Rigol's New DHO800 Oscilloscope unbox & teardown

[Fungus]

I'm calling "fake" on that. You don't need a VESA arm when there's that much space.

Where's all the piles of junk and half-finished circuits? That workbenchlooks like it belongs in the "Stock Electronic Image FAILS" thread.

[mawyatt]

You mean like this cluttered bench!! If the DHO824 was ours, we would get a VESA mount for sure!!


Darn it, now everything's going to fall


Best,

[Martin72]

Where's all the piles of junk and half-finished circuits?

It´s called cleaning up, young man.

[2N3055]

You mean like this cluttered bench!! If the DHO824 was ours, we would get a VESA mount for sure!!


Darn it, now everything's going to fall


Best,

You moved to Australia? 

[tv84]

You moved to Australia? 

Nope, it was Rob that rented him some space. That's why he now needs the VESA to hold all the stuff. Since I'm in the antipodes, I'll be taking shelter... 

[2N3055]

You moved to Australia? 

Nope, it was Rob that rented him some space. That's why he now needs the VESA to hold all the stuff. Since I'm in the antipodes, I'll be taking shelter... 

 

But if you think about it, that is a good way to prevent dust on your equipment.  You cut some wire, whoosh, falls away from the desk...
Self cleaning...Nice!!

[mawyatt]

Well we did want to use a negative supply circuit and see the DHO824 slow rolling screen running left to right to see time reversed so we could view those non-causal Gibbs Ears!! Now we have to stand on our head to read the numbers on the DMMs since they are negative and too hard to read upside down 

Best,

[tautech]

You moved to Australia? 

Nope, it was Rob that rented him some space. That's why he now needs the VESA to hold all the stuff. Since I'm in the antipodes, I'll be taking shelter... 

Are you ? Come visit.

[Mechatrommer]

few pages of very on topic unbox and teardown..

[milamber]

Well, coming from a DS1054z I guess I will save my money and just replace it by the Rigol DHO804 while prices are still high for the old unit.

But I am just curious about the linear USB power supply.
Are effects worth than with the internal one of a DS1054z?

[ebastler]

But I am just curious about the linear USB power supply.
Are effects worth than with the internal one of a DS1054z?

Not sure what you are referring to with the "linear USB power supply"? The DHO800/900 scopes come with a regular USB-C power supply, which is a switching supply capable of negotiating the right voltage. (DHO requests 15V.) Rigol currently ships Lenovo or LiteOn supplies.

There were some discussions whether power-supply noise might be leaking into the scope, but experiments with a linear supply showed no major change: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/rigols-new-dho800-oscilloscope-unbox-teardown/msg5139402/#msg5139402

[csuhi17]

Not 12V 4A?

[milamber]

Here it sounds different: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/rigols-new-dho800-oscilloscope-unbox-teardown/msg5138067/#msg5138067

[Martin72]

Note that I was looking for the cause of the "ripple" on the calibration signal and was able to rule out the power supply.
I don't know where he saw his ripple.

[ebastler]

Not 12V 4A?

Very early units in China were shipped with a fixed 12V supply, and I think that is what the user manual still describes. But all later production units came with the proper USB-C supplies which support Power Delivery negotiation, and the scope negotiates 15V on these according to several user reports. (12V is an uncommon voltage for USB PD -- added later or obsolete now, not sure.)

[csuhi17]

Not 12V 4A?

Very early units in China were shipped with a fixed 12V supply, and I think that is what the user manual still describes. But all later production units came with the proper USB-C supplies which support Power Delivery negotiation, and the scope negotiates 15V on these according to several user reports. (12V is an uncommon voltage for USB PD -- added later or obsolete now, not sure.)

Thanks.
Are there any disadvantages if I want to use a 12V power supply? I have a 12V 120W linear power supply. I needed a linear power supply for the two "Micsig" because the wave was nice and clear with only that. The factory power supply is a disaster for me.

[Veteran68]

(12V is an uncommon voltage for USB PD -- added later or obsolete now, not sure.)

It's an optional PD voltage, not obsolete. I don't think it's all that uncommon, really. I have several PD chargers & power bricks that support 12V.

The mandatory SPR voltages for PD are 5, 9, 15, and 20. All lower voltages below the max SPR voltage supported by a power supply must also be supported to be PD compliant. 12V being optional, though.

[ebastler]

Are there any disadvantages if I want to use a 12V power supply? I have a 12V 120W linear power supply. I needed a linear power supply for the two "Micsig" because the wave was nice and clear with only that. The factory power supply is a disaster for me.

Is the "disaster" occuring with the MicSig scopes or with the DHO800/900? -- Anyaway, I would not expect any problems using a fixed 12V supply. I assume Rigol moved away from them since the cheap power supply itself sucked and/or had compliance issues, not because the scope cannot deal with the 12V supply. Depending on how the scope generates its internal supply voltages, it will draw a bit more current than on 15V, or run a bit warmer.

[12V is] an optional PD voltage, not obsolete. I don't think it's all that uncommon, really. I have several PD chargers & power bricks that support 12V.

The mandatory SPR voltages for PD are 5, 9, 15, and 20. All lower voltages below the max SPR voltage supported by a power supply must also be supported to be PD compliant. 12V being optional, though.

Looks like 12V was specified in PD 1.0, but I can't see it mentioned in the PD 3.0 specification. (Well, in the various extracts I could find online. The full spec must be published somewhere?!) Anyway, I don't mean to argue. Rigol decided to go for 15V, for whatever reason, and the scope obviously run on either 12V or 15V.

[csuhi17]

Are there any disadvantages if I want to use a 12V power supply? I have a 12V 120W linear power supply. I needed a linear power supply for the two "Micsig" because the wave was nice and clear with only that. The factory power supply is a disaster for me.

Is the "disaster" occuring with the MicSig scopes or with the DHO800/900?

The DHO900 has not arrived yet.
Micsig scopes with its own power supply.

[TK]

But I am just curious about the linear USB power supply.
Are effects worth than with the internal one of a DS1054z?

Not sure what you are referring to with the "linear USB power supply"? The DHO800/900 scopes come with a regular USB-C power supply, which is a switching supply capable of negotiating the right voltage. (DHO requests 15V.) Rigol currently ships Lenovo or LiteOn supplies.

There were some discussions whether power-supply noise might be leaking into the scope, but experiments with a linear supply showed no major change: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/rigols-new-dho800-oscilloscope-unbox-teardown/msg5139402/#msg5139402

I also noticed a lot of discussion about the supplied power supply (switching) but nobody commented about the issue that most modern DSO's have internal switching power supplies and I think it is good that the DHO has an external power supply that can be replaced with a linear one if you need cleaner waveforms.  Even the most expensive models have internal switching power supplies.

[Veteran68]

Looks like 12V was specified in PD 1.0, but I can't see it mentioned in the PD 3.0 specification. (Well, in the various extracts I could find online. The full spec must be published somewhere?!) Anyway, I don't mean to argue. Rigol decided to go for 15V, for whatever reason, and the scope obviously run on either 12V or 15V.

Oh, I wasn't trying to argue either. Just offering what I'd read from the specs as clarification.

Reference: USB PD Spec Revision 3.2, Version 1.0, 2023-10 (yes, the ink is still wet)

The fixed compliant voltages (5, 9, 15, 20) are described in section 10.2.2 "Normative Voltages and Currents" on starting on page 1038. This the mandatory part (indicated by the directive "...Shall support...") The SPR AVS (Adjustable Voltage Supply) part of the spec describes the ranges that supplies can optionally support. Section 10.2.3 "Optional Voltages/Currents" on page 1048 indicates two categories:

"Optional Normative Fixed, Variable, and Battery Supply" includes the statement "May Optionally supply additional Voltages and increased currents. However, the Optional Voltages Shall Not exceed 9V."

"Optional Normative SPR Programmable Power Supply" (aka PPS) states "The Max Voltage Shall Not exceed 21V while in SPR mode."

12V isn't called out specifically as it falls within the acceptable PPS range. Technically, a source and sink could negotiate 13.2V or any other odd value within the acceptable range as long as they meet the power constraints.

Section 10.2.2.2 (pages 1045-1047) describe the valid AVS operating ranges for different power configurations.

Example:


Pages 1049-1050 list examples of "what a power adapter that Advertises a particular PDP Rating May offer:"

2) PDP 36W implementation includes:
o 5V @ 3A,
o 9V @ 3A,
o 15 @ 2.4A,
o SPR AVS with 9V – 15V @ 2.4A,
o 9V Prog @ 3 A, and
o 15V Prog @ 2.4A.

There is an example of 12V negotiation specifically mentioned in the B appendices (pg 1069-1070, pg 1074) where various example negotiation scenarios are described, including a Tablet that attempts to negotiate 12V:



And a laptop negotiating with an attached USB hub:

[zrq]

How do you guys in the Europe get your DHO800/900? I ordered from Batronix and they tell me the ETA will be mid-December  .

[ebastler]

How do you guys in the Europe get your DHO800/900? I ordered from Batronix and they tell me the ETA will be mid-December  .

Depends on the specific model, I guess. DHO914 is supposedly in stock at Batronix, and lead times for DHO800 are shorter than other DHO900 models. Other dealers might have different stock? The socially accepted method in Europe is to check dealers' websites for stock/lead time info, or call them or send an email if that info is not provided online. 

Are you really in China as your country flag suggests? Why would you order from Europe then? 

[Fungus]

I got my DHO804 from Batterfly (Italy).

[Fungus]

Depends on the specific model, I guess. DHO914 is supposedly in stock at Batronix, and lead times for DHO800 are shorter than other DHO900 models.

So everybody is going for the DHO900? That's interesting...

Is it the color? The bandwidth? The Siggen?