Online Fraser

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1985 on: September 04, 2015, 02:46:46 pm »
A significant difference between the FLIR LEPTON and the SEEK core is packaging. The LEPTON was designed as a 'sugar cube' format camera building block, the SEEK is an open die with bond wires that needs to be protected within a capsule of some sort. SEEK may not be interested in spending money on an encapsulation for their core as such may not be that cheap to develop. To mimic the LEPTON they would need to provide a new PCB on which to attach the die and bond wires, a case for the core, an FFC shutter, and a lens mount, or lens. It would also need a built in microprocessor to interpret the output of the die mounted ROIC. The cost is likely creeping towards the SEEK camera cost for production.

In truth, the SEEK camera as a whole component is very much like what you find inside the tiny LEPTON core. FLIR did well to cram so much into such a tiny format.

Aurora
« Last Edit: September 04, 2015, 02:49:19 pm by Aurora »
 

Offline encryptededdy

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1986 on: September 05, 2015, 03:49:44 am »
I note that in the latest Seek app there is now a option for "Image Smoothing". That's interesting!

Can someone who has a Seek please upload some comparison images between smoothing off and smoothing on?

 

Online mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1987 on: September 05, 2015, 06:53:42 am »
CBA to capture images but looks like a lowpass filter to lose some of the fine-grain noise, only obvious in low-contrast scenes
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Offline in.Vitro

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1988 on: September 05, 2015, 09:00:38 am »
The First one ist without Image smoothing.
I know the Image is pretty boring :P

IMO its a pointless thing because you lose fine details.
And I think that the noise is okay for a such little device.
Come on guys you have a lot of Photo editing apps in your Phone.
PS Express for example can reduce Noise, sharpen the image and get the shitty contrast right ;)
« Last Edit: September 05, 2015, 01:04:40 pm by in.Vitro »
 

Offline mos6502

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1989 on: September 05, 2015, 08:04:40 pm »
I've added a video of typical use and how they managed to find cows. You don't think the Seek thermal would be good enough for this?

This guy demonstrates looking at a horse, this should give you a rough idea:

for(;;);
 

Offline termal lee

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1990 on: September 15, 2015, 07:56:10 pm »
someone somewhere, i dont remember, said, vanadium oxyde has been around for longer time than the other sensors of thermal cams, but vanadium oxyde doesnt last very long. i am now concerned with the longevity of this camera. can anyone tell, what is the expected age of use of seek thermal (now it is called seek compact for no reason)?

cheers  :-+
 

Online Fraser

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1991 on: September 15, 2015, 09:09:16 pm »
Termal lee,

News to me.

VoX microbolometers are long lived devices. Remember the VoX lives in a vacuum. There can be vacuum contamination from a Peltier assembly (if fitted) and that is a more likely issue for some microbolometers. Out gassing of components inside the microbolometer vacuum chamber is well understood and manufacturers do their best to limit such.

The first FLIR thermal camera that used a VoX microbolometer was the PM570 in 1997. I still own three PM570 cameras and they are all performing well.

Fraser
 

Offline termal lee

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1992 on: September 16, 2015, 03:02:58 am »
Fraser,

thank you for the answer! now i can feel relaxed a bit. i think we just have to keep it from being dropped down or getting bumped onto wall or something.
this is what will happen if we drop them


and oh yeah, seek offers 20$ for 2 years warranty. which means, they actually feel pretty solid about the item's longevity. i am now assured that seek is a hell of a long lasting item, judging from the guy in the video commenting about the fact that he didnt actually need to throw it away after the sensor messed up a bit after being dropped from 3 feet height onto concrete floor. but i guess, since the sensor lives in a vacuum, it will not last long, since the vacuum will be slowly messed up by incoming air into the broken sensor. could be, right?  :-//
« Last Edit: September 16, 2015, 08:49:40 am by termal lee »
 

Online Fraser

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1993 on: September 16, 2015, 10:18:37 am »
12um pixels suspended above the substrate will be fragile. However consider dropping any sort of non ruggedised camera onto concrete...... Its generally not a good outcome.

With regard to the warranty, it would be worth checking the small print. Does it cover accident related damage ?

The vacuum is pretty safe inside a microbolomeyer core. The capsule would not normally rupture due to a fall.

Fraser
 

Offline eneuro

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1994 on: September 16, 2015, 06:32:44 pm »
I've added a video of typical use and how they managed to find cows. You don't think the Seek thermal would be good enough for this?
This guy demonstrates looking at a horse, this should give you a rough idea:
I think that, dog could be more successfull in looking for cows and... more friendly than crappy mobile phone app  :-DD

Anyway, I've finished watchinglinked video on... second sentence like this:
"... perfect for that ..."  :palm:

It could be much better if seek changed package of this thermal imaging camera for something more usable, while its shape optimized for tablet and samrtphone fans, makes them useless in more interesting tasks, because of USB connector have to be desoldered and custom enclosures made, to have something which looks like not plastic crap, but something we can show someone as real thing which is much better protected from PCB crack, etc  ;)

BTW: I;d like to see what bloody drones will see using their thermal cameras when... laser gun or cheap laser pointer hits them at 200m distance from my yard-yep cheap laser pointer easy reaches trees 500m meters away from yard  >:D
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Offline sguyader

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1995 on: September 17, 2015, 12:15:57 pm »
Hi everybody,

I asked a question about the SeekThermal XR in another topic here.

Any idea?

-Sebastien
 

Offline frenky

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1996 on: September 17, 2015, 12:25:28 pm »
I've spend a few months developing app for Seek and I tell you:  Go with Flir Lepton core and raspberry PI. Seeks output is way too unstable for useful constant measuring of temperature.
At least until they make SDK public.

Some links:
https://www.sparkfun.com/products/13233
https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/flir-lepton-hookup-guide
https://www.tindie.com/products/PureEngineering/flir-lepton-thermal-camera-breakout-2/
https://github.com/groupgets/LeptonModule
 

Online Fraser

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1997 on: September 17, 2015, 01:42:41 pm »
+1

The SEEK disappointed me greatly.

Therm App is excellent if you can afford it. FLIR F1 G2 looks a good camera for the asking price.

My standing recommendation remains the FLIR E4 with hack applied to release its full potential.

Fraser
 

Offline sguyader

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1998 on: September 17, 2015, 01:55:40 pm »
Thanks frenky and Fraser.
Indeed the temperature differences might be low, probably in the range of 0 to 3°K between the areas of interest. I don't know what resolution I need, it oesn't need to be very high as lon as I can get up close, so that the area (around 50mm x 50mm) fills the frame.
I don't want to invest too much money right now (I can't ask fonds yet) so I need something cheap to begin with, then maybe if the results are promising I can ask for a specific grant to buy a more professional camera.
I'll investigate what the lepton camera can do.

-Sebastien
 

Offline termal lee

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Re: Yet another cheap thermal imager incoming.. Seek Thermal
« Reply #1999 on: September 17, 2015, 01:58:47 pm »
hands up here, i am a fan of therm-App as well   :-+ and the lenses are best, germanium made . evilish cool  >:D

Frenky, i saw you posted pics of your seek thermal cam + 50mm ZnSe and even 100mm ZnSe. can you tell us where did u buy those lenses? how much did they cost? i am sure they are beyond the use and sale of CO2 intended use too. i didnt know they sell ZnSe 100mm!
and how did the 50mm performs better than 100mm? or am i missing something here? idk :-//
 


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