FranLab is getting evicted

[EEVblog]

She seems to be indicating, that this may end up slowly ending Youtubes hold, on videos, especially creators who are currently using Youtube as their outlet, except for the very rich channels, who get very large sponsorship money, so they can pay Youtube, to promote their videos.

I have started a small scale test to find out:

[EEVblog]

So the plan is new merch and quarterly Patron drives. Fingers crossed.

BTW, I'm interviewing someone in half an hour for the merch role I advertised. She sounds like just the ticket. So unless I get any red flags, she'll start today.
So expect to see my ancient mech getting revived in the coming weeks.
The plan is the role pays for itself and my audience gets new and better merch options.

[nctnico]

I smell a rat race like paying Google for putting your website at the top of the list for search results. It can pay off but it is very costly. Likely only  affordable by channels that have good sponsorship deals.

And since it is experimentation time: how about advertising a Youtube channel on pron websites? These get huge amounts of traffic and advertising is dirt cheap per click volume. And don't get wound up about difference in subject matter. Advertising like this is just like advertising on TV. You are watching a Star Wars movie and -bam- there is a lady promoting tooth paste. Back when I was still in the web-design business I did a similar experiment and it did result in an increased number of visits to the website (even though it was not pron related at all).

[EEVblog]

And since it is experimentation time: how about advertising a Youtube channel on pron websites?

Paid advertising is a mugs game.
I'm just curious to test the direction that Youtube might be headed.
They have a recent new CEO, so maybe this is part of that change.

[floobydust]

So the plan is new merch and quarterly Patron drives. Fingers crossed.

BTW, I'm interviewing someone in half an hour for the merch role I advertised. She sounds like just the ticket. So unless I get any red flags, she'll start today.
So expect to see my ancient mech getting revived in the coming weeks.
The plan is the role pays for itself and my audience gets new and better merch options.

If you offer merch, don't bungle it like Elliot over at Hackaday did. Tee shirts - he ran out of the popular sizes, then put only women's tees on sale etc. How hard is it to have a few tee shirts in stock? Too hard apparently and then he killed off the merch store entirely. Dave is the only person who has one of their t-shirts lol.

As a revenue model, now he pimps out maker's projects on hackaday.io and he's not making money off the projects that I can see. I'd say he's doing it wrong, I sorta dislike the site and can't see it being sustainable especially with Autodesk et. al meddling in there as well.

[EEVblog]

If you offer merch, don't bungle it like Elliot over at Hackaday did. Tee shirts - he ran out of the popular sizes, then put only women's tees on sale etc. How hard is it to have a few tee shirts in stock? Too hard apparently and then he killed off the merch store entirely. Dave is the only person who has one of their t-shirts lol.

As a revenue model, now he pimps out maker's projects on hackaday.io and he's not making money off the projects that I can see. I'd say he's doing it wrong, I sorta dislike the site and can't see it being sustainable especially with Autodesk et. al meddling in there as well.

Didn't Hackaday get sold to SupplyFrame?

[floobydust]

I forgot about SupplyFrame and see he's still there as Editor in Chief, an author doing articles.
Can't see how the site makes money.
I mention it because there are some electronics sites that really seem to be on life support from the parent corp. AutoDesk included.
It seems to distort what constitutes a successful venture.

[sokoloff]

If you offer merch, don't bungle it like Elliot over at Hackaday did. Tee shirts - he ran out of the popular sizes, then put only women's tees on sale etc. How hard is it to have a few tee shirts in stock? Too hard apparently and then he killed off the merch store entirely.

Running out of popular sizes and putting the slower-running combinations on sale is 100% normal.

I work on the fulfillment software (manufacturing and logistics) side of a company that sells mass customized products, including apparel. The reason a lot of the T-shirt industry has gone to print-on-demand, direct-to-garment for merch sales is that it is hard to simultaneously not ever run out of some sizes of some designs and make merch profitable overall without tying up a huge amount of capital in slow-turning inventory.

You're going to sell a fair number of M and lot of L and XL unfitted ("mens") shirts in ash, dark blue, and black. If you sell those regularly, you'll get to know how to order them to keep them in stock. How many pink 4XLs are you going to sell a month? How many orange XSs? Even without going to odd colors, the combinatoric of size, color, design, fitted/unfitted gets to be pretty large. Eventually, when you discontinue the product or start winding it down to get warehouse shelf space back, you're going to run sales on the shirts you have to get rid of them.

There's a reason Amazon can offer such a huge selection of T-shirts and designs while rarely running out: https://www.asicentral.com/news/web-exclusive/september-2020/amazon-expands-print-on-demand-with-kornit-deal/ (Disclaimer: I have nothing to do with Amazon's capability here [other than sometimes buying shirts from them]; I work for a competitor in this space, but it's easier to cite an Amazon-related press release.)

[MK14]

She seems to be indicating, that this may end up slowly ending Youtubes hold, on videos, especially creators who are currently using Youtube as their outlet, except for the very rich channels, who get very large sponsorship money, so they can pay Youtube, to promote their videos.

I have started a small scale test to find out:

My worry, from the consumer (Youtube watcher), point of view.  Is that when I search for relatively essential videos, for specific reasons.

These days, after watching the searched for video (which stands a too high probability of having significant paid for promotions within the video, anyway).  Instead of seeing a pile of optional, scrollable thumbnail videos, very strongly related to the original searched item(s).

These is a huge selection of Youtube's special list of favoured/promoted what Youtube want to present to you videos.

I find that VERY annoying.  Because I want to just concentrate on the very directly related subject area, because I'm doing stuff and need to know.  E.g. What is the best/favourite/recommended PCB autorouter, in use today, and why.  If you must use them, as many recommend against using them, especially for doing the complete design.

Instead it seems to shows video links for a pile of other stuff, which (at other times, I admit is stuff I would watch), but I specifically did the direct search, because I just want to know more about modern day PCB autorouters (hypothetically, not other/leisure stuff etc).

I do seem to have noticed that if you are using a relatively anonymous browser situation.  E.g. A brand new fresh OS install.  It does seem to give, considerably better, much more directly related results.  But I shouldn't need to do that.

E.g. They should have a control at the top, that says something like 'Only show very closely related videos in this suggestion box column' or 'It's ok to show less well related videos' or 'show me anything that you think I may like'.

I suppose in summary.  It (Youtube), is heading to be much more like TV channels, with their mass advertising, product placements in some programmes kind of thing.

Rather than a very useful, specific tool, for researching very specific information.  Such as the best scope probes to buy, etc.

I.e. They are centring Youtube around their own desires to make as much money as possible, and don't really care about the consumers at all.

In my case, I try and concentrate on finding the Youtube video links myself, e.g. via google or Youtube websites, search features and/or keep a list of liked channels as bookmarks, which I periodically trawl through, rather than relying on Youtubes own methods, which seem to be extremely biased, because of 'the Youtubes Algorithm' reasons, which Fran seems to rather often, talk about.

[.RC.]

My worry, from the consumer (Youtube watcher), point of view.  Is that when I search for relatively essential videos, for specific reasons.

These days, after watching the searched for video (which stands a too high probability of having significant paid for promotions within the video, anyway).  Instead of seeing a pile of optional, scrollable thumbnail videos, very strongly related to the original searched item(s).

While I do not see youtube ads on my PC, on the tablet I actually get to see youtube showing you an ad every 30 seconds. Before the video, during and after it is all watch such and such a movie, buy such and such at JBHifi, vote yes for the voice, and all this shit like that I have no interest in.

So now youtube not only bore their watchers with annoying useless ads about something you are not interested in, they are going to take money from the creators so the watchers get an even less usable experience as they get blasted in the face with all these useless search results based on who pays the most to youtube.

[nctnico]

I agree with that. I only use Youtube as a source of instruction videos on how to specifically make/fix something or for specific product reviews.

[MK14]

While I do not see youtube ads on my PC, on the tablet I actually get to see youtube showing you an ad every 30 seconds. Before the video, during and after it is all watch such and such a movie, buy such and such at JBHifi, vote yes for the voice, and all this shit like that I have no interest in.

So now youtube not only bore their watchers with annoying useless ads about something you are not interested in, they are going to take money from the creators so the watchers get an even less usable experience as they get blasted in the face with all these useless search results based on who pays the most to youtube.

My fear (as a consumer of Youtube videos), is that it seems to be a "Race to the bottom", type of concept.  Making Youtube, an ever less and less useful appliance/engine for useful (consumer) things.

I know there are various upcoming alternatives to Youtube.  But if that splinters into many different organisations/systems, with partly differing characteristics.  That makes it harder for consumers to use such things.

Analogy:

There is one ebay.

If ebay disappeared, and there were ten, competitors/replacements.  It would end up being tricky.  As, sellers would have to choose between ten different platforms, rather than just sticking to one (ebay).

Buyers, instead of just searching/looking on ebay, would have to trawl through ten different platforms, and have to learn about ten different platforms.  Possibly have to register their credit card details on ten different platforms.

Have to contend with ten different feedback systems, with far fewer actual feedback ratings per seller.  Perhaps 5 instead of 750 on the real ebay.  750 shows a decent trend, of trustworthy or not.  But just 5 feedbacks is too few, to make a reliable decision on the sellers trustworthiness.

There are rumours/worries, that at some point, Youtube (Google), may stop people with ad-blockers, permanently and without warning.  Forcing users to either pay for the premium Youtube services or accept adverts (or move their watching activities to other platforms).

Even the fact that Youtube removed normal users ability to look at the dislike totals, is a nuisance.  As it stops people who are looking for serious/reliable to the point videos, to look for low/zero count dislike videos as one of the indicators of quality.

The thing is (the customer is always right), if downward (worsening) changes in Youtube, continue.  Making many users, use other platforms/methods/etc, in effect moving away from Youtube.

That fundamentally affects Youtube creators.  Because if huge chunks of their user-base, disappears from Youtube.  Then that effectively is a significant loss of customer base.  Which could leave the better Youtube channels to choose between shutting down, accepting almost no monetary rewards for their activities, making horrible Tik-tock like (Shorts) videos all the time, or just succumbing to doing massive paid sponsorship deals.

I can accept that I'm not describing this thing, in a perfectly coherent manner (I'm not a Youtube expert), and I'm mainly only speaking for myself.  But I'm going to be disappointed, if a large number of the Youtube channels, which I currently like, either disappear, significantly change (perhaps for the worse), or other things happen.

I suppose another analogy is Windows.  Which to me, seems to show how badly a company can ruin their product (e.g. Windows 11).  As I type this up, on some version of Linux.

Maybe we need a LinuxYouTube variant, which I suppose some of the upcoming Youtube variants, effectively are becoming.

[EEVblog]

These days, after watching the searched for video (which stands a too high probability of having significant paid for promotions within the video, anyway).  Instead of seeing a pile of optional, scrollable thumbnail videos, very strongly related to the original searched item(s).

These is a huge selection of Youtube's special list of favoured/promoted what Youtube want to present to you videos.

I find that VERY annoying.  Because I want to just concentrate on the very directly related subject area, because I'm doing stuff and need to know.  E.g. What is the best/favourite/recommended PCB autorouter, in use today, and why.  If you must use them, as many recommend against using them, especially for doing the complete design.

Instead it seems to shows video links for a pile of other stuff, which (at other times, I admit is stuff I would watch), but I specifically did the direct search, because I just want to know more about modern day PCB autorouters (hypothetically, not other/leisure stuff etc).

Youtube recently recomended an excellent 282 sub electronics channel to me:
https://twitter.com/eevblog/status/1663394706531954688
https://www.youtube.com/@eryjus4594

So the algorithm is still doing a good job in some regards.

[RJSV]

Yeahh, I see what you mean...Ironically, after your most recent video ended, (see above), YouTube put a few 'suggested views':
   First suggested video, after yours ended, was
   'Grandmother plays Chess in New York park'

Now, how is that not relevant, to an Electronics Blog ?     (Sarcasm, don't answer that)

[MK14]

So the algorithm is still doing a good job in some regards.

I get the impression, the 'algorithm' knew full well, the exact video(s) to present to me, to help me with the somewhat rare (OS related) specific videos I was seeking.

So, in frustration with Youtube, I tried Odysee, with a different, fairly unrelated (still OS related, I think) search.  After watching the first video they had, it (despite supposedly having no knowledge about my previous google video or Youtube searches), was able to recommend as the very next video, one which fixed my previous (OS related) problem.

I.e. Google must have passed the information on to Odysee.  Presumably for trying to blast me with relevant adverts and stuff.  Anyway, weird or amazing coincidence.
Edited: To make shorter.

[rsjsouza]

MK14, I wonder if cookies set on the browser you accessed Youtube were simply re-used by Odysee.

When I am doing these types of activities I use browser separation - i.e., Google products go their own sandbox (Google Chrome browser). Most of my other activities go on Firefox (including Odysee), with a few irrelevant activities on Chromium ungoogled.

It is not a straightforward thing and some self-control is always required - i.e., never run a Youtube video or use Google search on Firefox, for example.

[MK14]

MK14, I wonder if cookies set on the browser you accessed Youtube were simply re-used by Odysee.

When I am doing these types of activities I use browser separation - i.e., Google products go their own sandbox (Google Chrome browser). Most of my other activities go on Firefox (including Odysee), with a few irrelevant activities on Chromium ungoogled.

It is not a straightforward thing and some self-control is always required - i.e., never run a Youtube video or use Google search on Firefox, for example.

That's a very good point!

You could well be right.  That is a very good idea!

There are also, alternative search engines, such as duckduckgo, which at least claim to be relatively private.

The big complication, is sometimes the communications (cookies etc), help me.  As I'm offered (when not busy), a range of potentially interesting videos.

But at other times, when busy, where I ONLY want the specific video and very closely related videos, to solve a particular problem.  E.g. Difficulties with an OS.

Ironically (when I have the time available), the video selections, can offer some very interesting videos, which I didn't know existed.

[rsjsouza]

MK14, I wonder if cookies set on the browser you accessed Youtube were simply re-used by Odysee.

When I am doing these types of activities I use browser separation - i.e., Google products go their own sandbox (Google Chrome browser). Most of my other activities go on Firefox (including Odysee), with a few irrelevant activities on Chromium ungoogled.

It is not a straightforward thing and some self-control is always required - i.e., never run a Youtube video or use Google search on Firefox, for example.

That's a very good point!

You could well be right.  That is a very good idea!

Indeed it is, but I can't be credited for it. This guy Rob Braxman gave me this tip.

There are also, alternative search engines, such as duckduckgo, which at least claim to be relatively private.

Indeed they have a bit less tracking mechanisms, but they are unfortunately not 100% private. My main search is duckduckgo, followed by startpage and then google search. Here's another video from the same guy that talks about the levels of privacy of several popular search engines.

Ironically (when I have the time available), the video selections, can offer some very interesting videos, which I didn't know existed.

Indeed. I use suggestions all the time since I don't subscribe to every channel. 

[MK14]

MK14, I wonder if cookies set on the browser you accessed Youtube were simply re-used by Odysee.

When I am doing these types of activities I use browser separation - i.e., Google products go their own sandbox (Google Chrome browser). Most of my other activities go on Firefox (including Odysee), with a few irrelevant activities on Chromium ungoogled.

It is not a straightforward thing and some self-control is always required - i.e., never run a Youtube video or use Google search on Firefox, for example.

That's a very good point!

You could well be right.  That is a very good idea!

Indeed it is, but I can't be credited for it. This guy Rob Braxman gave me this tip.

There are also, alternative search engines, such as duckduckgo, which at least claim to be relatively private.

Indeed they have a bit less tracking mechanisms, but they are unfortunately not 100% private. My main search is duckduckgo, followed by startpage and then google search. Here's another video from the same guy that talks about the levels of privacy of several popular search engines.

Ironically (when I have the time available), the video selections, can offer some very interesting videos, which I didn't know existed.

Indeed. I use suggestions all the time since I don't subscribe to every channel.

Thanks!
I've enjoyed watching both videos, and learned a lot from them.  They seem to have useful information, to improve my privacy on the internet, in the future.  It is interesting food for thought.

It is especially interesting to know (from the videos), why even those 'better/safer' search options, still involve ad-information transfers etc (trackers).

It seems (as the video(s) discussed).  Easy of use/life choices and absolute privacy, are a fine balancing act, so practical/sensible life choices/balances, may need to be reached.