NanoVNA Custom Software

[joeqsmith]

...
Os is windows 10 and got Keysight IO libraries installed for VISA.

That's fine.  I use their IO libraries to interface with my Agilent VNA.  Obviously nothing to do with controlling the LiteVNA.  What VISA are you using for that?

There are several links in the very first post of this thread.  Some cover the basic install.  Have you read them? 

[Kosmic]

...
Os is windows 10 and got Keysight IO libraries installed for VISA.

That's fine.  I use their IO libraries to interface with my Agilent VNA.  Obviously nothing to do with controlling the LiteVNA.  What VISA are you using for that?

There are several links in the very first post of this thread.  Some cover the basic install.  Have you read them?

Ok look like I failed to read everything and install the software correctly. My bad, will try again.

[Kosmic]

That's fine.  I use their IO libraries to interface with my Agilent VNA.  Obviously nothing to do with controlling the LiteVNA.  What VISA are you using for that?

IO Libraries include VISA drivers and IVI Fondation drivers. Should be compatible with NI stuff thought.

For my problem with solver32, since I installed the Labview runtime manually, I'm probably missing something.

[joeqsmith]

...I'm probably missing something.

Most likely. 

There have been a few people who posted that were able to manually get the environment setup successfully.  There are several examples of people struggling when using this approach in this thread.   My email is filled with them.     

...And other nanovna software are working fine. ...

Rather than wasting time on it, I suggest you will be better served staying with the software you have working.   My software isn't  really a good fit for the amateur radio antenna analyzer group and would require a fair bit of reading and research to use it.   Couple that with I no longer invest any time keeping the manual current.   

If there is some reason you feel running my software is worth your time, I suggest you start reading and follow the instructions.  Getting it running separates the boys from the men. 

[joeqsmith]

Actually, there was a member on the LibreVNA groups.io that stated they were going to document the installation procedure and post it on the popular sites.   He was asking a lot of questions about my software which was upsetting others so we dropped the conversation and I left the group.  You can find it under the subject about converting from time back to frequency.   Maybe  contact them and work together to create something others could use.  He may already have it done.   Wouldn't hurt to ask. 

Here:
https://groups.io/g/LibreVNA-support/topic/eye_diagram_for_tdr/94118303?p=,,,20,0,0,0::recentpostdate/sticky,,,20,2,20,94118303,previd%3D1670800027915905569,nextid%3D1666762167099640731&previd=1670800027915905569&nextid=1666762167099640731

Search for a Kurt Poulsen.  Good luck.

[Kosmic]

Ok so my problem is related to Labview requiring the NI VISA driver to be installed in primary and not secondary driver. If I remove the Keysight one everything is working fine.

[joeqsmith]

...
IO Libraries include VISA drivers and IVI Fondation drivers. Should be compatible with NI stuff thought.
...

So not as compatible as originally thought.      Now that it runs, let's see what you can plan to do with it.

[Kosmic]

...
IO Libraries include VISA drivers and IVI Fondation drivers. Should be compatible with NI stuff thought.
...

So not as compatible as originally thought.      Now that it runs, let's see what you can plan to do with it.

Or Labview runtime is looking for some non standard functions in Visa32.dll ?

Anyway, look like everything is working well with Keysight as a secondary driver. Even for my other GPIB stuff.

[joeqsmith]

...
Or Labview runtime is looking for some non standard functions in Visa32.dll ?

Anyway, look like everything is working well with Keysight as a secondary driver. Even for my other GPIB stuff.

It's their software.  Why would you think they need to conform to any standard beyond their own?

Again, now that it runs, let's see what you can do with it.  Please, please please,  not another ham antenna tuning...   

[Kosmic]

It's their software.  Why would you think they need to conform to any standard beyond their own?

From Wikipedia:

Instrument drivers are specified by the IVI Foundation[1] and define an I/O abstraction layer using the virtual instrument software architecture (VISA). The VISA hardware abstraction layer provides an interface-independent communication channel to T&M instruments.

The goal of VISA is to provide a common abstraction and be provider agnostic. It's a shame it's not working 

Again, now that it runs, let's see what you can do with it.  Please, please please,  not another ham antenna tuning... 

I have nothing planned short term but will definitely try it out next time I need the LiteVNA. And BTW I'm not so much interested in antenna tuning and such.

[joeqsmith]

The goal of VISA is to provide a common abstraction and be provider agnostic. It's a shame it's not working 

Of course having a goal is not the same as a requirement.  There is a reason I provided an installer to get the known working tools installed.   You are certainly free to waste time as you see fit trying to mix and match vendor's code. Or even NIs own code for that matter.  Just don't expect me to jump in and offer a lot of help.   

I have nothing planned short term but will definitely try it out next time I need the LiteVNA. And BTW I'm not so much interested in antenna tuning and such.

Looking forward to it.  Beware, that software is not polished production code.  At best its an engineering tool for my own use.  Hams just whined non-stop and after a year I released it.   There are going to be unfinished features, missing features, bugs in features.....  In most cases, I won't care about them.  You may but don't expect me to address them.   

[joeqsmith]

Be aware too that LabView 2011 is more than a decade old and problems with the tools may have been addressed long ago!!  I'm surprised it runs at all on a modern OS and NI certainly doesn't support it on Windows 10. 

I did post how I ran into some problems with the newer CPUs.   At this time I have no plans to do anymore with NI.   Once their software no longer runs, it's done.   

[Kosmic]

The goal of VISA is to provide a common abstraction and be provider agnostic. It's a shame it's not working 

Of course having a goal is not the same as a requirement.  There is a reason I provided an installer to get the known working tools installed.   You are certainly free to waste time as you see fit trying to mix and match vendor's code. Or even NIs own code for that matter.  Just don't expect me to jump in and offer a lot of help.   

I mean, the shame is on NI and/or Keysight for not being able to implement the standard correctly. Nothing you and I can do about it.

You are already helping a lot and I thank you for that.

[joeqsmith]

Looking forward to seeing what you can do with it.

[joeqsmith]

Changes beyond what has been released include:

3.14
Add grid / mesh select for post processing 3D
Change labels on 3D graph
Turn on light source 1
When using lower sideband, reverse Touchstone order
Correct average function
3.15
Allow loading 2D antenna plots and saving to memory
Allow indexing through the elevation in 2D plots

[joeqsmith]

Planning to do some comparisons of printed antennas and needed a way to plot the date.  I could save the data and load it back into a 3D graph but not overlay 2D graphs.

For example, this is a homemade waveguide horn being rotated 360 degrees.  Yellow is looking at the top of the horn, red at the bottom.  Blue is how we would normally use the antenna.  You can slice the data set at any elevation and save it, or overlay more than one antenna.   I'll demo some of the changes in the next video.

[joeqsmith]

Dislord,

I attempted to load your recent post with V1.3.12.bin just to see what the performance is above the current 9.3GHz limit.   If I turn it on with no connection to the PC, it starts to sweep as normal.  Attempting to connect with the PC, it will not form a link.  Did something else change in the protocol?

[joeqsmith]

With much thanks to Dislord, I now have a working version of firmware.   I don't think any of us are expecting anything from the LiteVNA at these higher frequencies and I think we all agree that limiting it was a good choice.  However, I was a bit surprised and it performs better than I was expecting.

8G_12G_Leakage_SO_10dB: 
Showing a thru (yellow) and open (violet) after calibration. I want to be clear, this is still the ideal model using the same standards provided with the V2Plus4 with the sorted load.  Also, this is my unmodified LiteVNA right from the factory but with my cables.   My software accounts for the leakage term and it is being used for these tests.   A 10dB attenuator was then measured.   We can see is starts to go off the tracks a bit over 9GHz but settles back down around 10.5GHz. 

8G_12G_Leakage_SO_20dB: 
Same as above but with a 20dB attenuator.

I have been experimenting with some waveguides using the LiteVNA.  Most of this testing has been above 7GHz.   To work around the limitations of the LiteVNA, I use it below 4GHz and then up convert to 8GHz then back down.  This setup allows me to take advantage of the Lite's higher performance range.    test14_MWM_0_50dB_11GHz shows the Lite with the Extender sweeping from 11.0 to 11.9GHz and inserting a series of attenuators from 0 down to 50dB. 

8G_12G_Leakage_10GHzBP_WR90:
Showing the Lite directly measuring a 10GHz waveguide BP filter I put together.  The last plot was measuring this same filter with the LiteVNA plus the frequency extender.   I don't have the equipment needed to test this filter.  The PNA is limited to 9GHz or I would use it for a comparison.   

I'm impressed, we can actually see something!   Pretty cool for something that cost $120 and fits in my shirt pocket.   

[MathWizard]

Do these normally come with the connectors and accessories? Or do u buy them separate ? I'm guess they aren't cheap either.

[joeqsmith]

Do these normally come with the connectors and accessories? Or do u buy them separate ? I'm guess they aren't cheap either.

The low cost VNAs I have all came with some sort of short, open, load, thru and two coaxial cables.  Some came with a touch pointer and some came with a USB cable.  The original NanoVNA I have came without a housing.  The other have been enclosed with metal or plastic. 

Any other accessories or connectors, you would need to purchase.  Also, if you felt you required better standards and cables you would need to buy them as well.   There are many photos of what is included.  Do your homework.  Here is some for the LiteVNA: 

https://store2.rlham.com/shop/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=142&products_id=75669&osCsid=4dbrs4qrfmmbte7pdr5v7ecrc7

[fenyvesi]

NanoVNA_V2Plus seems not to receive data after calibration or loaded cal file.
Hardware:  S-A-A-2 NanoVNA V2, https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004678403859.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.41.c45ftbBFtbBFlt&algo_pvid=dfd37afd-4cfe-4397-a090-15a75920e76f&algo_exp_id=dfd37afd-4cfe-4397-a090-15a75920e76f-20&pdp_ext_f=%7B%22sku_id%22%3A%2212000030071383955%22%7D&pdp_npi=3%40dis%21HUF%2148889.82%2122000.6%21%21%21%21%21%402102110316770478898204310d06f9%2112000030071383955%21sea%21HU%21109621073&curPageLogUid=2MetHD8BlRsg
SW v0.1.0
Without calibration it works well. I attach the data and the SWR screens.
Loaded the cal file. The data and empty SWR screens are attached.
SW v2.0.8
No input data at all with or without calibration. Screen attached.

One more sugession. I am in Hungary where the decimal point/comma problem exists. So I added the proposed line in the .ini file but didn't modified the local to comma. The screenshots were captured in this status. I tried to modify the local to comma just now (having the extra line in the .ini file), but the result is the same.

Thank you.

[joeqsmith]

George,

There are a few things to consider.  First, you're using a VNA that I have never tested.   It may not be compatible with my software.   Your last photo,  swr_without_cal_v010.png, at least tells us that it uses something like the newer protocol.   This is a good thing. 

NanoVNA_V2Plus seems not to receive data after calibration or loaded cal file

In photo data_with_cal_v010.png , you can see you have not selected sweep, but when you did, you get a bunch of NaN.  NaN means not a number, which is normally caused by a divide by zero.   Normally what happens is the user reads a post from some expert about changing the coefficients to improve their measurement accuracy.  While I can't dispute that but the user will make these changes blindly with no understanding.   They enter the expert values and instant NaN.    You never show a screen shot of the calibration terms.  Again, the more data you provide, the better.   While I am not in the habit of dumbing down my software,  the latest version attempts to  help this group out by avoiding divide by zero conditions.     

SW v2.0.8
No input data at all with or without calibration. Screen attached.

   
I'm not surprised by this.  If you look at photo loading_cal_v010.png, you only have one defaults file.  The defaults file is unique for each major version of software.  If you want to run multiple versions of my software like you are attempting to do, you would need to create a default file for each of them. 

I am in Hungary where the decimal point/comma problem exists. So I added the proposed line in the .ini file but didn't modified the local to comma.

For some reason, you are trying to run software that is very old.   I had posted how I had added country detection and the decimal/comma problem you mention is not now automatically handled.   Of course, as I already stated, the new software would require new defaults and also new calibration files.  If you do decide to try it, don't forget to download the sound.dll.   You would be amazed of how many people think they can just grab any version of this file and have it work. 

Last, if you are a ham and your goal is to measure VSWR of your antennas, I highly recommend using one of the open sourced programs.   My software was not written for the ham and/or CBers antenna analyzer group.   The software is not limited to try and save the user from doing stupid things.   I had a person write me who was trying to sweep from m Hz.   They had no clue that m and M have two different meanings and the software is going to do exactly what you ask...   I had one person write how they were using my software to try and set the VNA's frequency range outside of what the VNA would allow, thinking this helped them evaluate the VNA's performance.  Just dumb, but again, the software will certainly not prevent the user from doing such things.    My software is not supported.  I no longer make updates for VNAs that use the older protocol.   The only low cost VNA I am currently testing with is the LiteVNA64.   

I'll leave your case on git open but I very much doubt that you have ran into an actual bug that hasn't already been addressed.   

***
fix SNAFU

[fenyvesi]

Thank you for your detailed answer and proposal.

1. I used this ancient v.0.1.0 sw. version because on github this release was offered. I used it as it was. I didn't modify anything, no coefficients or other settings (except dot/comma in default.set). I suggest that the data format and protocol should work, as without cal the sw. works.

2. The default.set file is the v.0.1.0 version, as all my problems aroused originally there. Having the problem, I tried to find a new version and found the new v0.2.8 exe in your zip file and believed that it is enough to replace it.  I didn't realize that for other versions I should replace the default.set, too. I will search for all the components (default.set and sound.dll as you mentioned). If I got a complete package, I would install it from scratch. Perhaps a remark on the github page can orient other people, also.

3. I am only a curious software engineer extending my home automation system and trying to solve the 433 MHz communication problems of sensors with terrible antennas. Your YouTube videos with full of details and knowledge impressed me so, that I thought that using this necessity I would learn a bit about the interesting RF world that is a terra incognita for me. Your sw. has much more potential compared to vna_qt I had tried.

4. Sorry, if I caused some annoyance, I understand that it is a challenge to solve the (repetitive) problems of noobs, like me.

Cheers.
George

P.S.
1. Trying your proposal, v2.0.8 is used, sound.dll is not searched and found.

2. I generated new default.set, the ini file contains: useLocaleDecimalPt=False.

3. The sw. works, reads the NanoVNA.

4. Generating new calibration.

5. The sw. reads something but the data read is incorrect. For example in CH0_Z both the real and imaginery part is wrong.

6. The process is repeated but before it I modified the local to dot and cleared the line from the ini file. New default.set generated.

7. The result is the same. Screenshots are attached.

[joeqsmith]

1. I used this ancient v.0.1.0 sw. version because on github this release was offered. I used it as it was. I didn't modify anything, no coefficients or other settings (except dot/comma in default.set). I suggest that the data format and protocol should work, as without cal the sw. works.

When I posted "You never show a screen shot of the calibration terms. "  I thought you would take the hint.   Without providing details of what you're seeing,  I have no way of helping you.   Something is certainly causing a divide by zero.   I can tell you it's nothing I have ever ran into. 

Without my having the same hardware with the same firmware installed, I have no idea if your VNA would actually work or not.  I tell people what hardware and firmware I test with.  If you choose to deviate from that, you're setting yourself up for failure.     

2. The default.set file is the v.0.1.0 version, as all my problems aroused originally there. Having the problem, I tried to find a new version and found the new v0.2.8 exe in your zip file and believed that it is enough to replace it.  I didn't realize that for other versions I should replace the default.set, too. I will search for all the components (default.set and sound.dll as you mentioned). If I got a complete package, I would install it from scratch. Perhaps a remark on the github page can orient other people, also.

You had posted about reading the manual so you already know, it's up to you to create the defaults file based on your setup.  This isn't something I would supply you and if I did, it's most likely not going to be correct.   

The current released software is 3.13.  If you followed the link in my signature, you would see where the new releases are for the LiteVNA and V2Plus4.   If your VNA is compatible with that protocol, this is the software you should be using.   It will require new defaults and calibrations and of course, that troublesome Sound file.    Moving forward with these low cost VNAs, this is the only version of the software I plan to support as it's the only one a still actively use.   

3. I am only a curious software engineer extending my home automation system and trying to solve the 433 MHz communication problems of sensors with terrible antennas. Your YouTube videos with full of details and knowledge impressed me so, that I thought that using this necessity I would learn a bit about the interesting RF world that is a terra incognita for me. Your sw. has much more potential compared to vna_qt I had tried.

I suspect it will be a steep learning curve for you which is why I suggest using one of the more generic open sourced programs.    You could waste a lot of time and not reach what ever your goals are.   Because I received so many basic questions covered in the manual, I stopped wasting time updating it.   For people like yourself who are actually trying to make us of the documentation, this doesn't help matters.   You would need to watch the videos where I cover the changes or like many, trial and error your way along.  Things seldom work out for the random button pushers.     

4. Sorry, if I caused some annoyance, I understand that it is a challenge to solve the (repetitive) problems of noobs, like me.

As long as you understand that there isn't an Act in the USA called "No VNA User Left Behind".   If you read this long thread you will find people who feel that just because there are several other who post about their woes, I should lower my expectations and change what I provide to help them.  I've been clear my software isn't a good choice for the beginner.   Think of it as being a few decades of experiments (not antenna tuning) that I have conducted at home and compiled into one program.   Just because a user can afford a sub $200 VNA isn't going to make them any more knowledgeable on how to use it and my goal isn't to educate those unwilling to do their own research.   

Of course, the flip side to that is I have made some pretty major changes to the software for the few people that have taken the time to learn how to use it and putting it to use.   

***
poor grammar

[fenyvesi]

The messages crossed each other.

From your answer I realized that you may talk about the Solver while I used NanoVNA 2Plus.

Thank you for your software development work even more for the fantastic videos.

This is my last message. I appreciate the huge work to maintain not only the software but the user base, also. On the other hand, it seems to me that your relation to not-expert persons is not really helpful. When a simple problem would be solvable with a simple answer with a definite direction (which software?) you try always push down with remarks of definition not read or the 89-pages blog post is not followed. In this regard I am not the exception, but the rule.

Regards.
George