WTF, 30 years of electronic advancement and the headphone output gone backwards.

[BrianHG]

Holy Shit!, this Acer Aspire Go's headphone output is GARBAGE.
No, I mean really. It's a turd.  Audibly and measurably.

Every old PC I have with motherboard audio, my 16yo HP-Laptop, My old SB-AWE64 Gold, even my 2 cell phones, one of which is a Chinese garbage one, all sound and measure identical with their headphone output.  The simplest sound possible.  I cant do an audio presentation demo with this garbage.  Even the stupid audio IO on my DECA FPGA dev board sounds perfect.

Now, I need to shop for a separate DAC and hope it isn't garbage and windows will hopefully work with it.

Great going future of tech...

[Zoli]

It's called "Race to the bottom".
Audio DAC: there are "generic, driver-less" DAC - look for those ones. I have an extra Monoprice DAC/Headphone amp, but IIRC, you're too far from BC 

[NiHaoMike]

I wouldn't be too surprised if the headphone output is just a pair of PWM outputs from the chipset plus some passives, similar to how Raspberry Pi does it.

In my experience, my old DX79SI has a really poor quality analog output, especially given it was a high end motherboard of its time. I doubt the analog output would be able to pass Intel's official HD specification with low impedance headphones connected (that was when it measured the worst), but it did have S/PDIF output so that could have allowed them to loophole the spec.

[amyk]

Which model is this exactly? There are several named Acer Aspire Go, I found one which cross-references to a Quanta Z8T OEM, and this has a 4-terminal headset jack for both input and output; if you don't use an actual headset or a mic+headphone splitter adapter, the terminals might not make the right contact and you end up splitting the amplifier output into the mic input. Many years ago laptops had separate jacks for input and output, so this problem doesn't occur there.

I wouldn't be too surprised if the headphone output is just a pair of PWM outputs from the chipset plus some passives, similar to how Raspberry Pi does it.

The aforementioned model has a pretty common Realtek ALC256/255 HDA codec; PC audio in the past 2 decades really hasn't changed much. (Couldn't find its datasheet, but ALC260 from 2005 has almost the same pinout.)

[Whales]

Could it be doing silly software processing?  Might be worth checking your system tray and start menu for audio related random software that might have been pre-installed or gets auto-installed by windows when it detects the hardware.  I had an XP computer once that decided it needed a really bad reverb effect applied for no particular reason one day, sounded like damaged speakers more than reverb.

[tooki]

Which model is this exactly? There are several named Acer Aspire Go, I found one which cross-references to a Quanta Z8T OEM, and this has a 4-terminal headset jack for both input and output; if you don't use an actual headset or a mic+headphone splitter adapter, the terminals might not make the right contact and you end up splitting the amplifier output into the mic input. Many years ago laptops had separate jacks for input and output, so this problem doesn't occur there.

That is complete nonsense.

When a 3-pin stereo TRS plug is inserted, SLEEVE (mike) and RING2 (GND) are shorted, whereas a 4-pin stereo+mike TRRS plug does not do that. This can be sensed by the IC. At no point is the amp output shorted to the mike input.

(Ok, if you inserted a 2-pin mono TS plug, you’d short RING1, RING2, and SLEEVE, but that’s still all shorted to GND.)

Regardless, the entire point of those combo jacks is that you can plug in either a headset, headphones, or a line out cable, and any can work.

[tooki]

Could it be doing silly software processing?  Might be worth checking your system tray and start menu for audio related random software that might have been pre-installed or gets auto-installed by windows when it detects the hardware.  I had an XP computer once that decided it needed a really bad reverb effect applied for no particular reason one day, sounded like damaged speakers more than reverb.

I was thinking the same thing. My HP laptop has (oh how the mighty have fallen) “Bang and Olufsen” sound, which is essentially an awful software filter that IMHO makes things worse. I vaguely remember having turned it off somehow. I don’t remember if there was something to uninstall or just a setting to make.

These Realtek audio codecs are much too widespread to actually be so bad, and they’re designed to require essentially no support components on the headphone output, so there’s kinda nothing to get wrong, hardware-wise. IMHO it’s much more plausible that there’s a stupid software filter mucking things up than any hardware issue.

[BrianHG]

It also sometimes has trouble detecting the headphones being plugged in...

From what I can tell, the output is ~ -6dbm compared to the 1vrms / 2.8vp-p coming from my old audio devices.

With the system volume up to a point, it is fine tuned to -6dbm, 1.4vp-p max, then the rails are hit and there is an auto-volume to try to make things sound as loud as the official 1vrms, but all the music high points are mushed.  All the enhanced processing features are turned off in the system control panel.  I think it is just the way it is designed.

Garbage!!!  Where is my true full 1v rms?

I ordered this thing: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B0FX9QS6TB

I'll report back tomorrow.

Funny, even using the 'Stereo Mix' to record the system audio needs to be set to 50% for thru if the master volume is at 100% and the software processing messes everything up.

Never had an issue with Win7 and my original audio cards, all of them.  Perfect digital through.

[Monkeh]

I ordered this thing: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B0FX9QS6TB

I'll report back tomorrow.

I would suggest you probably overpaid: https://www.amazon.ca/Apple-USB-C-Headphone-Jack-Adapter/dp/B0D7FF5Y3X

[BrianHG]

I ordered this thing: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B0FX9QS6TB

I'll report back tomorrow.

I would suggest you probably overpaid: https://www.amazon.ca/Apple-USB-C-Headphone-Jack-Adapter/dp/B0D7FF5Y3X

The latest Apple USB dacs are also now at half volume (quarter power) as required by European regulations.

Apparently, this is a thing...

Apple's USB-C to 3.5mm headphone jack adapter was released with the lower 0.5Vrms output limit in the European region starting from its introduction in November 2018 alongside the 2018 iPad Pro models, complying with regional safety standards limiting portable audio voltage.

WTF is with the world.  Some assholes don't take care of their ears, sue and complain to the government, and the rest of us suffer.  It only takes one to ruin it for everybody else.

(I know the quote says in Europe, but that doesn't mean that they eventually just started shipping the half volume garbage everywhere.  I cant afford time to buy, get the scope out, measure, return because Apple wont provide a technical spec on their product.)

The 20$ USB dac I selected outputs 1.42v RMS, or, 4v p-p.
That roasts apple's 0.5v RMS, or 1.42v p-p. (this lower level matches the limited output of my new Acer laptop's headphone output.  All my old PCs and equipment run at the normal 1v RMS and can even drive my studio audio amp to the correct levels.)

That extra headroom on the 1.4v RMS output allows me to set the system volume down to prevent that boosted processed auto-gain output when above 50% volume, if needed.  The sound drivers for this DAC might not process anything.

[themadhippy]

I would suggest you probably overpaid

9 quid??  about 3 times wot i paid
https://www.amazon.co.uk/KamKorda-Adapter-Headphone-Converter-Headset-Black/dp/B08CNLWBC9

works fine with linux,no drivers needed and sounds fine to my worn out lugholes

[amyk]

Which model is this exactly? There are several named Acer Aspire Go, I found one which cross-references to a Quanta Z8T OEM, and this has a 4-terminal headset jack for both input and output; if you don't use an actual headset or a mic+headphone splitter adapter, the terminals might not make the right contact and you end up splitting the amplifier output into the mic input. Many years ago laptops had separate jacks for input and output, so this problem doesn't occur there.

That is complete nonsense.

When a 3-pin stereo TRS plug is inserted, SLEEVE (mike) and RING2 (GND) are shorted, whereas a 4-pin stereo+mike TRRS plug does not do that. This can be sensed by the IC. At no point is the amp output shorted to the mike input.

(Ok, if you inserted a 2-pin mono TS plug, you’d short RING1, RING2, and SLEEVE, but that’s still all shorted to GND.)

Regardless, the entire point of those combo jacks is that you can plug in either a headset, headphones, or a line out cable, and any can work.

I'm speaking from experience. In theory these combo jacks are supposed to work but everyone knows that old saying about the difference between theory and practice... the tolerances can be pretty sloppy, and what the OP said is  further evidence:

It also sometimes has trouble detecting the headphones being plugged in...

I stand by my original recommendation to try a splitter adapter, or another one. That's what worked for me with a different laptop with the same combo jack design and muffled, distorted audio.

[BrianHG]

I'm speaking from experience. In theory these combo jacks are supposed to work but everyone knows that old saying about the difference between theory and practice... the tolerances can be pretty sloppy, and what the OP said is  further evidence:

It also sometimes has trouble detecting the headphones being plugged in...

I stand by my original recommendation to try a splitter adapter, or another one. That's what worked for me with a different laptop with the same combo jack design and muffled, distorted audio.

I agree, I found a 3.5mm jack which happens to be almost always detected.
However, the crappy 0.5v RMS output appears to be a hard wired limit level.

[tooki]

Which model is this exactly? There are several named Acer Aspire Go, I found one which cross-references to a Quanta Z8T OEM, and this has a 4-terminal headset jack for both input and output; if you don't use an actual headset or a mic+headphone splitter adapter, the terminals might not make the right contact and you end up splitting the amplifier output into the mic input. Many years ago laptops had separate jacks for input and output, so this problem doesn't occur there.

That is complete nonsense.

When a 3-pin stereo TRS plug is inserted, SLEEVE (mike) and RING2 (GND) are shorted, whereas a 4-pin stereo+mike TRRS plug does not do that. This can be sensed by the IC. At no point is the amp output shorted to the mike input.

(Ok, if you inserted a 2-pin mono TS plug, you’d short RING1, RING2, and SLEEVE, but that’s still all shorted to GND.)

Regardless, the entire point of those combo jacks is that you can plug in either a headset, headphones, or a line out cable, and any can work.

I'm speaking from experience. In theory these combo jacks are supposed to work but everyone knows that old saying about the difference between theory and practice... the tolerances can be pretty sloppy, and what the OP said is  further evidence:

It also sometimes has trouble detecting the headphones being plugged in...

I stand by my original recommendation to try a splitter adapter, or another one. That's what worked for me with a different laptop with the same combo jack design and muffled, distorted audio.

If I were a betting man, I’d bet that the plugs are more likely to be out of tolerance than the jacks. I certainly feel I’ve observed quite a bit of variation in plug dimensions. Large old-school panel-mount jacks had lots of room for big leaf springs that could absorb a lot of plug tolerance; the tiny SMD jacks in modern equipment doesn’t have that kind of space, so the springs are smaller.

Regardless, the failure mode you posited, the one to which I was responding, simply can’t happen, and I explained why. And while the added clue about the unreliable plug detection supports the theory that the plug is out of tolerance, that doesn’t explain the other symptoms described.

[BrianHG]

I ordered this thing: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B0FX9QS6TB

I'll report back tomorrow.

Ok, the USB Dac came in.  It delivers a full 1v RMS with the system volume at 75%.
The output is clean, full bandwidth and level matches all my old outdated, but properly designed sound cards without distortion.

In fact, I tied the output directly to 8 ohm bookshelf speakers and it drove them distortion free at a system volume of 75% with enough headroom volume to actually fill the room with sound...

At system volume 100%, the headphone drive appears distortion free, however driving 8 ohm speakers directly reveals amp clipping during some over-current protection peaks.  (The device is rated to drive 16ohm at full volume, so 8 ohm speakers are overloading it...)

I am happy with the purchase and would recommend it for those who require full line level or require a +6dbm boosted drive output for those demanding headphones.  However, the fake breaded data cable appears to be really thin.  Even though it is USB digital in that cable, I can imagine abusive user may eventually damage it.

If you are lucky enough to have an Apple USB DAC prior to 2018 re-release versions, they are also supposed to be very good delivering the standard 1v rms.

[Zucca]

I ordered this thing: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B0FX9QS6TB

I'll report back tomorrow.

Ok, the USB Dac came in.  It delivers a full 1v RMS with the system volume at 75%.
The output is clean, full bandwidth and level matches all my old outdated, but properly designed sound cards without distortion.

In fact, I tied the output directly to 8 ohm bookshelf speakers and it drove them distortion free at a system volume of 75% with enough headroom volume to actually fill the room with sound...

At system volume 100%, the headphone drive appears distortion free, however driving 8 ohm speakers directly reveals amp clipping during some over-current protection peaks.  (The device is rated to drive 16ohm at full volume, so 8 ohm speakers are overloading it...)

I am happy with the purchase and would recommend it for those who require full line level or require a +6dbm boosted drive output for those demanding headphones.  However, the fake breaded data cable appears to be really thin.  Even though it is USB digital in that cable, I can imagine abusive user may eventually damage it.

4N high-purity silver-plated single crystal copper wiring

That's why it is so much better. 

[BrianHG]

4N high-purity silver-plated single crystal copper wiring

That's why it is so much better. 

Where did you get that line from?

Oh, I see it on the graphic.
That's bullshit as the only wiring/cable is on the USB digital plug side.  If anything, its a thin poor conductor to the frame ground and if your laptop is on an AC charger with a lousy Y-cap in the PSU, then that may introduce hum into your audio if you are using the output to feed other audio equipment fed by the AC mains.  Poor choice in my opinion.  But for a floating load like headphones, or someone who knows how to mitigate looping ground hum, for a 20$ device, it is a pass.

[Zucca]

it's funny, audiophoolery bs is required to sell any audio electronics.

[LaserSteve]

Go pick an appropriate Focusrite Scarlett for your needs.  Install the drivers and plug it in. Job jobbed. Sad that you need to spend 119$  to get good audio, but it's not "marketing" driven audio with" 7G Surround Sound DSP features".

There are other good interfaces, Motu etc   I've got a 9.95 no name audio dongle from Amazon that performs better than most built in audio systems and doesn't hum either

I'm now at the point where I keep a transformer- less direct box in my presentation kit.  One more thing to carry and keep a battery or PSU for.  I've had audio professionals walk up and say 'How did you get such clear presentation audio"

Properly installed , quality, presentation  systems with good wiring are hit or miss. Especially in University lecture halls of all places.  I've donated a few direct boxes when I've been a guest. Very Sad. Sometimes it's stupid stuff where the mixer is on Phase A and the Amplifier is on Phase C of the three phase. Not many Sparkies know the simple steps for quality audio. At my previous University employer , my department chair had enough. "I don't care how you get in that locked Cabinet Steve, but fix it, I'll cover for you"

End Rant.

Steve

[nctnico]

Holy Shit!, this Acer Aspire Go's headphone output is GARBAGE.

What do you expect from a consumer budget brand? I guess that this is the computer you bought for software development? It beats me why you didn't listen to advice to choose professional computer hardware. Your business depends on it.

[BrianHG]

Holy Shit!, this Acer Aspire Go's headphone output is GARBAGE.

What do you expect from a consumer budget brand? I guess that this is the computer you bought for software development? It beats me why you didn't listen to advice to choose professional computer hardware. Your business depends on it.

I will upgrade once I get investment.  But I first need to demonstrate functionality to investors first.  Anyways, the laptop is compiling fine and my workflow is outpacing my allotted daily AI tokens during development and it runs my online test demo server fine.  For now, it will do.

Anyways, funny that my HP and Toshiba Laptops have no trouble with their headphones out.  And they are consumer grade laptops...

[nctnico]

Well, Acer is at the bottom of the barrel of computers.

[themadhippy]

Sometimes it's stupid stuff where the mixer is on Phase A and the Amplifier is on Phase C of the three phase

should not matter one bit.