Flir E4 Thermal imaging camera teardown

[miguelvp]

Just for a laugh i wrote FLIR and asked for instructions on how to upgrade the E4 to an E8.  I'll be sure to let you know exactly what
 their presumably hilarious refusal is.

 

[chriseparent]

I only asked if i can increase the resolution since its almost useless for building assesmemt AND the darn thing has E8 pictures on it already for demo mode.  'hack'  was never mentioned or anything like that.

[miguelvp]

I only asked if i can increase the resolution since its almost useless for building assesmemt AND the darn thing has E8 pictures on it already for demo mode.  'hack'  was never mentioned or anything like that.

I regress then. 

[chriseparent]

Its all good.  But seriously, did they put E8 demo pics on the E4 just to mess with me? ... Lol

[MarkIR]

A bit off topic (delete if offensive) ...

As some of the recent buyers are aware, FLIR has a promotion where you get some "free" stuff.

Anyone have any experience with the FLIR EX Camera Accessory Kit - It's listed as FLIR EX Camera Accessory Kit (ITC Online Training, Car Charger for FLIR EX-Series, VP50 Voltage Detector/Flashlight.

Other option is a BR80 video borescope.  Is there something useful in the camera accessory kit that I'm missing?  A car charger is "eh" - handy for those actually using it when traveling, but...  a hard case would be nicer.

[fnordfnordfnord]

FYI I just purchased an E4 from Tequipment with the 1.22 firmware. The fellow said that all of their stock was fw 1.22. Ordered it Wed. received it Fri. Res & menu hack installed Fri. with no problems. Thought y'all might like to know. Thanks very much.

[edavid]

As some of the recent buyers are aware, FLIR has a promotion where you get some "free" stuff.

Anyone have any experience with the FLIR EX Camera Accessory Kit - It's listed as FLIR EX Camera Accessory Kit (ITC Online Training, Car Charger for FLIR EX-Series, VP50 Voltage Detector/Flashlight.

Other option is a BR80 video borescope.  Is there something useful in the camera accessory kit that I'm missing?  A car charger is "eh" - handy for those actually using it when traveling, but...  a hard case would be nicer.

Didn't your E4 come packed in a hard case?

[MarkIR]

As some of the recent buyers are aware, FLIR has a promotion where you get some "free" stuff.

Anyone have any experience with the FLIR EX Camera Accessory Kit - It's listed as FLIR EX Camera Accessory Kit (ITC Online Training, Car Charger for FLIR EX-Series, VP50 Voltage Detector/Flashlight.

Other option is a BR80 video borescope.  Is there something useful in the camera accessory kit that I'm missing?  A car charger is "eh" - handy for those actually using it when traveling, but...  a hard case would be nicer.

Didn't your E4 come packed in a hard case?

Hasn't shown up yet (Thursday hopefully).  But Bonus!  I didn't know it came with one!  Thanks.

[tsmith35]

Anyone have any experience with the FLIR EX Camera Accessory Kit - It's listed as FLIR EX Camera Accessory Kit (ITC Online Training, Car Charger for FLIR EX-Series, VP50 Voltage Detector/Flashlight.

Other option is a BR80 video borescope.  Is there something useful in the camera accessory kit that I'm missing?  A car charger is "eh" - handy for those actually using it when traveling, but...  a hard case would be nicer.

I got the Ex Accessory Package. I needed the 2nd battery, the charger and the soft case. The car charger is just a Flir-branded charger with a micro-USB plug. The desk charger came with a micro-USB wall wart. The VP50 voltage detector and flashlight is kinda "meh", but looks cool and functions decently, and I haven't used the online ITC training yet. All in all, it's a decent kit. I initially looked at getting just the 2nd battery, the desk charger and the case, but the kit was about the same price.

The extra battery + charger is great for extended use. It looks like the ex batteries are single-cell 18650 li-ion, so it's easy to burn through a charge with heavy use. Having the second battery helps a lot. The desk charger has a small footprint. The case is padded, quite rugged and stylish, and it includes a belt loop and shoulder strap.

[wer4]

Has anyone seen this E4-B? Looks like it has a lower temperature range. http://www.tequipment.net/FLIR/E4-B/Building-and-Industrial-Thermal-Imagers/

[Taucher]

Has anyone seen this E4-B? Looks like it has a lower temperature range. http://www.tequipment.net/FLIR/E4-B/Building-and-Industrial-Thermal-Imagers/

Thanks - $799.00 (~ 590€) sounds quite reasonable - the joy of software options - produce one, sell it as any imagineable model...
I see they "enhanced" the sensitivity by reducing the fake-noise... seems like somebody is clinging to the sales-manual for market-segmentation
I'd be really interested in a real bill of materials & expenses for the production of an Ex-camera.

Regarding the ongoing rumors on HW-changes: wasn't there a FCC website where approved devices/PCBs had to be depicted with PCB mugshots?


PS: As somebody from Europe I still feel ridiculed by Flir as the salesprice after shipping over the Atlantic ocean (US-price) is less than it is "next" to the European factory.
Oh, and of course no attempts to offer any "feebies" for Europe ... pay more, get less ... if only they would sell an E4-B for 800 indial Rupies as well...

[mikeselectricstuff]

Regarding the ongoing rumors on HW-changes: wasn't there a FCC website where approved devices/PCBs had to be depicted with PCB mugshots?

Yes but I think it's only stuff that uses RF

[/quote]

[mikeselectricstuff]

Has anyone seen this E4-B? Looks like it has a lower temperature range. http://www.tequipment.net/FLIR/E4-B/Building-and-Industrial-Thermal-Imagers/

So just as the number of people interested in hacking the new FW has dwindled, a cheaper version may provide some new blood...
Would be interesting to see whether they've actually capped the measurement range, or just not guaranteed the cal accuracy

[edavid]

Anyone have any experience with the FLIR EX Camera Accessory Kit - It's listed as FLIR EX Camera Accessory Kit (ITC Online Training, Car Charger for FLIR EX-Series, VP50 Voltage Detector/Flashlight.

Other option is a BR80 video borescope.  Is there something useful in the camera accessory kit that I'm missing?  A car charger is "eh" - handy for those actually using it when traveling, but...  a hard case would be nicer.

I got the Ex Accessory Package. I needed the 2nd battery, the charger and the soft case. The car charger is just a Flir-branded charger with a micro-USB plug. The desk charger came with a micro-USB wall wart. The VP50 voltage detector and flashlight is kinda "meh", but looks cool and functions decently, and I haven't used the online ITC training yet. All in all, it's a decent kit. I initially looked at getting just the 2nd battery, the desk charger and the case, but the kit was about the same price.

The extra battery + charger is great for extended use. It looks like the ex batteries are single-cell 18650 li-ion, so it's easy to burn through a charge with heavy use. Having the second battery helps a lot. The desk charger has a small footprint. The case is padded, quite rugged and stylish, and it includes a belt loop and shoulder strap.

Just to avoid confusion, the kit you bought is not the same as one that's part of the promotion.  The free kit doesn't include the battery, desk charger, or soft case.

[mikeselectricstuff]

Just noticed tequipment are listing the E4 as "clearance - only 1 left", so I wonder if the E4-B is replacing it.

Maybe it has a Lepton inside now..?

[tsmith35]

Just to avoid confusion, the kit you bought is not the same as one that's part of the promotion.  The free kit doesn't include the battery, desk charger, or soft case.

Oh, that's too bad. The extra battery + charger + case are what make the whole thing worthwhile. Wouldn't be very useful without the good stuff.

[Fraser]

+1 on the external charger, spare battery and soft case. These are very useful accessories.

Note: I have the soft case for the Ex series and another for the Exx series. The Exx soft case suits me better than the Ex case as the E4 is not such a tight fit and easier to insert and remove.

Aurora

[ixfd64]

Even though the limited temperature range of the FLIR E4-B makes it less useful to anyone but building inspectors, it just shows how fast the prices of thermal cameras are dropping.

[Fraser]

The prices of thermal imaging technology has dropped significantly in terms of availability of a technology. I recently purchased an NEC AVIO thermal camera for GBP720 on e*ay. It was virtually new condition and was originally purchased in October 2002. To give you an idea of how prices have dropped, here is the price list for that camera and accessories:

AVIO TH series thermal Camera     Euros 40,000
AVIO Close up lens FL: 38mm        Euros 12,000
AVIO High Temp Filter (2000C)      Euros   5,600
AVIO IEEE1394 interface               Euros   5,600
AVIO/Goratec Software                 Euros   3,500
AVIO Battery (Li-Ion)                    Euros       90
Annual warranty fee                      Euros  3,500

The AVIO TH series camera is an aircraft aluminium 'camcorder format' shell built around a military grade Boeing micro-bolometer thermal imaging core. A superb set of Germanium auto focus optics feed the image to the microbolometer.....quality built around quality 

What you see above is the cost of professional thermal imaging equipment. FLIR can be even more expensive than AVIO for such equipment.

I know that people want more affordable consumer grade thermal cameras and I am all in favour of such. As the technology has developed it has dropped in price. But please do not think that the FLIR E4 is not already good value for money. It is a bargain when compared to the prices of professional equipment, and even more so when upgraded to 320x240 resolution. My FLIR PM' and AVIO TH' cameras have the advantage of 'bullet proof' build quality, accuracy and precision, combined with 320x240 resolution at 60fps. That is what you pay for. The casual user can often accept a lesser specification....hence the arrival of the FLIR Ex series.  FLIR's introduction of the LEPTON core will hopefully do wonders for the budget thermal camera market place, but at low resolution only. I am looking forward to affordable thermal CCTV cameras as they offer an excellent intruder detection capability and are less easily fooled than conventional visible/IR imaging technology. A $400 thermal CCTV camera would be great, even at 80x60 resolution.

Will higher resolution cameras become available soon ? I hope so, but the realist in me thinks it unlikely due to the tight control companies like FLIR and Raytheon have over the market place. It may change, but the Chinese do not seem to be producing cheap sensor arrays as yet. There is also the unavoidable production costs of such and the yield % of good sensor arrays. They may be an expensive device, no matter who makes it. These are not relatively simple CCD chips after all.

Aurora

[mikeselectricstuff]

FLIR's introduction of the LEPTON core will hopefully do wonders for the budget thermal camera market place, but at low resolution only. I am looking forward to affordable thermal CCTV cameras as they offer an excellent intruder detection capability and are less easily fooled than conventional visible/IR imaging technology. A $400 thermal CCTV camera would be great, even at 80x60 resolution.

Flir have already announced a Lepton based security camera - not much info yet ISTR price was around $700
I'm sure lots of other people will be making security cams base on it

Will higher resolution cameras become available soon ? I hope so, but the realist in me thinks it unlikely due to the tight control companies like FLIR and Raytheon have over the market place. It may change, but the Chinese do not seem to be producing cheap sensor arrays as yet. There is also the unavoidable production costs of such and the yield % of good sensor arrays. They may be an expensive device, no matter who makes it. These are not relatively simple CCD chips after all.

I think the main barrier to cheap hi-res is cheap optics - the semiconductor industry has shown that if you make enough of something the price trends towards zero.
I doubt we'll see more than around 320x240 mainstream anytime soon as that's adequate for most uses. There's also an ITAR limit at 111K pixels, which may explain Opgal's 384x288 (=110592) resolution
It will be interesting to see if developments like Heimann's 82x62 thermopile sensor, and the MEMs based sensors from  Alps  compete with Lepton in a race to the bottom of the 80x60 market

[jjmmss00]

There was an article today in the Wall Street Journal, that Flir has a $349 cover for an iPhone that turns it into an thermal imager.

[mikeselectricstuff]

There was an article today in the Wall Street Journal, that Flir has a $349 cover for an iPhone that turns it into an thermal imager.

really?  who knew...?

The only real news in that article was this

Meanwhile, a group of industry veterans at a startup called Seek Thermal this fall plan to begin selling an add-on camera for smartphones for about $100 less.

new thread : https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/yet-another-cheap-thermal-imager-incoming/

[chriseparent]

+1 on tequipment having 1.22 firmware e4s

[mikeselectricstuff]

Just noticed Tequipment are listing -B versions of the E4,5 and 6

I wonder if this is just a case of reducing cost by a shorter calibration for the narrower temp range?
Would be interesting to know if these will even attempt to display temps outside their reduced range
 

[chriseparent]

if you do order from tequipment make sure you choose the included free 2-day shipping at checkout.   otherwise you get what's looking like 6-day free ground that is automatically generated at checkout.
and the free boroscope or accessory kit is a form you download,  mine was pdf from amazon.   not good for ebay sales.