EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)

[AmmoJammo]

 He posted pics.

[Delta]

Sounds like a nice chap.....

[Halcyon]

I contacted Wayne and here is his reply he said I can post:

G'day Dave,
 Why the fuck would I engage with a complete tosser like you?
I've seen all the shit on your blog.
Never seen a bigger collection of wankers in one place in my life.
 
I do have the batterisers - whether they work or not, I'm yet to find out?
The only tests I've done to date are simple voltage readings and yes they do increase by about 25% - 30% (ie. 1.15 volts to 1.49 volts etc.)
I have some products that use AA batteries and will be testing them soon when I have some time.
 
I am not a personal friend of any of the Batteroo people.
I have been following this since conception and have been in regular contact with them about being a reseller in Aus.
Obviously there is a huge potential to make money if they do work.
In October I went to the Desert Trip concert in Palm Springs US and took the time to drive up to Sunnyvale and meet with some of the Batteroo people.
 
No, I will not sell any to you - you couldn't pay me enough.
Given all the bullshit flying around about this I'm going to make the time to put some photos on my facebook page shortly.
 
Why not copy and paste this entire email on your blog ?

What a lovely bloke! I hope Wayne Plume of Revive Batteries, Darwin NT treats his customers better than he responds to reasonable e-mails from a reasonable person. He certainly appears to have a high opinion of himself.

Poor form mate. 

[EEVblog]

He posted pics.

He did:
https://www.facebook.com/revivebatteries/










So 100% confirmed, they are real and have arrived.

[Jay_Diddy_B]

Note:

From the return shipping address these were shipped from Batteroo direct, by USPS.

Regards,

Jay_Diddy_B

[AmmoJammo]

Note:

From the return shipping address these were shipped from Batteroo direct, by USPS.

Regards,

Jay_Diddy_B

That means shipping hasn't started at all...  unless they plan to spend 20 bucks sending a $10 item to each backer.

[johndoe123]

I contacted Wayne (Revive Batteries)and here is his reply he said I can post:

G'day Dave,
 Why the fuck would I engage with a complete tosser like you?
I've seen all the shit on your blog.
Never seen a bigger collection of wankers in one place in my life.
 
I do have the batterisers - whether they work or not, I'm yet to find out?
The only tests I've done to date are simple voltage readings and yes they do increase by about 25% - 30% (ie. 1.15 volts to 1.49 volts etc.)
I have some products that use AA batteries and will be testing them soon when I have some time.
 
I am not a personal friend of any of the Batteroo people.
I have been following this since conception and have been in regular contact with them about being a reseller in Aus.
Obviously there is a huge potential to make money if they do work.
In October I went to the Desert Trip concert in Palm Springs US and took the time to drive up to Sunnyvale and meet with some of the Batteroo people.
 
No, I will not sell any to you - you couldn't pay me enough.
Given all the bullshit flying around about this I'm going to make the time to put some photos on my facebook page shortly.
 
Why not copy and paste this entire email on your blog ?

some is angry seeing his business going down the drain

[JimRemington]

Reviver:

Please be sure to post how well your customers are satisfied with their Batterisers, in a year or so. 
On the other hand, by then it probably won't matter.

Cheers, Jim

[Jay_Diddy_B]

Note:

From the return shipping address these were shipped from Batteroo direct, by USPS.

Regards,

Jay_Diddy_B

That means shipping hasn't started at all...  unless they plan to spend 20 bucks sending a $10 item to each backer.

And no respectable shipping company would hand write the customs declaration.

The few Batterisers that have been shipped are obviously targeting potential resellers.


Regards,

Jay_Diddy_B

[Delta]

...and haven't come off a production line by the thousand in China...

[AmmoJammo]

I reckon it's one of the review kits they mentioned months ago. No other reason to get the shipping box printed
I suspect they haven't actually gone into full production yet.

[LabSpokane]

I will PayPal $50 USD today ( today is defined as 12 hours from this post) to one of these recipients in Greece or Australia or anywhere who can photograph their received Batterisers on top of today's dated newspaper with the PCB and components clearly visible from the top and bottom here on this forum.  It ain't the LOTTO, but it's a decent wage for a few minutes of trouble. 

If you don't want to establish an account here, just PM me and I will give you my email address. 

This is a genuine offer.  Surely this must be simple to do.

^This was the offer.  Top *and* bottom of the PCB.  If this product is in the wild, I have no idea why the underside of the PCB is such a secret. 

And you can feel free to email me, *politely*.  My email is my username here at gmail-dot-com.  I have offered to offer compensation for your trouble to properly document the receipt of a production product.  We are all *still* waiting after well over a year to actually see one of these.

The stories on this are still completely contradictory.  Bob Roohparvar tells tales of a fulfillment company.  Yet the "fulfillment company" for the supposed product you received from from Batteroo proper. 

Please show me something that makes sense under the conditions I listed and I will happily transfer the funds. 

Thank you.

[Muttley Snickers]

It's a damned shame that the attitudes and social skills of the Batteroo fan boy group hasn't improved in the slightest over all this time, some simply don't know any better I suppose.

    

[EEVblog]

From the return shipping address these were shipped from Batteroo direct, by USPS.

Yep.
No logistics company is going to hand write a CN22 customs form.
And IIRC, I'm pretty sure Bob said or implied these were shipping from China?

[LabSpokane]

From the return shipping address these were shipped from Batteroo direct, by USPS.

Yep.
No logistics company is going to hand write a CN22 customs form.
And IIRC, I'm pretty sure Bob said or implied these were shipping from China?

Jeezus! I'm a total luddite and I haven't hand-written a customs form in over a decade.  And who uses their fancy shelf/display packaging as the shipping box? 

[EEVblog]

^This was the offer.  Top *and* bottom of the PCB.  If this product is in the wild, I have no idea why the underside of the PCB is such a secret. 

I'm sure there is no conspiracy going on here. I believe Wayne when he says the product "works" and boosts the voltage to 1.5V. There is no question they have made a product that does this.
But of course, anyone can make a tiny boost converter with half a dozen parts, it's the performance of the device to meet the claims in actual products doing true controlled testing we care about.

[LabSpokane]

And can we all agree that the IC and the inductor on the underside of the PCB really is the money shot?  I don't think we've ever seen either.  And I'm sure we haven't seen either because 14 minutes after we do, Jay Diddy B's going to have it modeled in Spice and a PCB spat out of his mill...

[LabSpokane]

^This was the offer.  Top *and* bottom of the PCB.  If this product is in the wild, I have no idea why the underside of the PCB is such a secret. 

I'm sure there is no conspiracy going on here. I believe Wayne when he says the product "works" and boosts the voltage to 1.5V. There is no question they have made a product that does this.
But of course, anyone can make a tiny boost converter with half a dozen parts, it's the performance of the device to meet the claims in actual products doing true controlled testing we care about.

Dave,

If you can PM me the guy's email address, I will PayPal him the money simply out of good faith.

[LabSpokane]

^This was the offer.  Top *and* bottom of the PCB.  If this product is in the wild, I have no idea why the underside of the PCB is such a secret. 

I'm sure there is no conspiracy going on here. I believe Wayne when he says the product "works" and boosts the voltage to 1.5V. There is no question they have made a product that does this.
But of course, anyone can make a tiny boost converter with half a dozen parts, it's the performance of the device to meet the claims in actual products doing true controlled testing we care about.

Dave,

If you can PM me the guy's email address, I will PayPal him the money simply out of good faith.

email on the way to him.

[EEVblog]

And can we all agree that the IC and the inductor on the underside of the PCB really is the money shot?  I don't think we've ever seen either.  And I'm sure we haven't seen either because 14 minutes after we do, Jay Diddy B's going to have it modeled in Spice and a PCB spat out of his mill...

We have seen a bottom side photo I'm sure, at least the blank layout. It's a SOT3-6 or something and in/out cap and the inductor.

[EEVblog]

Jeezus! I'm a total luddite and I haven't hand-written a customs form in over a decade. 

This one was clearly sent over the counter from the local post office.

And who uses their fancy shelf/display packaging as the shipping box?

That makes sense to me. I would for such a product.

[ez24]

I contacted Wayne (Revive Batteries)and here is his reply he said I can post:

G'day Dave,
 Why the fuck would I engage with a complete tosser like you?
I've seen all the shit on your blog.
Never seen a bigger collection of wankers in one place in my life.
 
I do have the batterisers - whether they work or not, I'm yet to find out?
The only tests I've done to date are simple voltage readings and yes they do increase by about 25% - 30% (ie. 1.15 volts to 1.49 volts etc.)
I have some products that use AA batteries and will be testing them soon when I have some time.
 
I am not a personal friend of any of the Batteroo people.
I have been following this since conception and have been in regular contact with them about being a reseller in Aus.
Obviously there is a huge potential to make money if they do work.
In October I went to the Desert Trip concert in Palm Springs US and took the time to drive up to Sunnyvale and meet with some of the Batteroo people.
 
No, I will not sell any to you - you couldn't pay me enough.
Given all the bullshit flying around about this I'm going to make the time to put some photos on my facebook page shortly.
 
Why not copy and paste this entire email on your blog ?

Best laugh I have had in a long time     You need to get him on your show, see if you can interview him on your radio show.  He sounds like a comedian. 

[LabSpokane]

And can we all agree that the IC and the inductor on the underside of the PCB really is the money shot?  I don't think we've ever seen either.  And I'm sure we haven't seen either because 14 minutes after we do, Jay Diddy B's going to have it modeled in Spice and a PCB spat out of his mill...

We have seen a bottom side photo I'm sure, at least the blank layout. It's a SOT3-6 or something and in/out cap and the inductor.

All I've seen is the partially stuffed PCB with obviously unstuffed inductor.

[Jay_Diddy_B]

And can we all agree that the IC and the inductor on the underside of the PCB really is the money shot?  I don't think we've ever seen either.  And I'm sure we haven't seen either because 14 minutes after we do, Jay Diddy B's going to have it modeled in Spice and a PCB spat out of his mill...

I don't even have to start from scratch, I can edit this one:



So we can shave a couple of minutes off the time...

I think we are going to find that the bottom side, the inside, is potted. The reason is that these pictures look like an attempt to get the potting process right.



I also believe the story that they have a custom integrated circuit:



I started a thread discussing the ic, August 2015.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/projects/guess-the-batteriser-ic/msg741281/#msg741281

I suggested that they would need a custom ic and it would be difficult. The reason it is difficult, is the voltage is so low. You have to be able start the circuit from about 0.8V and run with a 1.5 rail. You can power the circuit from the output, after starting. In addition you need be able to run in an energy saving mode to get low quiescent current. For this application the quiescent current should be around 10uA.

There are no commercial ics for this, because most applications would be for more than one cell. There are lots of options for Li-ion or multiple alkaline cells.

I have pretty good idea how the Batteriser will behave from the characteristics of the one that I built and forum member 5ky tested in this video.



The screen is black for the first few minutes, but then there is some video.

Regards,

Jay_Diddy_B

[EEVblog]

Since he called all of us wankers, can I call him a douchebag?

No.

I agree, doesn't accomplish anything.
Let's show him and everyone else the real performance of this thing with actual data.
Although I would encourage Wayne to actually test these things properly. With a conversion efficiency graph for different loads, and controlled product testing.
I have the spreadsheet and instruction available for the latter:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/18K9c2YAT0d0QABGYGpzItbvDcgfAQCRUtloEzzfXADU/edit?usp=sharing

People can send be results and I'll add them to the table