eevBLAB 120 - DCS sues Youtuber for Defamation! - Threatens entire review indust

[EEVblog]

A small Australian company called Deep Cycle Systems (DCS) is suing Youtuber Stephan Fischer from AllOffroad 4x4 Adventures for defamation for (IMO) an honest multi-year battery review and documenting other users  experiences with DCS LFP batteries in their 4x4 vehicles.
If DCS win this insane lawsuit it will be a threat to the entire review industry, everyone will lose.



https://www.youtube.com/@UC825uQNChjLwDQC7B3yZdoQ
GoFundMe: https://www.gofundme.com/f/help-fight-for-truth-in-youtube-reviews
https://www.patreon.com/alloffroad
Defamation lawsuit playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLA2XSq4ONOVJB3uj0xsjcZiGAS1Nd8skV
The two review videos he's being sued for:



The Australian government have tested DCS LFP home storage batteries:
https://arena.gov.au/projects/testing-the-performance-of-lithium-ion-batteries/
Report is here: https://arena.gov.au/assets/2018/05/lithium-ion-battery-testing-public-report-12.pdf

There is some precedent for defamation by companies against individuals in Australia:
https://www.austlii.edu.au/au/journals/CommsLawB/2020/14.pdf
https://gclegal.com.au/limelight-newsletters/defaming-through-google-reviews/
Defamation act 2005: https://legislation.nsw.gov.au/view/whole/html/inforce/current/act-2005-077
The battery capacity tester discussed:
https://www.amazon.com.au/MakerHawk-Adjustable-Electronic-Intelligent-Resistance/dp/B07F3NHHST

Deep Cycle System website:
https://www.deepcyclesystems.com.au/
https://www.deepcyclesystems.com.au/dcs-battery-tech/

Reviews: https://www.productreview.com.au/listings/deep-cycle-systems-dcs

Other videos discussing the DCS lawsuit:
Louis Rossman: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=louis+rossmann+dcs
John Cadogan:
4x4 Adventures:

[dietert1]

After watching one of the videos i thought about the 1.5 % accuracy claim in battery capacity measurements. Doing this measurement in a two wire scheme can yield systematically low results, as the 10 A test current can certainly cause a voltage drop of 0.5 V or so, that is already 4 % of 12 V. I didn't notice any four wire setup in the video.
Legally it may not be enough to assume Ah and Wh is the same.

Regards, Dieter

[mikeselectricstuff]

Wonder if they're also going to sue all the people leaving reviews here
https://www.productreview.com.au/listings/deep-cycle-systems-dcs

Interesting one here suggests maybe they're a 1-man-band importer

- That SW upgrade only possible at owners private address in the Brisbane hills, no car parking.

[EEVblog]

After watching one of the videos i thought about the 1.5 % accuracy claim in battery capacity measurements. Doing this measurement in a two wire scheme can yield systematically low results, as the 10 A test current can certainly cause a voltage drop of 0.5 V or so, that is already 4 % of 12 V. I didn't notice any four wire setup in the video.
Legally it may not be enough to assume Ah and Wh is the same.

In the testing video instruction Stephan mentions to run capacity tester until the BMS inside the battery itself does the voltage detection and shutoff.
This means that 4-wire testing is irrelevant, as the capacity tester is just essentially a constant current load, timer, and calculator.
So seems a legit test to me.

[snoopy]

What's with the DCS brand lately because another unrelated dCS tried to sue another youtube reviewer recently for a negative review but the rally cry and negative publicity made them eat humble pie in the end

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/dcs-threatens-with-a-7-figure-lawsuit-over-a-review.55729/

[madires]

Did DCS book the all-inclusive Streisand effect full experience package?

[EEVblog]

What's with the DCS brand lately because another unrelated dCS tried to sue another youtube reviewer recently for a negative review but the rally cry and negative publicity made them eat humble pie in the end

A saw that in my search and had to watch it before I figured out it was th same DCS!

[EEVblog]

Did DCS book the all-inclusive Streisand effect full experience package?

The super delux package option!

[3roomlab]

The Australian government have tested DCS LFP home storage batteries:
https://arena.gov.au/projects/testing-the-performance-of-lithium-ion-batteries/
Report is here: https://arena.gov.au/assets/2018/05/lithium-ion-battery-testing-public-report-12.pdf

wow this batt test docu is really telling

[dietert1]

Please note that these tests labeled "Australian Government" and "Australian Renewable Energy Agency" are executed by a company named ITP in Canberra. Still missing is a serious comparison to lead-acid battery storage. One of the remarks in Stephan Fischers video was "going back to lead-acid". ITP reports describe problems while testing lead-acid battery storage, but i didn't find numbers on capacity fading.
We have to be aware that everything made public in this field may be worth millions. In my opinion any result that can't be verified shouldn't be trusted.

Regards, Dieter

[EEVblog]

The Australian government have tested DCS LFP home storage batteries:
https://arena.gov.au/projects/testing-the-performance-of-lithium-ion-batteries/
Report is here: https://arena.gov.au/assets/2018/05/lithium-ion-battery-testing-public-report-12.pdf

wow this batt test docu is really telling

And it sounds like they tried their best to compensate and extract the most energy they could.

[EEVblog]

Please note that these tests labeled "Australian Government" and "Australian Renewable Energy Agency" are executed by a company named ITP in Canberra.

Who set up a battery test facility based on the government funding. And the data is officially republished by the government.
In fact the test result data doesn't seem to be available through the companies website, only via the government portal.
So it very fair to say it's "government testing" IMO.

https://itpau.com.au/knowledge/itps-battery-test-centre/

[thm_w]

Please note that these tests labeled "Australian Government" and "Australian Renewable Energy Agency" are executed by a company named ITP in Canberra. Still missing is a serious comparison to lead-acid battery storage. One of the remarks in Stephan Fischers video was "going back to lead-acid". ITP reports describe problems while testing lead-acid battery storage, but i didn't find numbers on capacity fading.
We have to be aware that everything made public in this field may be worth millions. In my opinion any result that can't be verified shouldn't be trusted.

Regards, Dieter

Kind of two separate issues here. The going back to lead acid part is only talking about the 12V under-hood lead acid battery. I wouldn't be surprised if the DCS battery is still better than a lead acid.
And he could always run some wires to re-locate the battery to an area of the truck that is not so hot. I'd take LFP over lead-acid any day in terms of reliability. Even it meant some extra work.

[dietert1]

Looking at the BYD battery test diagram shown above, it's interesting that the storage capacity increased. Of course it didn't increase physically but they introduced another mode of operation or another mode of measurement that works better. Probably those technologies are still in a pioneering stage.
The photovoltaic generators that we built in 2008 will also need a storage system when the government guarantees expire in 2028.

Regards, Dieter

[madires]

More DCS fun:
  DCS Uses False Privacy Claim to Silence ANOTHER Reviewer: @WillProwse (by Louis Rossmann)
  https://odysee.com/@rossmanngroup:a/dcs-uses-false-privacy-claim-to-silence:9

[Brumby]

DCS seems to have taken the old saying to "shoot oneself in the foot" up a notch or three (I'm thinking mini-gun).... and have completely missed the text book example of the Streisand Effect they have created.

Someone described their action as the ultimate "own goal" in marketing.  I think the whole exercise is far more gruesome...

... and it seems they have either doubled down or just can't see it.
 

[EEVblog]

DCS seems to have taken the old saying to "shoot oneself in the foot" up a notch or three (in thinking mini-gun).... and have completely missed the text book example of the Streisand Effect they have created.
Someone described their action as the ultimate "own goal" in marketing.  I think the whole exercise is far more gruesome...

It might get more gruesome, stay tuned.

[ArdWar]

Looking at the BYD battery test diagram shown above, it's interesting that the storage capacity increased. Of course it didn't increase physically but they introduced another mode of operation or another mode of measurement that works better.

I'm not sure if it's that, or if they just went very conservative with initial advertised capacity, setting the max charge by some artificial limit in the BMS, and use the reserve headroom to compensate the aging losses. Kind of like overprovisioning in SSD.

Depending on which advertising checkbox you want to tick, I think that's viable strategy. Advertising huge initial capacity is good, but advertising long life with the appearance of low capacity drops can also look very good to consumers that it worth the initial cut.

[graybeard]

DCS has just posted a new marketing video.

[EEVblog]

DCS has just posted a new marketing video.

The comments section is open 

[graybeard]

I added this comment before I posted on eevblog

[richnormand]

just been there .... still says 0 comments....

[graybeard]

They deleted or hid my comment.

[richnormand]

Still says 0 comments.
I guess there are not many positive ones being posted.......

[EEVblog]

Let's see what happens