FranLab is getting evicted

[nctnico]

How do you climb a mountain? One step at a time... I really dislike people with a "can't do, impossible job, will fail" attitude. With such an attitude you won't get far and keep paying through the nose to have something done you can easely do yourself.

Or swim across the Pacific Ocean - one stroke at a time.  At least until you're out in the middle and your muscles are too exhausted to continue.  So no, everything can't be done by just taking one step at a time, there has to be some consideration of what's actually physically possible.  While underestimating your ability prevents getting it done, overestimating can get you in serious trouble - people die thinking they can do what they can't.

Geeez, some people really take everything literal! 

Let me explain then: when faced with a complicated situation, brake it up in parts and deal with it piece by piece. And you don't need to do it alone; ask for help if you need it. That is how you get through life without getting stuck dealing with a problem.

[james_s]

You don't need much to build a big shed. Our house is 750sqm. Even 1200sqm would be enough if the land and house is proportioned right.
In Australia kids don't usually don't leave home for university, it's not a thing here. So we have a good 15 years left at least before that's likely to happen.

Your house is 750 sqm? 8,000 square ft?! Or do you mean the lot the house is on?

[nctnico]

You don't need much to build a big shed. Our house is 750sqm. Even 1200sqm would be enough if the land and house is proportioned right.
In Australia kids don't usually don't leave home for university, it's not a thing here. So we have a good 15 years left at least before that's likely to happen.

Your house is 750 sqm? 8,000 square ft?! Or do you mean the lot the house is on?

I was wondering the same! 750sqm for a house is huge but it could make sense for the size of a plot of land. IIRC Dave has been mentioning an extension to his house...

[EEVblog]

You don't need much to build a big shed. Our house is 750sqm. Even 1200sqm would be enough if the land and house is proportioned right.
In Australia kids don't usually don't leave home for university, it's not a thing here. So we have a good 15 years left at least before that's likely to happen.

Your house is 750 sqm? 8,000 square ft?! Or do you mean the lot the house is on?

The land, obviously.
We have a relatively small house for our area, even with the extension we did 5 years ago. Hence we are planing an upstairs extension (one large room) as we have no more land left to extend outward. But there is currently a construction worker crisis happening so not sure what's going to happen there. I wouldn't want to be building a house in Australia right now, the smart money is buying an existing house right now.

[Stray Electron]

Don't know specifically about US mortgages, but in the UK you can only get a residential mortgage on a property if the property has: working plumbing (at least one sink and one bath/shower), working toilet, provision for electrical power, and at least one form of cooking appliance (microwave doesn't count.)  It must meet the "minimum standard" of being somewhere someone could live.  So in some of these places you will literally see a toilet plumbed into the living room and a knackered old cooker left behind because that means it can be sold to someone with a mortgage.

That's also the case here I believe (or was), you can't get a loan for just land. You have the have a signed loan/land package if it's not built yet, or some equivalent plan in place to build.

   That's not true in the US. Farmers do it all of the time. :-) So do housing developers. :-(

[james_s]

The land, obviously.
We have a relatively small house for our area, even with the extension we did 5 years ago. Hence we are planing an upstairs extension (one large room) as we have no more land left to extend outward. But there is currently a construction worker crisis happening so not sure what's going to happen there. I wouldn't want to be building a house in Australia right now, the smart money is buying an existing house right now.

That makes more sense, although it's not totally obvious, there are a few 8,000 sq ft houses not too far from me although not many are *that* large. I think my lot is about 10,000 sq ft but about 10' of it on two sides is on a steep hill so not really useful for much.

[EEVblog]

Let me explain then: when faced with a complicated situation, brake it up in parts and deal with it piece by piece. And you don't need to do it alone; ask for help if you need it. That is how you get through life without getting stuck dealing with a problem.

And sometime you need a plan(s) to change course instead of dealing with a problem piece by piece.
In Fran's situtation, what is needeed IMO is a plan for various scenarios. Solving her problems "piece by piece" seems to how she's ended up in this scenario.
Every issue here can be solved with cash, so scaling back epenses and saving cash any way possible will never be a bad option for starters.

[nctnico]

Don't know specifically about US mortgages, but in the UK you can only get a residential mortgage on a property if the property has: working plumbing (at least one sink and one bath/shower), working toilet, provision for electrical power, and at least one form of cooking appliance (microwave doesn't count.)  It must meet the "minimum standard" of being somewhere someone could live.  So in some of these places you will literally see a toilet plumbed into the living room and a knackered old cooker left behind because that means it can be sold to someone with a mortgage.

That's also the case here I believe (or was), you can't get a loan for just land. You have the have a signed loan/land package if it's not built yet, or some equivalent plan in place to build.

   That's not true in the US. Farmers do it all of the time. :-) So do housing developers. :-(

Those are business loans!

[Stray Electron]

  No, not always.  If your income and credit is good enough you can borrow money to buy land using a personal loan. I looked at borrowing money to buy raw land years ago to build a house on and my credit union was more than wiling to give me a loan.

  And no one said what kind of loans. The statement was that you could only get loans for homes or for land with a home and not just for land. It's very common in the US to get a short term loan to buy land with and then build a home on it and then refinance the land and home package at a lower interest rate.  My father did that twice.  Shoot, my grandparents did the same in 1934 when they moved to Georgia. When my uncle returned from WW-II he took out a loan in 1946 to buy 300 acres of land near his parents. He lived with his folks and farmed that land until he build a house there in 1956. Not everyone buys a ready made house in the subdivisions.

[james_s]

Fran has a business, at least technically. Could she not claim that the location being purchased is a facility to grow that business?

[Nusa]

Fran has a business, at least technically. Could she not claim that the location being purchased is a facility to grow that business?

She doesn't have much cash flow that the banks would recognize as stable income, which is why she couldn't get loans the last time she was in the moving situation. And as it turns out, the banks were entirely correct in that evaluation! Youtube/patron/solicited/gift money is not reliable long-term income!

[nctnico]

  No, not always.  If your income and credit is good enough you can borrow money to buy land using a personal loan. I looked at borrowing money to buy raw land years ago to build a house on and my credit union was more than wiling to give me a loan.

We where talking about mortgages here. And mortgages typically have realestate (a building) as an collateral that can be repossed if necessary. However, if you have enough income that a collateral for a loan isn't necessary, then yes, you can buy whatever you want.

[nctnico]

Let me explain then: when faced with a complicated situation, brake it up in parts and deal with it piece by piece. And you don't need to do it alone; ask for help if you need it. That is how you get through life without getting stuck dealing with a problem.

And sometime you need a plan(s) to change course instead of dealing with a problem piece by piece.
In Fran's situtation, what is needeed IMO is a plan for various scenarios. Solving her problems "piece by piece" seems to how she's ended up in this scenario.
Every issue here can be solved with cash, so scaling back epenses and saving cash any way possible will never be a bad option for starters.

Ofcourse there has to be an overall plan (that should go without saying). But it will still need to be executed in steps.

[EEVblog]

Fran has a business, at least technically. Could she not claim that the location being purchased is a facility to grow that business?

Not sure about the US, but here a business property loan is not as good as the low rates of a home loan.
It would also likely deemed to be a commercial property loan, in which case the rates are way higher and usually require a much bigger deposit.
But she has already said many times it's impossible to get a personal home loan in her situtation, as most of her income comes from Patreon which is not deemed to be business income.
I can't however see why she can't restructure the business as an LLC or whatever and at least try to get a business loan.

[EEVblog]

Fran has a business, at least technically. Could she not claim that the location being purchased is a facility to grow that business?

She doesn't have much cash flow that the banks would recognize as stable income, which is why she couldn't get loans the last time she was in the moving situation. And as it turns out, the banks were entirely correct in that evaluation! Youtube/patron/solicited/gift money is not reliable long-term income!

For my personal property loan the banks did require an income statment from my accountant for my Pty Ltd business, and that didn't break down income into Patreon income/donations.
So all the banks were looking for was consistentcy of business income, they didn't really care nor ask for where it came from.
I refuse to believe that it's not possible for Fran the restructure her business in some way that obfuscates the income source.
If the banks see the detail that the income comes from Patreon then you aren't doing it right.
Maybe the US is vastly different, but I doub it, remember it's the land of the 2008 subprime mortgage crisis that still perpetuates to this day in many ways.

If there is a will there is a way, but the problem is there is no will(ingness) to be flexible in location for starters.

[EEVblog]

What are the odds of a GoFundMe working?
https://www.domain.com.au/10-o-keefe-road-annangrove-nsw-2156-2018031608
Includes a giant 90sqm lab.

[PlainName]

Really nice place.

Remind me why I might want to pay someone else to live there. I think there is a subtle difference between helping someone survive, and going without so they can live the life of Riley.

[SiliconWizard]

I refuse to believe that it's not possible for Fran the restructure her business in some way that obfuscates the income source.

Yeah. The main issue there is the amount - does she make enough - and, if she has to restructure her business now, it might take a couple years before new income statements are ready for a bank loan.
But you gotta start.

[EEVblog]

Yeah. The main issue there is the amount - does she make enough - and, if she has to restructure her business now, it might take a couple years before new income statements are ready for a bank loan.
But you gotta start.

In one of her videos she mentioned she has enough income to get a loan for a place, but the issues is the techicalities of actually getting the loan.

She showed in a video that expenses were over $70k last year, expected to rise to $80k this year, so income must be higher unless she is dipping into savings to cover the difference.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/yet-another-franlab-crisis/msg4540310/?topicseen#msg4540310
This is way above the average household income in many cities.
But yes, you'd usually have to show a couple of years worth of income.

[SiliconWizard]

Yep. But yes that's significant expenses, and certainly with less than this she could pay a loan for a reasonable place and get it paid within only a few years, while still having enough for other expenses and saving some.

[nctnico]

Yeah. The main issue there is the amount - does she make enough - and, if she has to restructure her business now, it might take a couple years before new income statements are ready for a bank loan.
But you gotta start.

In one of her videos she mentioned she has enough income to get a loan for a place, but the issues is the techicalities of actually getting the loan.

She showed in a video that expenses were over $70k last year, expected to rise to $80k this year, so income must be higher unless she is dipping into savings to cover the difference.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/yet-another-franlab-crisis/msg4540310/?topicseen#msg4540310
This is way above the average household income in many cities.
But yes, you'd usually have to show a couple of years worth of income.

Indeed. But if you have enough income and show it is stable, it shouldn't be a problem. IMHO it is all about how the income is presented to a bank. Being a sole proprietor myself, I had to provide some extra paperwork (like income taxes) and the number of banks I could apply for a mortgage where not large (*) but I still got my mortgage refinanced without much hassle. Like others I have the feeling Fran is organising things in a way that makes it unnecessarily complicated for herself to get a mortgage. Almost like she is setting herself up to fail. If I look at various US websites, getting a mortgage after being 'in business' as a sole proprietor for a couple of years should not be a problem at all. But we have been over this before...

* Which was partly my choice due to not wanting to deal with a larger amount of paperwork.

[james_s]

In one of her videos she mentioned she has enough income to get a loan for a place, but the issues is the techicalities of actually getting the loan.

She showed in a video that expenses were over $70k last year, expected to rise to $80k this year, so income must be higher unless she is dipping into savings to cover the difference.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/yet-another-franlab-crisis/msg4540310/?topicseen#msg4540310
This is way above the average household income in many cities.
But yes, you'd usually have to show a couple of years worth of income.

If her expenses are over $70k she must be making good money, more than I've ever made, because taxes take a pretty big chunk out of income, around 30% give or take depending on the state and other factors.

[Kasper]

And sometime you need a plan(s) to change course instead of dealing with a problem piece by piece.
In Fran's situtation, what is needeed IMO is a plan for various scenarios. Solving her problems "piece by piece" seems to how she's ended up in this scenario.
Every issue here can be solved with cash, so scaling back epenses and saving cash any way possible will never be a bad option for starters.

Fran kind of reminds me of a lobster in a pot.  We are sometimes more likely to tolerate a bad situation if we get there through slow and steady changes.  Sometimes planning a threshold ahead of time can help one realize the 'water is too hot'.

Sometimes it helps just to ask where that threshold is: "if it's not bad enough yet to justify a change, when will it be bad enough?  What will it take?"

That at least creates a scenario to start planning a change.  Then the change becomes feasible.  Then the question, "why not just make the change now?"

[Brumby]

https://www.domain.com.au/10-o-keefe-road-annangrove-nsw-2156-2018031608
Includes a giant 90sqm lab.

What are the odds of a GoFundMe working?

$3,285,000?   

[EEVblog]

https://www.domain.com.au/10-o-keefe-road-annangrove-nsw-2156-2018031608
Includes a giant 90sqm lab.

What are the odds of a GoFundMe working?

$3,285,000?   

Is it too late to up it to this?
https://www.domain.com.au/3382-old-northern-road-glenorie-nsw-2157-2018213428