Siglent Technical Support join in EEVblog

[nctnico]

So far no SDS2000 firmware...

[Siglent America]

So far no SDS2000 firmware...

Please see this page:
http://www.siglentamerica.com/prodcut-gjjrj.aspx?id=25&tid=1&T=2

My understanding is that this is the latest version.
If you still have any problems please contact Scott at
Scott.Rocco@Siglent.com

Steve

[nctnico]

The version on the website is the same version which is on my SDS2204 right now and has been there since I bought it a couple of months ago. There where rumors that a new firmware version would be released by the end of last month but given the number of problems and missing features I suspect it turned out to be a lot more work than anticipated. It's a pity because the unfinished state the current firmware is in is doing Siglent not much good. When the firmware is finished I think Siglent could sell much more (especially after Dave does a proper review).

[tautech]

So far no SDS2000 firmware...

I too have been quietly bugging Siglent for the anticipated new SDS2000 Firmware.

The version on the website is the same version which is on my SDS2204 right now and has been there since I bought it a couple of months ago. There where rumors that a new firmware version would be released by the end of last month but given the number of problems and missing features I suspect it turned out to be a lot more work than anticipated. It's a pity because the unfinished state the current firmware is in is doing Siglent not much good. When the firmware is finished I think Siglent could sell much more (especially after Dave does a proper review).

Yes, we were expecting it last month....I was told before November, but with Siglent making a presence at the Munich show I expect they had other pressing matters to attend to.
New products I believe.

Latest reply today is....soon.

[Siglent America]

My apologies. Just got the word last night that the new FW revision is due out next week - the week of November 23. My earlier information was incorrect.
The new firmware will address the bugs but I don't have a list of those at this point. Other improvements are coming as well.

Thanks to all!
Steve

[commongrounder]

Concerning the SDG1000 series firmware .36 sweep problem.  I did a bit more analysis and have found that, rather than a linear or log ramp sweep, the user set frequency range is being modulated by a sine wave with a period equal to the sweep time.  We really need to have the lin/log ramps back, at least.  It would be great to have up-down sweeps as an option, but using an alternate lin/log ramp rather than sinusoidal frequency modulation. 
I am sending this to Siglent as well, with the hope that they can implement a quick fix.  I would rather have the partially functional sweep setup used in the previous version .31 firmware, than this, which is pretty much un-useable.

[Rene]

When in doubt I make sure I download it from the manufacturer's website.

Even if you download directly from the manufacture's site there is still no way to verify the integrity of the file unless it has been digitally signed. Digitally signing files is the norm and not the exception nowadays. It is cheap, easy and the right thing to do.

Anyway, Siglent knows about thsi issue now so if they want to do something about it then great, else, it is what it is.

[Siglent]

Concerning the SDG1000 series firmware .36 sweep problem.  I did a bit more analysis and have found that, rather than a linear or log ramp sweep, the user set frequency range is being modulated by a sine wave with a period equal to the sweep time.  We really need to have the lin/log ramps back, at least.  It would be great to have up-down sweeps as an option, but using an alternate lin/log ramp rather than sinusoidal frequency modulation. 
I am sending this to Siglent as well, with the hope that they can implement a quick fix.  I would rather have the partially functional sweep setup used in the previous version .31 firmware, than this, which is pretty much un-useable.

I can not duplicate your problem, so please describe it clearly.  it is better to post a screen shot to me jade.wan@siglent.com or support@siglent.com

Jade Wan
Technical Support Engineer

[nctnico]

The problem is not hard to duplicate. In version 36 the sweep function simply does not work properly in any way. For starters the sweep goes up AND down instead of up OR down. The up and down setting has no effect.

[rf-loop]

Problem is really not hard to duplicate.
Whole all sweep functions are now totally wrong in this version 36.
No LOG, no LIN, no selectable up or down sweep. All is now destroyed what was ok in previous version.

It is good to know that if you have accidentally updated to version 36 you can downgrade back to version 31.

How it need work (just ONE example for ONE thing):
Start freg f1  (example 100kHz)
Stop freq f2  (example 200kHz)
Sweep up
Sweep linear
Sweep time t sweep (example 10s)
After these settings output is steady (f1) (example 100kHz)
Then start sweep  example start manually pushing "trig"
linearly (linear freq change related to time) it start rising frequency until f2 and without output freq sweep immediately return to f1 and stop in this case and waiting new trig.
-----
FW version P36

Start freg f1  (example 100kHz)
Stop freq f2  (example 200kHz)
Sweep up
Sweep linear
Sweep time t sweep (example 10s)
After these settings output is steady half way between f1 and f2 (in this case 150kHz)  WRONG!
Then start sweep  example start manually pushing "trig"
it start rising frequency using undefined mathematical function until f2 and then it turns back (reducing frequency) until it reach f1 and then it turn and start rising frequency until  half way between f1 and f2 (in this case 150kHz)  TOTALLY WRONG.  I do not this time know if this sweep is linear or what hell function but in every case it is totally wrong.

If I change now for sweep down.  It do not anything. Still this stupid half way - then up - then down and then up until back in half way between f1 and f2.

LOG sweep. (and up and down) also same.




LOG up need work as in version 31 (exept that LOG  calculation need repair)
LOG down need work as in version 31 (exept that LOG  calcualtion need repair)
LIN up need work as version 31
LIN down need work as version 31


IF Siglent want add other kind of sweep  function...   set center freq and then how much want linearly or log scan out from center freq single shot or continuously wobbling around center......yes this function is welcome for example pass band IF filter adjustments in radio equipments etc   but I think it is better first repair function what have never worked right after launch.

And this is LOGaritmic sweep up or down starting from user defined start frequency to user defined end frequency. .

In version 31 (and just this original ranting about it) was that your math inside FW for log sweep is wrong.  In version 31 it works but only inside one decade difference between start and stop freq.
In version 31 it works example if I select start 10Hz and stop 100Hz (this is one decade - Siglent) but if I want set start example from 10 Hz to 10000Hz or example  from 27Hz to 53768Hz... it do not normal LOG function sweep. I hope Siglent engineers know what is logaritm.

I'm really surprised that before launch and after "repair" this function no one have tested it. Please take even 3 kids from streed and promise ice cream if they test it and tell if it works ok or wrong.

If it is still difficult.

Please go to shop and buy one function gnerator where is log sweep...  and do exercises how it works and then run SDG1000 and look agen if think it is difficult to define and regognize IF there is problem or IF there is not problem.

After this update version 36  whole sweep function is total junk.

Please remove this version 36 from share and set information that peoples who have updated can downgrade back to version 31R1



Btw, what is nice in new FW is that now can lock channels freq. It can set so that CH1  or CH2 is master and other channel follow frequency. Also there can set offset between channels. (but I feel that this offset setting is somehow weird...  I feel better if offset is for slave channel, not for master channel. Master is master and it have its freg. If there is offset then slave have this offset related to master... positive or negative offset. But Siglent think somehow opposite. There is offset, it can be only positive and it is added to master. (display of course show right but still I feel it is weird logic but perhaps other people feel is just ok... I like RPN but also I lake that master is reference and if there is offset it set for slave.)

[Mark_O]

Problem is really not hard to duplicate.
Whole all sweep functions are now totally wrong in this version 36.
No LOG, no LIN, no selectable up or down sweep. All is now destroyed what was ok in previous version.

...

I'm really surprised that before launch and after "repair" this function no one have tested it. Please take even 3 kids from street and promise ice cream if they test it and tell if it works ok or wrong.

      This is a strange failure of the quality assurance process.

[commongrounder]

Thank you rf-loop for explaining this problem in the great detail that appears to be needed.  I plotted the frequency over time of this strange sweep and it seems to be sinusoidal in nature.  My dream for this device is they would allow the user to select the sweep type from the built-in arbitrary waveform library, including imported ones, so custom sweeps could be created.  I wonder if the sweep waveform they use is in the same 14-bit 16k-point format as other set/arbitrary waveform files. 

[Siglent]

Thank you rf-loop for explaining this problem in the great detail that appears to be needed.  I plotted the frequency over time of this strange sweep and it seems to be sinusoidal in nature.  My dream for this device is they would allow the user to select the sweep type from the built-in arbitrary waveform library, including imported ones, so custom sweeps could be created.  I wonder if the sweep waveform they use is in the same 14-bit 16k-point format as other set/arbitrary waveform files. 

Just confirmed that the sweep problem exist in P36(The sweep code is written in the Remarks ). we feel very sorry.
We will fix it as soon as possible and release a new firmware p37.
We suggest the customer not to update the version P36,

[rf-loop]

Good. 
Please gíve strong feedback to working group who make FW fix but leave all untested. Customers are not pre testers.

Then this case, please help peoples with problems. It is only way to build better reputation. And it is extremely important for test eqquipment Company today:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/need-help-with-siglent-sdm3055/

[tautech]

Good. 
Please gíve strong feedback to working group who make FW fix but leave all untested. Customers are not pre testers.

Then this case, please help peoples with problems. It is only way to build better reputation. And it is extremely important for test eqquipment.

+1

[nctnico]

Good. 
Please gíve strong feedback to working group who make FW fix but leave all untested. Customers are not pre testers.

I agree. It seems Siglent does not have a seperate software testing team or department which checks a firmware release against a functional specification. IMHO having a seperate test team is a must-have in order to deliver consistent quality.

[tautech]

I stumbled across a Siglent blog site that I did not know existed and thought it should be shared:

http://siglent.blog.com/

While not large by any means, some of the content is:

SDG5000 series
Oscilloscope dead time
SDS2000 Series
Sequence function.
History function
Series Bus protocols
Triggers
Waveform capture rate
SDG800

Hope some find it useful. 

[nixxon]

Well the original X1 crystal is clearly 25MHz too, so it makes sense to replace it with a 25MHz TXCO. He also has an SDG1025, not an SDG1010. So I really don't understand your suspicion?

Now I just have to install the new TCXO in my SDG1020 and see if it works. It hope it is the right size. It looks so small.

[kwass]

I installed a TCXO on my SDG1025 and I posted a video on youtube.

Thank you for this!

I just made the same mod to my SDG1025 and it worked perfectly.  It's nice to have an accurate generator without having to use an external clock.

[MartyD]

This looks like a simple and effective mod. 
If I wouldn't care about warranty I'd also do that, along with swapping the fan for a quieter one.
The SDG1025 even outperforms my stone-aged Tektronix 2230 in generating audible noise, it's so annoying!

Marty

[tautech]

This looks like a simple and effective mod. 
If I wouldn't care about warranty I'd also do that, along with swapping the fan for a quieter one.
The SDG1025 even outperforms my stone-aged Tektronix 2230 in generating audible noise, it's so annoying!

Marty

Marty, that is unusual.
Siglent products are not known for noisy fans.
You are having a bad run. 
Can you check the blades for dust loading that might be affecting the normally quiet running?

Any others with noisy fans?

[MartyD]

@tautech:
It's definitely not dust, it seems the fan is spinning way too fast when comparing the noise level to the SDM3055 and the SDS1102CML.
It is even more strange since the lower specificated SDG's do not need a fan at all and the air coming out of the unit is only a few degrees above ambient temperature, even after several hours of operation.

I suspect that some engineer wanted to be on the safe side and threw in a higher cfm fan than needed, just to make sure the unit doesn't overheat in the Sahara.
Or maybe I'm just spoiled by the quietness of my other Siglent gear...

But since I'm already saving up for a 5xxx series generator I'm not worrying too much.

Marty

[tautech]

Marty
My personal SDG1010 makes no noise & I sometimes find it still running the next day.
I might get it out to do a job, set it up and for bench space place it where I can't see the screen so only if I look back after I turn the lights out I might see the screen glowing. 
But thats only if it hasn't gone into screen-saver mode. 

EDIT: The SDG1010 has no fan.

I'm not sure if Siglent up-rate the fans in their faster 1000 series AWG's so let's see what Jade has in reply for you here next week.

[nctnico]

Only the SDG1015 (IIRC) and higher have fans. The lower frequency models are fanless.

[Macbeth]

SDG1025 owner here. I have never actually noticed the fan noise, but I guess I am kind of immune to that low frequency stuff. My desktop PC with 2 HDDs is certainly much louder.

I've only just noticed my HP 6632B PSU is a little noisy, though it's not the fan but the transformer resonating through the case. Pressing down on the casing quietens it dramatically. I believe that I can stick on some rubber shock absorbers to the transformer to fix that. I am going to mod it for front binding posts and up the PSU input from 220 to 240VAC anyway.

Yeah, it's subjective I know, but SDG1025 clearly has a fan, but it's well within my tolerance.

I guess dB meters are needed for this kind of thing.