Author Topic: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)  (Read 3083999 times)

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Offline JiggyNinja

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8250 on: January 25, 2017, 09:03:55 pm »
Their email went straight into my spam folder.
Anyway, how am I supposed to sing praises when they still haven't shipped my sleeves I ordered over a month ago?
Downsize some of your surplus honesty.
 

Offline Domagoj T

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8251 on: January 25, 2017, 09:28:50 pm »
I'm not catching your drift.
 

Offline Godzil

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8252 on: January 25, 2017, 10:10:11 pm »
I don't knot but on old flashlights (bulb one) I've always run them until the battery die and the lamp just faintly glow, never at "50%" and they are honest on their graph, the flashlight without the boost still works when the other is dead :D
When you make hardware without taking into account the needs of the eventual software developers, you end up with bloated hardware full of pointless excess. From the outset one must consider design from both a hardware and software perspective.
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Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8253 on: January 25, 2017, 10:55:08 pm »
Their email went straight into my spam folder.
Anyway, how am I supposed to sing praises when they still haven't shipped my sleeves I ordered over a month ago?
Downsize some of your surplus honesty.

I'm not catching your drift.

Do what Batteroo are doing....  stretching the truth.
 

Offline Smokey

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8254 on: January 25, 2017, 11:53:57 pm »
I just came across a product which I would much prefer had the behavior of suddenly dying rather than having the battery voltage tail off gradually....

A frikkin Brymen 857 multimeter....

Just before the 9V battery died, it got really inaccurate.  It freaked me out since I knew the thing I was measuring was good.  Yes I know I ignored the battery warning too long, but still.  Don't lie to me, just die when you know you are about to stop being accurate!  Fresh battery brought it back to normal.

Wonder how bad the boost converter ripple would jack up the measurement circuits of a meter...
 

Offline FrankBuss

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8255 on: January 26, 2017, 12:00:00 am »
They just sent out a mailing about that contest to find something, anything, that works with the Batteroo https://www.batteroo.com/contest

Quote
We would like to wish you a happy new year and start 2017 by showing our appreciation to our customers! We are officially starting the Batteroo Customer Appreciation Contest! We are giving away $500 every month to the customer that comes up with the most fun and creative photo or video using our Batteroo Boost sleeves.

In addition to the photo/video contest, we are also choosing 10 winners every month who submit written testimonials, describing how they've benefited from Batteroo Boost. Each of these 10 winners will receive a $50 reward for their Batteroo Boost testimonial!

February’s contest, which is our first, will begin today. Since it is our first month, we are giving everybody an early start! At the end of every month, we will announce the winners. The first day of the following month, the contest begins again!
Submit videos, images to www.batteroo.com/contest, and written testimonaials to contest@batteroo.com

 For full contest rules, visit www.batteroo.com/contest


"most fun and creative photo or video using our Batteroo Boost sleeves". Well, I have some ideas:

  • After one side broken off, which the product is designed to do, use some electrical tape one one side, then you can use it as a nice cutter, e.g. for opening mailbags.
  • Use the sharp points at the positive terminal as a marker, to mark the position when you drill holes. This is perfect for it, because you can rotate it to create a circle, for larger diameter drills.
  • In winter before you go out, carefully twist and move the battery a bit when it is in a device, until it starts getting warm. Then you can use it as a hand warmer. Note: do this only when there is snow outside, you might have to throw it away when the battery catches fire.
  • Use it as a gift for a person you don't like. Then record a video when it fails early and the person complains that now even more batteries goes to the landfill.
So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish
Electronics, hiking, retro-computing, electronic music etc.: https://www.youtube.com/c/FrankBussProgrammer
 
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Offline Luminax

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8256 on: January 26, 2017, 01:51:40 am »
Whack some batteroos (4 of them) into the Mooninite LED Panel, put it in Boston, and finally have a REAL IED bomb  :-DD
Jack of all trade - Master of some... I hope...
 
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Offline StuUK

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8257 on: January 26, 2017, 08:25:34 am »
Whack some batteroos (4 of them) into the Mooninite LED Panel, put it in Boston, and finally have a REAL IED bomb  :-DD

How is that at all funny FFS?
 

Offline f4eru

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8258 on: January 26, 2017, 10:08:26 pm »
it's funny because it has a high chance to explode when you're not expecting it :)
Do you have a problem with the fact that Batteroo sleeves often overheat, and could potentially drive the battery to explode ?
it is in fact a potential random bomb, like some other badly designed battery devices.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2017, 10:45:39 pm by f4eru »
 

Offline Luminax

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8259 on: January 27, 2017, 03:14:03 am »
Whack some batteroos (4 of them) into the Mooninite LED Panel, put it in Boston, and finally have a REAL IED bomb  :-DD

How is that at all funny FFS?

Did you not know the piece of story concerning the LED panel Mooninite ad campaign that caused the Boston bomb scare?
It was just an innocent piece of LED matrix advertising board... but now with batteroo...!
Jack of all trade - Master of some... I hope...
 

Offline Sonny_Jim

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8260 on: January 27, 2017, 06:25:39 am »


Note the part that says 'upload to any 3rd party video sharing website'.

Seeing as one of the very few situations where the Batteroos come in useful is in sex toys, could someone submit a video via a pornhub link?

EDIT:  Also just done a bit of poking around.  Seems like Frankie had trouble with the fuses on his Ferrari:

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/360-430-sponsored-yellow-compass-group/479414-can-someone-help-me-decoding-fuses.html

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/360-430-sponsored-yellow-compass-group/444011-360-spider-fuse-locations.html



 :-DD :-DD :-DD :-DD :-DD :-DD :-DD
« Last Edit: January 27, 2017, 06:45:28 am by Sonny_Jim »
 

Online mikeselectricstuff

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8261 on: January 27, 2017, 11:47:07 am »
Quote
In addition to the photo/video contest, we are also choosing 10 winners every month who submit written testimonials, describing how they've benefited from Batteroo Boost. Each of these 10 winners will receive a $50 reward for their Batteroo Boost testimonial!
Youtube income from debunking videos....  :-DD
Youtube channel:Taking wierd stuff apart. Very apart.
Mike's Electric Stuff: High voltage, vintage electronics etc.
Day Job: Mostly LEDs
 

Offline HighVoltage

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8262 on: January 27, 2017, 11:59:36 am »
My set of 4 Batteroo AA arrived today in a retail package.
I guess, I will do some testing over the weekend.
There are 3 kinds of people in this world, those who can count and those who can not.
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8263 on: January 27, 2017, 02:06:52 pm »


Call me fussy - but I would have suggested checking the polarity (step 2) as the first thing to do, before inserting the battery into the sleeve (step 1).



... or have I misinterpreted the instructions?
« Last Edit: January 27, 2017, 02:09:43 pm by Brumby »
 

Offline f4eru

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8264 on: January 27, 2017, 05:08:03 pm »
He should have put a batteriser sleeve in, instead of replacing the battery
 :-DD :-DD :-DD :-DD :-DD :-DD :-DD

Offline ez24

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8265 on: January 27, 2017, 06:36:19 pm »
My set of 4 Batteroo AA arrived today in a retail package.
I guess, I will do some testing over the weekend.

I hope in devices.  I think there are enough graphs.  I still want to see the monkeys and my guess they will fail because Bateroo showed them in a video but did not show any tests with them.
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Offline dr_frost_dk

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8266 on: January 27, 2017, 09:46:06 pm »
I think people are beginning to smell the bullshit, and the apparent shipping problems
Previous comments are deleted and so will a few of these.
 

Offline amspire

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8267 on: January 28, 2017, 12:01:19 am »
I think we may be being very, very nice to Batteroo by avoiding some of the basic tests.

We keep testing single batteries - but most devices use more then one battery cell. As far as I know, no one has even done one of the most basic important checks - a reverse diode test across the output to see if it acts like a diode. Absolutely unbelievable!

When a Batteriser shuts down due to low voltage, what does it do? A really important questions as the other Batterisers are still producing 1.5V at this point.

If it goes open:
The shutdown cell will get a reverse voltage across it - so it has to be able to be an open circuit with a reverse voltage of up to 10.5V (for a device that uses 8 AA cells - such as many old handheld walkie talkies). It could be tested non-destructively by applying the reverse voltage via a 10K resistor. See what the maximum voltage it can take. Perhaps short out the battery contacts to simulate a flat battery. 10.5V does not sound like much, but the batteriser IC is optimised for high currents and 1.5V operation - it may use devices with a 5V maximum rating.

The big thing if it behaves this way is that if there is one weak battery cell in a multi battery cell device, the Batteriser will draw more current from the weak cell then all the other cells and so it speeds up the discharge of that weakest cell. When the device shuts down, you chuck out all the cells (it is the Batteriser right? Uses every drop of power from a cell.) The trouble is those other cells you are chucking out may have more remaining charge in them then if you had no Batteriser - so the Batteriser, even if 100% efficient, may be wasting more batteries!

Lots of people buy AA/AAA cells in bulk so by the time they are used, they may be years old. Or they grab whatever mixed batteries they have on hand. It is easy to end up with a set of batteries with very different available capacities.

If it looks like a diode junction with a reverse voltage:

This opens up a whole nest of questions.

For a start, the device can still draw current from the other 3 battery cells (in a 4 battery device) and so in a high current device, there can be a lot of heat in this reverse diode junction - probably much more then when the Batteriser is in switching mode. Could easily cuase the Batteriser IC to fuse (ie become a short across the battery). This could be the factor that decides the maximum current rating of the Batteriser.

The second point that I have raised several times is that if the IC acts like a diode with a reverse applied voltage, the device may be susceptible to latch up. To test non-destructively (hopefully), apply a reverse current through the output of say 100mA with no battery and then connect 1.6V via 100 ohms to the battery terminals. Then switch off the 100mA through the output. Is the batteriser dragging down the 1.6V to a lower voltage such as 1.2V? If it has this inherent weakness, then it is possible for the Batteriser to latch up during the insertion of the last battery into a switched-on device or a device that has a capacitor permanently across the batteries. If it can latch up, this could easily cause enough heat in the switching IC to make it fuse and short the battery out. It is possible to design latch-up resistant IC's, but most switching regulator IC's probably were not designed at the start to have to cope with working in series with other regulators.

If the Batteriser behaves in some different way:

The least likely, but say when it shuts down, it somehow connects the flat battery to the outputs. Really unlikely.

Richard




« Last Edit: January 28, 2017, 01:18:44 am by amspire »
 

Offline dr_frost_dk

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8268 on: January 28, 2017, 12:23:00 am »
They just went through their next check and delete cycle and the comments i posted a few hours ago are deleted  :-DD
But another comment showing the frustrated customers
 

Offline Hensingler

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8269 on: January 28, 2017, 01:21:00 am »
Quote from: Anthony Podorsek
My worst battery abusers will not take the Batteroo sleeve due to size restrictions. I have had batteries drained of power. I had one Batteroo short out and melt the top off.
Quote from: Anthony Podorsek
There is more to a successful business than just a great product

You would think he might have concluded by now that the product isn't anywhere near great.
 

Offline EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8270 on: January 28, 2017, 02:54:22 am »


So yet another report of a melted Batteriser!
Is that 4 now?
 

Offline Kjelt

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8271 on: January 28, 2017, 08:57:16 am »
Quote
There is more to a succesfull business than just a great product
Great product? What have I been missing  :)
If my device would burn I would:
First ask my insurance, maybe their lawyers can speed things up.
Second mail the known consumer watchdog programs and insitutions.
 

Offline Blocco

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8272 on: January 28, 2017, 10:10:56 pm »
Great news for all the electronic accordion players out there... maybe...well he doesn't actually say... I wonder if he's received his $50 yet?

https://youtu.be/hy1M7rnYTs4
« Last Edit: January 28, 2017, 10:15:23 pm by Blocco »
 

Offline FrankBuss

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8273 on: January 28, 2017, 10:39:15 pm »
Great news for all the electronic accordion players out there... maybe...well he doesn't actually say... I wonder if he's received his $50 yet?

I didn't know that there are battery powered accordions. "just 10 batteries" :palm: First search result for it is a forum entry how to replace it with a $20 Li-ion battery pack from eBay, charger included.
So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish
Electronics, hiking, retro-computing, electronic music etc.: https://www.youtube.com/c/FrankBussProgrammer
 

Offline samgab

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Re: EEVblog #751 - How To Debunk A Product (The Batteriser)
« Reply #8274 on: January 28, 2017, 11:05:14 pm »
Great news for all the electronic accordion players out there... maybe...well he doesn't actually say... I wonder if he's received his $50 yet?

I didn't know that there are battery powered accordions. "just 10 batteries" :palm: First search result for it is a forum entry how to replace it with a $20 Li-ion battery pack from eBay, charger included.

This poor old gentleman is exactly the kind of credulous sucker that is preyed upon by those running scams and worthless products like the Batteroo. I feel sorry for him, but caveat emptor and all that...
If he had done that same quick google search, he would have saved himself a great deal of money and gained much better performance and life per use by buying the rechargable battery pack instead.
 


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