Edward Snowden affairs, what say you ?

[Shenandoah]

Let me quote half the American public (you guess which half ):

Well, I've got nothing to hide...

What about the genitals? still nothing to hide?

low blow troll bro

Oh I see your are of that type "I've got nothing to hide..." so go hide in your worship place.

[duskglow]

Shenendoah, you are typifying the quote:  It is better to close your mouth and be thought a fool, than to open it and remove all doubt.

[cthree]

I'm surprised that anyone is surprised by any of this. I've known since forever that as soon as a packet leaves my house it traverses "the Internet" before it get to where it is going. I think all this shock and horror is just a little more than disingenuous, especially when it comes from people who make their livings building and using the very things they claim to be totally ignorant of and disgusted by.

GPS tracking your location from your phone? Checked into 4square lately? Tagged a photo of a friend and uploaded it to facebook with the EXIF metadata attached? Used the face recognition software in iPhoto?

It seems the most vocal opposition comes from the biggest hypocrites. Knock off the "I want my privacy" bullshit! No you don't. You want just the opposite. The last thing these idiots want is privacy which is why they posts a running play-by-paly narration of every god-dammed thing they eat for lunch, what it looked like, when they ate it, who they were with, where they are going next and details of every stop they make along the way. The only thing missing is the time and location and a photograph of lunch on the way out.

People are attention whores and this is a society which rewards those who attract the most of it. "Eyeballs" is the currency of social and economic power in the age of the Internet. Being private is being nobody. The furor over nothing is just an attempt to get even more attention and by all accounts it's working.

[duskglow]

The only thing missing is the time and location and a photograph of lunch on the way out.

Obviously you're not on G+.  Foodporn is a genre.

[thefatmoop]

whohohoho stop the car, we've got an emergency can't you see? You want to know why we stopped the car? guess

statement from snowden
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/07/02/statement-from-edward-snowden/


And what's with the reporters the Good ol gov is going after who report on the leaked documents? Freedeom of the press out the window too?

[rolycat]

The only thing missing is the time and location and a photograph of lunch on the way out.

Obviously you're not on G+.  Foodporn is a genre.

Are you sure you read cthree's post right? Getting excited about pictures of food on the way out isn't foodporn, its coprophilia. Yeurrghh.

[duskglow]

Oh, "on the way out".  Missed that part.  I need to stop commenting right after I wake up.

[G7PSK]

I presume you all fill in you tax returns and census forms went through school and college. Well the government know how much you earn how old you are where you were born what grades you made etc in fine detail. Unless they have more spooks than citizens they will not be able to read all your emails and listen to your phone calls, all they do is look for patterns in the information that attracts attention due to indications of some unlawful activity. at one time here in the UK every community had its local bobby (policeman) they knew what every one was doing and when and if you were a kid up to no good he would give you a clip around the ear. Keeping tabs is not new and will continue. Governments also collect information on all foreign powers friendly or otherwise in order to get a better  idea of what their intentions are very useful in negotiations. I cannot see that Snowden is worth all the effort that the US is going to as what he says is not really news to those in the know and should come as no surprise to any one else.  

[AlfBaz]

I'm surprised that anyone is surprised by any of this. I've known since forever that as soon as a packet leaves my house it traverses "the Internet" before it get to where it is going. I think all this shock and horror is just a little more than disingenuous, especially when it comes from people who make their livings building and using the very things they claim to be totally ignorant of and disgusted by.

GPS tracking your location from your phone? Checked into 4square lately? Tagged a photo of a friend and uploaded it to facebook with the EXIF metadata attached? Used the face recognition software in iPhoto?

It seems the most vocal opposition comes from the biggest hypocrites. Knock off the "I want my privacy" bullshit! No you don't. You want just the opposite. The last thing these idiots want is privacy which is why they posts a running play-by-paly narration of every god-dammed thing they eat for lunch, what it looked like, when they ate it, who they were with, where they are going next and details of every stop they make along the way. The only thing missing is the time and location and a photograph of lunch on the way out.

People are attention whores and this is a society which rewards those who attract the most of it. "Eyeballs" is the currency of social and economic power in the age of the Internet. Being private is being nobody. The furor over nothing is just an attempt to get even more attention and by all accounts it's working.

I think this whole "look at me!!" generation of people is pathetic, to say the least but at the end of the day it's their choice. Just because a select few decide to publish their every move, doesn't mean it's a green light for authorities to disrespect and/or invade the privacy of all.

With regards to the ease with witch we can be tracked due to technological advances, this is just no argument. I have windows in my house that are see through, and I don't hide my traveling habits. This doesn't mean I will condone somebody standing on the street leering into my house or following me around.

I constantly see in these arguments people saying that they don't care about their privacy, but sorry, this is utter bullshit. At some point everyone wants a little privacy for whatever reason and if we tolerate a little today, bit by bit we wont have noticed every single minute action and detail of our lives will be chronicled in some government database... If that's not the case already http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utah_Data_Center
 

[rolycat]

Keeping tabs is not new and will continue. Governments also collect information on all foreign powers friendly or otherwise in order to get a better  idea of what their intentions are very useful in negotiations. I cannot see that Snowden is worth all the effort that the US is going to as what he says is not really news to those in the know and should come as no surprise to any one else.

It's no surprise to anyone with half a brain that the U.S. and British governments get up to this sort of thing, but unless people like Snowden make them public those in power can always claim that it's all just conspiracy theories.

What rights we have left are being eroded daily in the name of 'security', and just because loss of privacy is inevitable doesn't mean one shouldn't try to mitigate the worst abuses.

The problem is that if you reveal enough to convince the doubters there is going to be collateral damage, and the citizens of the offending countries end up suffering the consequences rather than just their governments.

[jantb]

Hi
In a holy war there is nothing holy,not even the principels supposed to be defended.
Reading some of the posts.Nothing new under the sun,still the same Double standard,political-religious paranoia...etc.

This song keept  popping up in my head while reading this.

Law and order.

Saw your face on TV
You say "It's all right, have no fear;
I am here"
Panic's ended
Your rights defended
From those who tried
To tell you about the other side
Of life, the strife that's going on
Go to sleep now
Count the sheep now
With us the dream will never end

It's easy to take what you are told
They said we need law and order
But now all our lives are bought and sold
And just for some law and order

Now your days grow colder
The plans they've got for you are clear
So clear
You're not so sure
You want that cure
And those who tried
To tell you about the shit that's going down
are found out on the moor
But just don't ask how
Curfew starts now
Get off the streets and bolt the door

We'll get away from here one day
I'll take you across the border
There's got to be somewhere we can stay
Where they don't need law and order

It's easy to take what you are told
They said we need law and order
But now all your lives are bought and sold
And just for some law and order

We'll get away from here one day
I'll take you across the border
There's got to be somewhere we can stay
Where they don't need law and order

William Alan Macdonald Maccormick, Phil Manzanera (1977)

[c4757p]

What about the genitals? still nothing to hide?

Many Americans are quite unafraid to put them on show:





As usual, the dick's in front.

[SeanB]

Nothing to hide answer. Have you ever bought cigarettes for yourself or anybody and paid with a card, or used a store card? Have you done the same for alcohol? Have you done the same with fast food? You will in future have your healthcare denied because they will say it is self inflicted by your lifestyle.

Remember it is not the current guys you need worry about but those who come in the future, having all the data there is going to mean it will be used. The biggest user of snooping powers in the UK is local councils looking to swat old ladies who let the dog out and it poops in the street.

[ftransform]

All those people are way too busy masturbating to face book private pictures to do anything useful with the data.

The government is in fact employing people to masturbate.

In my opinion they should chemically castrate everyone who works in the intelligence services.

[c4757p]

Wait, really? Where do I send my bill?

[ftransform]

Wait, really? Where do I send my bill?

In order to find the data centers you must only track the large shipments of kleenex and personal lubricant.

They probably have little taps on their desks filled with lube, kind of like soap dispensers. It might be even connected to some kind of building hydraulic system.

[Stonent]

Oh come on. Don't act so naive people.

Every country that can, uses any technology it can, to spy on other countries any time it can.

A quote from Casablanca comes to mind -

"I'm shock - shocked - that gambling is going on in here!"

Your quote reminded me of the scene in Men in Black where they go to the pawn shop to find the guy who was selling the alien guns. "Oh I was just about to turn those in"

That and this

[gregariz]

In my opinion they should chemically castrate everyone who works in the intelligence services.

Considering the state of western electronics.. its highly likely that some of these forum members have worked for GCHQ / NSA and various like agencies. It is possible they are no longer quite normal. Radomes on top of prying satellite dishes are not there for the weather.

[Stonent]

Let me quote a former US president:

Benjamin Franklin

 

Doh!

[ftransform]

In my opinion they should chemically castrate everyone who works in the intelligence services.

Considering the state of western electronics.. its highly likely that some of these forum members have worked for GCHQ / NSA and various like agencies. It is possible they are no longer quite normal. Radomes on top of prying satellite dishes are not there for the weather.

Well you are not normal to begin with if you seek employment by them. I feel that working for the local mafia family is overall more honest.
I guess their both pretty bad but hey, I'd rather support small business.

When is the last time the CIA threw you a block party or gave out thanksgiving turkeys?

[c4757p]

Yes, but the NSA has Kool-Aid! The mafia doesn't have that, do they? Kool-Aid is good...

[ftransform]

Yes, but the NSA has Kool-Aid! The mafia doesn't have that, do they? Kool-Aid is good...

At least the mafia does not sell drugs to kids.

actually who am i kidding, they both do.

their the same thing!

[Stonent]

I'll throw a little gasoline into the conversation...

If we remove right/left politics we have this
President Obama campaigned on reversing Bush era things like the patriot act, guantanamo bay, bringing an immediate end to Iraq, and regaining world trust of the US.

And what do we have now?

Accusations of the IRS being used for spying on political opponents, guantanamo bay still going strong, we still have people in Iraq and unmanned drone strikes have quadrupled.

Nixon spied on a few hotel rooms and was basically fired. Our current government is spying on millions of people and the people who voted for them are silent.

Ralph Nader well known (in the US) for exposing how unsafe cars were in the 60s and 70s, green party presidential candidate (too many times to count) claims President Obama is a worse "war criminal" than Bush.

"Change" isn't quite the word.

Senators and Congressmen get paid somewhere between 150 and 200k a year, but none leave politics without being multimillionaires.  Legally they can invest in companies that they have oversight on regarding mergers. So they could buy a few million in stock and approve a merger and double their investment.

Perhaps in 2016 we'll get a real change away from business as usual politicians and fire as many people as we can.

[ftransform]

An the rise of hits has increased too. They used to call out a few hits, on communist leaders in african countries, now their doing a few hits a day with drones, on camels

[duskglow]

Part of the problem is that we keep getting absolutely horrible choices for President.  I kind of held my nose when I voted for Obama (yes, I did).  But that's because I felt that between him and McCain, or him and Romney, he was the better choice.  That was also damning with faint praise.  I would have rather had a Huntsman or even a Feingold.  But that's our political system in a nutshell.  We get the choices they want us to have, and none of them are any good.  I *still* think Obama was the better choice, even though I am absolutely not a fan of many of the things he's done.

I'm dreading the next election, because I do not want to see what the GOP throws at us.  It will probably be indistinguishable from something brown and sticky.  The problem with that is that all the democratic party will have to do is throw us a warm body that isn't brown and sticky, and people will vote for him or her in droves.  And we'll probably get another Obama.

Sigh.