EEVblog #1248 - INSANE A 0.02% Process Meter for $9? WTF

[BradC]

My refund was approved (after 3 rounds of "wait 10 days") on the 2nd of Dec. Money was refunded to my CC same day.

[Kjelt]

Perhaps they are overloaded due to some huge chinese shopping day a month ago comparable to black friday in the us.

[maginnovision]

Perhaps they are overloaded due to some huge chinese shopping day a month ago comparable to black friday in the us.

So they can click the deny button but not approve... For over a month?

[Nusa]

Nah, it just means the initial Aliexpress handling is entirely automated and designed to give both sides incentive to settle and/or cave before they have to spend employee time on it. In the early stages, "evidence" is just for the other side to look at and react to. Which actually works fairly well in the cases where there is a legitimate misunderstanding between vendor and client and the party at fault actually wants to make it right.

[maginnovision]

In my case, and probably others, the dispute process ran for weeks even beyond the initial end time which was about a month after the case was opened. Ali "stepped in" to deny it multiple times. I don't necessarily doubt it's automated but they definitely didn't care. I was pretty certain I wasn't going to get a refund since the process ran so long that even purchase protection had run out for a week or two.

[FrankBuss]

Finally got a refund for my order from "Sturdy Tool&Lighting Store" as well, after multiple 10 days extension by Aliexpress when I opened the dispute. They handled it very professional. The seller provided a tracking number, so they couldn't be sure that I received it. After the dispute and refund was completed, I could leave a negative feedback as well.

They should really improve the tracking number system. If it were possible to look at the address associated with a tracking number, then such tracking number scams wouldn't be possible. But maybe for the cheap shipping services this would cost too much.

And I hope it is not like with eBay with this refund. Some weeks ago I bought a 18650 battery from a German eBay seller. Rated capacity was 8 times higher than measured capacity. The seller didn't want to refund, so I had to open a dispute at eBay and finally eBay refunded all. Then I asked the seller if he wants the battery back. But he answered that he doesn't care, because eBay paid the refund. At least I could leave a negative feedback as well. But he is still selling this crap battery and eBay doesn't care either.

I hope someday eBay will improve this, when it gets too expensive for them. But I guess they don't care. If a scam works and not too many customers complain, because in the case of the battery they can't measure the capacity, then it is a win-win situation for eBay and the seller.

[rsjsouza]

But he is still selling this crap battery and eBay doesn't care either.

I think eBay has a section that allows users to review the product itself. Perhaps do a 1 star review of it?

I hope someday eBay will improve this, when it gets too expensive for them. But I guess they don't care. If a scam works and not too many customers complain, because in the case of the battery they can't measure the capacity, then it is a win-win situation for eBay and the seller.

At the end of the day, the comission over the sales is what matters. Amazon did the same when they opened their portal for anyone that wants to make a buck - so many threads talking about fake and bad products sold, but at least they display these reviews proeminently on the product page.

[FrankBuss]

I think eBay has a section that allows users to review the product itself. Perhaps do a 1 star review of it?

This is only available for some items. I can select this from my purchase history list. But looks like the items which ended in a dispute, are not listed anymore in my purchase history.

[wilfred]

Finally got a refund for my order from "Sturdy Tool&Lighting Store" as well, after multiple 10 days extension by Aliexpress when I opened the dispute. They handled it very professional. The seller provided a tracking number, so they couldn't be sure that I received it. After the dispute and refund was completed, I could leave a negative feedback as well.

They should really improve the tracking number system. If it were possible to look at the address associated with a tracking number, then such tracking number scams wouldn't be possible. But maybe for the cheap shipping services this would cost too much.

And I hope it is not like with eBay with this refund. Some weeks ago I bought a 18650 battery from a German eBay seller. Rated capacity was 8 times higher than measured capacity. The seller didn't want to refund, so I had to open a dispute at eBay and finally eBay refunded all. Then I asked the seller if he wants the battery back. But he answered that he doesn't care, because eBay paid the refund. At least I could leave a negative feedback as well. But he is still selling this crap battery and eBay doesn't care either.

I hope someday eBay will improve this, when it gets too expensive for them. But I guess they don't care. If a scam works and not too many customers complain, because in the case of the battery they can't measure the capacity, then it is a win-win situation for eBay and the seller.

How is it a win for Ebay? If I understood what you said they paid the refund and they suffer the reputational loss from unhappy customers like yourself who post about it. They would care about both the reputation loss and the cost of the refund.  I wouldn't expect them to check items because that would be too expensive.

[Brumby]

How is it a win for Ebay?

Let's think about this for a second... (that's all it takes).

If I understood what you said they paid the refund and they suffer the reputational loss from unhappy customers like yourself who post about it.

That is a "Yes", followed by a "No".

Yes, they paid the refund - but by doing so, it wasn't eBay itself that suffered the reputational loss - it was the Seller.  If anything, eBay gained in the reputation stakes by giving the refund.  The only negative global effect on eBay is the reinforcement of the potential to find shady Sellers.

They would care about both the reputation loss and the cost of the refund.  I wouldn't expect them to check items because that would be too expensive.

These points are correct, but the cost of the refund would simply be part of the cost of doing business.  Besides, they would have some measures in place to recover those costs wherever possible.

[wilfred]

How is it a win for Ebay?

Let's think about this for a second... (that's all it takes).

If I understood what you said they paid the refund and they suffer the reputational loss from unhappy customers like yourself who post about it.

That is a "Yes", followed by a "No".

Yes, they paid the refund - but by doing so, it wasn't eBay itself that suffered the reputational loss - it was the Seller.  If anything, eBay gained in the reputation stakes by giving the refund.  The only negative global effect on eBay is the reinforcement of the potential to find shady Sellers.

They would care about both the reputation loss and the cost of the refund.  I wouldn't expect them to check items because that would be too expensive.

These points are correct, but the cost of the refund would simply be part of the cost of doing business.  Besides, they would have some measures in place to recover those costs wherever possible.

IfI understood Frankbuss correctly he seems to suggest Ebay get a win along with the seller in perpetuating the scams (as FB characterises it).

I think that isn't correct. and it also goes to suggest Ebay can benefit from shady transactions. I think Ebay want to ensure buyers have as little resistance to choosing to buy on Ebay and that it is in Ebay's interest to see buyers get the refund and buy again hopefully from a more reliable seller.

Ebay et al often seem to get tarnished generically when a purchase goes bad. I often hear it said something bad was bought on Ebay, not from seller xyx2000. Sellers are mostly anonymous to buyers.

[FrankBuss]

IfI understood Frankbuss correctly he seems to suggest Ebay get a win along with the seller in perpetuating the scams (as FB characterises it).

Right, this is what I meant, eBay gets the fees for each sold item. Of course, they don't support these scammers intentionally. But the way they handle it, like that you can't leave a review for items which were disputed, and that they don't look into the details (I provided even the discharge curve), encourages such scams.

I think that isn't correct. and it also goes to suggest Ebay can benefit from shady transactions. I think Ebay want to ensure buyers have as little resistance to choosing to buy on Ebay and that it is in Ebay's interest to see buyers get the refund and buy again hopefully from a more reliable seller.

Yes, this is probably what they want. But I wonder if it helps in the long term if they just refund it, without consequences for the seller. But I guess they can't spend much time on it, the platform is too big, and at least the negative feedback percentage is displayed. Fortunately most things I buy at eBay are working as advertised.

[Xenoamor]

For what it's worth FrankBuss I respect that you at least tried to sort it out. Your write up was good as well. Unsurprisingly a lot of people on this forum were saying that the fault is on the side of the consumer for not knowing that such capacities were impossible but we're not all electronic engineers.

The overrating of batteries is pandemic and it must seriously hurt legitimate companies. It's definitely not just isolated to eBay, it's pretty much any battery that comes out of China as well. If it's of any use we use the energizer AA non-rechargable batteries and they're excellent, lots of juice.

[Kjelt]

But the way they handle it, like that you can't leave a review for items which were disputed, and that they don't look into the details (I provided even the discharge curve), encourages such scams.

Look at the helpdesk jobs, the people working there at most finished high school.
None have an EE degree, and they can't have a specialist for each and every item they sell or they would not make any money at all.

[all_repair]

Reason to pickup the meter was to standby as spare in case an equipment need more sources than what I have.  Price was right, and wasn't a bet that I could repair these QC rejects.
Now I can get some of this with the refund:

US $15.98  21%OFF | Analog 0-5V 0-10V 4-20mA Signal Generator with Rechargeable Battery Pocket Adjustable Voltage Current Simulator LB01G Calibrator
https://s.click.aliexpress.com/e/oSd7C0fI

[RobertPS]

Aliexpress decided to refund me on my order with the false EMS tracking number. The process took a long time, but the outcome is right.
........And a few hours later the order from our friends at 'My cozy life' store with fake TNT tracking number is also in the process of being refunded.

[wilfred]

Thanks Aliexpress. I was just told I will receive a full refund. It seems Aliexpress' systems as soons as the delivery time expires and delivery hasn't happened just close out the dispute with a refund.

I wish they could have done it sooner once the vendor (Manbo Life Store) stated they couldn't ship and made several attempts to offer me a refund via Paypal. Which I repeatedly rejected because it just sounded shifty. You can't pay with PP on Aliexpress as far as I can tell so refunds by that method would just be invisible to Aliexpress.

Better late than never. Still have to wait for the money to appear in my credit card account though.

[FrankBuss]

I wish they could have done it sooner once the vendor (Manbo Life Store) stated they couldn't ship and made several attempts to offer me a refund via Paypal. Which I repeatedly rejected because it just sounded shifty. You can't pay with PP on Aliexpress as far as I can tell so refunds by that method would just be invisible to Aliexpress.

Right, never accept offsite payments from the seller. I think they offer this to avoid official refunds, which gives them negative ratings from the system. Hopefully when they get enough negative ratings, Aliexpress will shut down such shops. And don't forget to rate them, too, with appropriate comments, like "scammed shipment tracking ID" etc.

[wilfred]

And don't forget to rate them, too, with appropriate comments, like "scammed shipment tracking ID" etc.

Good point. I was going to just wash my hands of them but downrating them would help others. I will.


edit: Money is now in my credit card account and I left one star review.

[sorenkir]

Mine is also marked as delivered by all sellers But is a deliver that the track does not work or update, as usual, finally yesterday, they assume with excuses, Be ready for the same on your orders, The fact only very few people had the meter really shipped, I'm on an early bird on this, bought few minutes after the post ( not the video ).

sorenkir  appear to be ones of those who will receive the meter

After 2 monthes, still nothing!
I opened a dispute, the seller proposed a PayPal refund and eventually I got a direct refund from AliExpress.

Michel.

[wilfred]

Mine is also marked as delivered by all sellers But is a deliver that the track does not work or update, as usual, finally yesterday, they assume with excuses, Be ready for the same on your orders, The fact only very few people had the meter really shipped, I'm on an early bird on this, bought few minutes after the post ( not the video ).

sorenkir  appear to be ones of those who will receive the meter

After 2 monthes, still nothing!
I opened a dispute, the seller proposed a PayPal refund and eventually I got a direct refund from AliExpress.

Michel.

I just got my refund and I left a 1 star review.

[thinkfat]

Story over for me as well. Refund received through Aliexpress, left an appropriately worded 1-Star review.

[Brumby]

Was just checking over my bank statement regarding my experience... Between when I purchased and when I received my refund, the exchange rate had slipped a bit.  As a result, the exercise cost me 89 cents.

I'll wear that for the experience and entertainment value.

[CChin254]

IC Identification for the AIMOmeter AMPX1 Meter:

[CChin254]

I did a Cost Analysis on this device. The total cost to build the device is ~$30.60.

Since I did not have the exact measurements of the device, the non-electronics costs are estimated.

Cost Distribution:


IC Manufacturer Distribution:


The full Excel/PDF Bill of Materials sheet is attached below.
Excel:  AIMOmeter AMPX1 BOM Estimated Costs.xlsx (20.24 kB - downloaded 40 times.)
PDF:  AIMOmeter AMPX1 BOM Estimated Costs.pdf (91.08 kB - downloaded 99 times.)

Please note that the PDF version does not seem to have the chart of the IC Manufacturer Distribution. That chart is attached above.