FranLab is getting evicted

[tom66]

I've always wondered how many YouTubers use contract editors and production staff.  I'm not a professional, but the last time I edited a video, which was 20 minutes long, it took me about 4 hours.  Maybe with practice I could get that down to 2 hours or so,  but it wouldn't be *good*.  The bigger YouTubers must surely have an editing team, perhaps even a producer, dedicated camera operator, etc?  How else could you keep up with that output? 

[Kasper]

I'm all for editing to trim out repetitive and pointless chatter or to show PCB, test equipment and datasheets but I generally think less editing is better.  Editing is particularly awful in hollywood.  They change the camera angle and zoom way too often, it's usually zoomed way too far in unless someone is texting then they zoom too far out.  It is particularly bad in fight scenes, you can't see their technique, it's just a bunch of 1 second clips.

The TV show: Trailer Park Boys has some of the best editing I've seen.  Few camera angle changes and zoomed out far enough to often see funny stuff going on in the background.  It's easy on the eyes and you can see their body language and the environment.  Can't quite see every bead of sweat on their face but I'd rather not see that anyways.

[Nusa]

I've always wondered how many YouTubers use contract editors and production staff.  I'm not a professional, but the last time I edited a video, which was 20 minutes long, it took me about 4 hours.  Maybe with practice I could get that down to 2 hours or so,  but it wouldn't be *good*.  The bigger YouTubers must surely have an editing team, perhaps even a producer, dedicated camera operator, etc?  How else could you keep up with that output?

Seems to depend on the channel and popularity. Just looking at a few of the bigger channels I subscribe to:

Eevblog: Dave seems to do his own stuff on multiple channels. He can chime on how much time it takes.
Fab Rats: Posts 3 times a week. The editing is done by the the wife. One of his relatives was hired as a cameraman.
Matts Off-road: Posts 3 times a week. He has a dedicated editing/camera guy, plus everyone (family and employees) picks up a camera in the field as required.
Several others: Post variable times a week and don't give a shit about editing. You get what they filmed, for the most part. In some cases, they're just copies of what were originally live streams.

Fran: obviously does her own stuff. Clearly once a week isn't often enough, but every day may not be required either (for youtube anyway...what the users were promised is another matter). Several times a week seems to work for other people and for the youtube algorithm.

[PlainName]

Few camera angle changes and zoomed out far enough to often see funny stuff going on in the background.

I watched a Japanese film the other month which was simply stunning, although you didn't realise until the end. It was SciFi thing about time - not time travel per se but being able to see into the future via a CCTV monitor. So the plot was basically that they would look into the monitor and see their future selves getting into trouble and telling their current selves to do this and that to head off things. As the viewer we see the main player looking into his monitor and seeing stuff from the future which happens to be his friends in his shop below where he lives. We follow him down (and up) the external stairs,  round the block to not chat up some girl, and the exact scene he saw earlier from a position in the shop. There were many such - we see the future and in the future it plays out exactly how we saw, but right in front of our eyes.

It was an OK film just for that, but amazingly it was shot on a phone in one take! It's really difficult to believe, but afterwards they showed the behind the scenes making of it, and sure enough it was a phone and one take. The operator climbed over furniture and stuff to get the panning shots in a normal shop and block of flats, and the assistant with lights and stuff crawled around the floor somehow remaining out of shot. The coordination of the (obviously live but pretend future) monitor shots and then doing the same again when the future arrives, and have them look exactly right without pre-recording anything, must've taken serious planning. (Well, it did - we see them doing that as well in the 'making of').

[Kasper]

It was an OK film just for that, but amazingly it was shot on a phone in one take!

How many practice takes?

[MK14]

BigCliveDotCom's Youtube channel, seems to mostly just take a video and then post it as is.  With the odd exception, when he is doing something not worth watching or violently dismantling a difficult bit of something, which he cuts out of the video.

I don't think he even uses cameras as such to take the vidoes.  It might have been an iPad or similar originally, then moved on to mobile phone(s), later.

[PlainName]

It was an OK film just for that, but amazingly it was shot on a phone in one take!

How many practice takes?

Don't think they said. I'd imagine it would be a real bummer to get 5 mins from the end and make a mistake.

[Someone]

BigCliveDotCom's Youtube channel, seems to mostly just take a video and then post it as is.  With the odd exception, when he is doing something not worth watching or violently dismantling a difficult bit of something, which he cuts out of the video....

"one moment please"

[EEVblog]

I've always wondered how many YouTubers use contract editors and production staff.  I'm not a professional, but the last time I edited a video, which was 20 minutes long, it took me about 4 hours.  Maybe with practice I could get that down to 2 hours or so,  but it wouldn't be *good*.  The bigger YouTubers must surely have an editing team, perhaps even a producer, dedicated camera operator, etc?  How else could you keep up with that output?

I don't know a single creator in our electronics space that uses a third party writer or have production staff. The exception is the larger general interest channels like Real Engineering, Veritasium etc.
The biggest example si of coure Linus Tech Tips who's organisation is incredible in size.
Even when I had David working full time, he didn't help with producing my content.

[EEVblog]

Eevblog: Dave seems to do his own stuff on multiple channels. He can chime on how much time it takes.

Time wise I could do a video per day if that's all I had to do, and I wasn't a lazy arse and/or spend too much time watching Youtube videos and chatting on the forum 
Generally speaking I like to start, shoot, edit and finish a video in a single day.
I have a packing and shipping business which I do all myself as well.
And a family...

[EEVblog]

BigCliveDotCom's Youtube channel, seems to mostly just take a video and then post it as is.  With the odd exception, when he is doing something not worth watching or violently dismantling a difficult bit of something, which he cuts out of the video.
I don't think he even uses cameras as such to take the vidoes.  It might have been an iPad or similar originally, then moved on to mobile phone(s), later.

Yes, Clive just uses a phone and a tablet and does the "editing" on there, which isn't really editing. Even his macro photos are taken with a phone and custom light ring.
That of course works fine unless you want to create other styles of content. But as said, that has its downsides because people subscribe for his one unique style.

[MK14]

Yes, Clive just uses a phone and a tablet and does the "editing" on there, which isn't really editing. Even his macro photos are taken with a phone and custom light ring.
That of course works fine unless you want to create other styles of content. But as said, that has its downsides because people subscribe for his one unique style.

There are also, some advantages to there NOT being other people, professionally editing/producing the videos.  Because it makes the videos more home-like, honest, easier to watch (as you DON'T need to try to reverse engineer the video production, in your head, to decide what was really going on).  I.e. It is closer to watching a person in real life, and more random/real.

Rather than a more professionally produced product, but that then tends to make the proceedings more predictable, similar and less interesting.

E.g. As you get older, I think some people find that they have already seen ALL the movies.  Even if the actual movie was ONLY released, yesterday.  Because so many things, seem to be done in EXACTLY (in real terms), the same, predictable way (especially with plots and final outcomes).

Linus Tech Tips, is professionally produced, and looks it (if I understand things correctly).  But that in some respects, reduces some enjoyable elements.

Frans videos, seem to have a significantly different style to making the videos, compared to most other electronics youtubers.  Very down to Earth, honest, speaking from their heart, lots of words used, very much into the art/love/excitement of electronics/{computers}, rather than the technical or commercial aspects of them.

Fran also (in very approximate terms) seems to present more personality at the videos, even if they try and hold it back.  She can sometimes start (or have in it) a video, with the first 10 seconds of it, being just showing face expressions of frustration or similar/other emotions.  Before detailing the problems/issues.

[SiliconWizard]

I've always wondered how many YouTubers use contract editors and production staff.  I'm not a professional, but the last time I edited a video, which was 20 minutes long, it took me about 4 hours.  Maybe with practice I could get that down to 2 hours or so,  but it wouldn't be *good*.  The bigger YouTubers must surely have an editing team, perhaps even a producer, dedicated camera operator, etc?  How else could you keep up with that output?

I don't know a single creator in our electronics space that uses a third party writer or have production staff. The exception is the larger general interest channels like Real Engineering, Veritasium etc.
The biggest example si of coure Linus Tech Tips who's organisation is incredible in size.
Even when I had David working full time, he didn't help with producing my content.

Yes behind some channels there's a surprisingly large staff, but that's those very popular channels that target a much wider audience.
In electronics, that's more of a niche. Some are contracting their video editing to someone else (usually freelancers, not employees), for the larger channels, and of course they often have an accountant, but that's the extent of it for most of them.

[james_s]

I disagree. Several Youtubers release a video per day to give an update on the projects they are working on. Typically these videos range from 5 minutes (done nothing) to over an hour (took something complex apart). But these Youtubers have & need to have at least one full-time employee who films and edits the videos. And yes, these videos are worth watching if you are interested in the subject matter.

I guess I'm just not much of a watcher, I never watched nearly as much TV as most people in the past and apparently I don't watch as many online videos as most people. I probably watched about once of Dave's videos a month, Big Clive I'll watch a handful of them while I'm working on something and then not watch any for months. That's how it is with most videos actually, I watch several of them in a row and then I go do other things for months until that topic grabs my interest again. There are zero content producers that I subscribe to and watch all the videos as they come out.

[james_s]

I'm all for editing to trim out repetitive and pointless chatter or to show PCB, test equipment and datasheets but I generally think less editing is better.  Editing is particularly awful in hollywood.  They change the camera angle and zoom way too often, it's usually zoomed way too far in unless someone is texting then they zoom too far out.  It is particularly bad in fight scenes, you can't see their technique, it's just a bunch of 1 second clips.

It drives me nuts when they change camera angles constantly. I remember many years ago trying to watch a fireworks show on TV and they were constantly changing cameras which I find so distracting. I don't remember what it was that I saw more recently that was like that, the changes were very jarring because they would occur while I was still processing what I was seeing. I can't focus when something is constantly flipping around.

[EEVblog]

Yes behind some channels there's a surprisingly large staff, but that's those very popular channels that target a much wider audience.
In electronics, that's more of a niche. Some are contracting their video editing to someone else (usually freelancers, not employees), for the larger channels, and of course they often have an accountant, but that's the extent of it for most of them.

I met and asked Michael Stephens (Vsauce) once if he had an editor. He said he tried it but in the end it was just too much hassle, so ended up going back to just editing himself.
The two most polished electronics channels in terms of production, Great Scott and Electroboom just do it themselves AFAIK.
I thought about having an editor at one point if I went ahead with my EEVdiscover series. i.e. make the entire series look all wanky and consistent and have them edit an entire season of videos.

[EEVblog]

Saw Fran's live Patreon show today.
TLDR;
Yep, daily views are down 90% from Sept when she was on the hampster wheel doing a video per day.
But even now being back on the hampster wheel the views have not recovered. Her channel has basically tanked completely 
Lost half the Patrons she gained during the big push a few months ago, and continuing to drop, so it seems that plan didn't work. There just aren't enough patrons coming in to replace the ones leaving, not even close.
She will cancel doing the live Patreon shows as she realises that Patrons just don't engage, only like a dozen viewing today. (Myself and other Youtubers see the same thing BTW, Patrons do no engage with content, they just use it as a donation mechanism).
She has now realised that doing things just to please the Patrons didn't work.

Problem is now that if the views don't recover, and the algorithm doesn't stop punishing her for some reason, then the channel will wither and die. The graph she showed was brutal, the algorithm really seems to be punishing her.

Rent on storage is $1000/month which is much less than I thought. But main problems are taxes and that rent increases are going up like 10% every year. They don't have fixed rental agreements like we do here. Still claims Philly is the cheapest big city in the US.

Unless views recover, I suspect that even if she ditched the storage unit and the workshop, and only had the apartment lab, she would still struggle with just the Patreon and Youtube income.
Doesn't sound good at all 

[jonovid]

show business can be a cruel unpredictable high wire act, one day you full & it will be rip or your replaced by another, younger upstart act.
even the most scientific of shows can succumb to the popular demands for daily amusement.
in my opinion, its better to have 2 or 3 lifetime friends and a regular income, then placate the endless demands of a mass of fickle funs & fairweather friends.

It would seem to me many full time youtubers are in show business. a circus act in search of an audience.
when I first posted on youtube in 2008 2010?  it was home video , a hobby for most of us at the time.

[beanflying]

Lots to learn and like with Justin's content. This recent one while generic on regrowing an old channel is worth a watch.



To get me as an example to rewatch a channel get real get back to what I went there to watch in the first place and stop bleating poor me.

[wilfred]

Yes, although you never know how the algorithm is going to punish or reward your channel. Always worth testing, the views could have stayed or even improved. It really does depend on how Youtube decides to push your videos. And the algorithm is always changing. But a 90%+ drop is astonishing, no way I expected that.

I unsubscribed from Fran around the time she changed tack. I can't believe I was the only one who did. I'm not mad at her for doing it.
I don't even watch all of BigClive's short videos any more but they're always something I'll consider watching because they're a bit like a quick snack. I decided to have another look at FranLab to see how things pan out. I like Fran.

But there are many channels I no longer watch. Or only watch a few videos from. You can't watch everything. My current favourite electronics channel is Jerry Walker but it is a tiny channel. He has something to say and YT is his means to that end.

I watch a huge variety of stuff and the algorithm obviously tries hard to find me new stuff to watch. It's a bit hit-and-miss but not completely useless.

[EEVblog]

Lots to learn and like with Justin's content. This recent one while generic on regrowing an old channel is worth a watch.
To get me as an example to rewatch a channel get real get back to what I went there to watch in the first place and stop bleating poor me.

She did just revive the old Frantone channel.
Only had a few hundred subs, now up to 2.75k
Always smart to have 2nd channel, but financially not going to useful for a long time.

[EEVblog]

I unsubscribed from Fran around the time she changed tack. I can't believe I was the only one who did. I'm not mad at her for doing it.

As in just recently in September?
I'm sure that's a factor, but to lose 90% of daily views chanel wide, that's the algorithm punishing her.

But there are many channels I no longer watch. Or only watch a few videos from. You can't watch everything. I watch a huge variety of stuff and the algorithm obviously tries hard to find me new stuff to watch. It's a bit hit-and-miss but not completely useless.

This is what I stuggle with with my channel.
Subscriber growth has always been pretty consistent, but ultimately what matters is the daily channel views, and that hasn't grown and has dropped somewhat over the years. I'm sure this is because there are just so many other electronics channels now, hundreds of big ones, which is great to see, but it ultimately means less views to go around.

[EEVblog]

Saw Fran's live Patreon show today.
TLDR;
She will cancel doing the live Patreon shows as she realises that Patrons just don't engage, only like a dozen viewing today. (Myself and other Youtubers see the same thing BTW, Patrons do no engage with content, they just use it as a donation mechanism).
She has now realised that doing things just to please the Patrons didn't work.

I didn't see this video she did telling people about the Patreon live streams this week, only to have it fail even with that promotion. As I said, I was only one of about a dozen peopel watching today.
She is right to abandon Patreon live streams, they clearly do not work. better to spend the time on making main channel content.

So right now her main problem isn't so much the money, it's reviving the channel so it even has a chance of continuing to produce the money.

[wilfred]

By some extraordinary coincidence even Mustie1 did a Q&A about Youtube and the Algorithm in his latest video today. Very unusual for him to do that. He did it whilst rebuilding a carburetor. He also added that he has bills to pay on storage and shop space he uses for his youtube work. So in that respect he is a bit like Fran.

That says to me every youtuber has the algorithm in mind.

[PlainName]

... but ultimately what matters is the daily channel views, and that hasn't grown and has dropped somewhat over the years. I'm sure this is because there are just so many other electronics channels now

Or people just get bored with the same thing. It's the same with books and TV progs and food and lots of things: at first you love it and gorge, then once sated something else catches your attention. Nowt wrong with the stuff (or your channel), just that generally people have changing tastes. While the number of similar channels will have some effect, once you're done with BUSTED!!1! channels and moved onto cat videos, the number of similar channels around just means more you're not going to watch.