Purchasing parts and basic components for a new lab

[tooki]

In modern electronics manufacturing, "binning" means sorting components by value. High-end white LEDs for lighting applications, for example, are binned (by the LED maker) by their exact white balance, so that if you are a lamp manufacturer, you can say "I need more 2900K, bin 14" to match the bin 14 LEDs you used in prior batches, to ensure the white balance is exactly the same.

Electronics manufacturers (that is, ones buying components) will sometimes bin critical components that need to be matched more precisely than the component manufacturer is willing to do. So for example they might buy transistors and then characterize them very precisely so they can create matched pairs.

Of course, we don't know what rhb meant unless they come back and clarify whether they meant sorting by value or storing in bins. (I assume it's safe to assume they weren't throwing them away. )

[AnyNameWillDo]

It's great to see you so enthusiastic about starting out but try and resist the temptation to buy everything you see.  To give you an idea, I have been doing electronics / computing for over 30 years both as a hobby and professionally and still end up having to order parts for most projects.  Even if money & space aren't a problem you just end up losing track of stuff and find yourself buying them again    It would be great to see you build some stuff and maybe post your progress.  PS be wary of buying silicon from ebay, there are a lot of fake parts which won't help your learning.

I'm assuming by "silicon" you're referring to ICs? If so then yes, I mostly plan to buy my ICs from DigiKey -- it's just too convenient and they have so many parts.

The basic random components (resistors, transistors, capacitors, etc) I just got the big bags/kits from ebay (which are still on their way). If I were to ever give someone a finished product I assume I could order nicer parts from e.g. Digikey.

[ez24]

Also, a good happy medium for some components is Tayda Electronics from Thailand. They’re not as cheap as Chinese vendors, but they also arrive in a week or less, vs 1-4 weeks for China.

I have heard others here say good things about Tayda.   Check out their kits

https://www.taydaelectronics.com/electronic-kits.html

Looks like they come with docs (rare with Ali)

I think they would make good learning tools.  Once you put it together you could use your new scope to trace the signals.  Then you can destroy or remove components to troubleshoot.  And then use your new components  to make repairs.

They say they use "Preformatted board "  not etched.  I do not know what this means ?  Anyone ?

[jpb]

They say they use "Preformatted board "  not etched.  I do not know what this means ?  Anyone ?

I guess this means perforated board, i.e. board with a grid of holes in (perhaps with copper around each hole).
Perhaps something like this:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/SODIAL-6x8cm-perforated-printed-circuit/dp/B01L1PNCC0?SubscriptionId=AKIAILSHYYTFIVPWUY6Q&tag=duckduckgo-ffnt-uk-21&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B01L1PNCC0

[ez24]

They say they use "Preformatted board "  not etched.  I do not know what this means ?  Anyone ?

I guess this means perforated board, i.e. board with a grid of holes in (perhaps with copper around each hole).
Perhaps something like this:

I thought this also but I think perf boards are hard to work with, especially if you have to cut traces. It takes more skill than a normal board.

If no answer in a few days, I will make a post on this question.  Someone must have used their kits and if not I may buy one.

[bson]

I use a ton of SMD protoboards. Just cheap ones off ebay. They are great for testing out chips before you order your boards.
Only problem is, is there is a huge variety. The ones I tend to use most are QFNs and SOIC . I also tend to use a bunch of 0.5mm pitch generic ones.

Yeah, I use the cheap stuff for that as well.  Mostly SSOP, SOIC, and occasionally QFN.  Just mounted an MSP430i2041 to a QFN-32 adapter though.  The main problem with the cheap ones I buy is their tinning is too heavy, but the Hakko FR-300 cleans that up in a heartbeat.  It can be hard to place a 0.5mm pitch package when the traces are heavily crowned; it makes parts really prone sliding off the heavy solder before I can get hot air on it (and the air doesn't help).  But removing it, pasting, placing, reflow - perfect.

[bson]

But I agree, as a US resident, you can get stuff fast anyway. One approach to consider might be to stagger, over the course of perhaps a year, your preemptive purchases from Digi-Key into a few orders that each exceed the 50 dollar minimum for free shipping.

DigiKey's $3.99 USPS flat rate shipping gets to me in 2 or 3 days.  If I order just a single device it's usually because I need it right now, and $4... no brainer, I just order it.

[tooki]

They say they use "Preformatted board "  not etched.  I do not know what this means ?  Anyone ?

I guess this means perforated board, i.e. board with a grid of holes in (perhaps with copper around each hole).
Perhaps something like this:

I thought this also but I think perf boards are hard to work with, especially if you have to cut traces. It takes more skill than a normal board.

Perfboard doesn't have traces. It's just pads — or no copper at all. Are you thinking of stripboard (aka Veroboard)?

And what's a "normal board" to you?!? (There is no generally accepted "normal board".)

[tooki]

They say they use "Preformatted board "  not etched.  I do not know what this means ?  Anyone ?

From looking at their documentation, it's stripboard. I assume they 1. chose the wrong English word ("perfboard") for the item, then 2. misspelled it, and then 3. let spellcheck "fix" it to "preformatted board". It's just Chinglish, don't put any stock in it.

E.g. compare https://www.taydaelectronics.com/electronic-kits/100-watt-led-power-meter-with-10-led-steps-for-home-car-or-work-k207-4384.html with its documentation at http://www.taydakits.com/instructions/100w-led-power-meter

[Syntax_Error]

So, don't take this the wrong way, it's just a question:

Is there any particular reason you want/need to outfit your lab so extensively this way, as opposed to say an emphasis on developing good simulation skill? Not that the two ideas are opposed or mutually exclusive, because they aren't.

My observation is that your focus is nearly entirely on "the basics" of available parts, which honestly modern simulators all cover just fine, and without breadboard and wiring problems. I mention this partly because of others who may read your thread with interest and be daunted at how much they "need" to buy. There is another way, so to speak.

In my (extremely limited) tinkering experience, most of the devices I need to have on hand at a moment's notice come down to what is needed to interface to whatever I am actually working with, such as microcontroller dev boards. In this case I find myself needing a small assortment of basic resistors and even smaller assortment of capacitors and wires to connect various widgets to a micro. This is just one example.

For most (pretty much all) of my tinkering, I use simulators to feel out the design before I order *anything*, followed by making an initial purchase of parts and passives and dev boards (including SMD breakout boards, etc) and *solder* things together. This is usually the start of a refinement cycle involving more simulation and eventually a PCB and parts order, and more soldering.

I'm not saying this is superior for everyone, but it has a lot of merits, not the least of which is economic. Just something to consider.

[AnyNameWillDo]

I mean, I don't disagree with you. Down the line I'll probably end up doing the same thing (using simulation to feel out a design first).

Part of it is a little emotional for me. I never had the opportunity to share this hobby with my father, who passed when I was young. So, somehow I guess this is me making up for lost time? As well as minimizing expected long-term cost by not needing to upgrade as much. I just want to have a lab I can be proud of, where I can really dig in and start learning with plenty of physical resources to play around with.

Yeah, it's overkill, and yeah, I could use a simulator, but I've already spent years in software while neglecting hardware altogether. It's fun to consider working with physical components for once. The initial purchasing / learning phase of any vast and deep hobby is always bumpy and awkward but it tends to take off pretty good after that if you have a strong enough base.

[Syntax_Error]

Understood.

With your motivations made clear, one thing you may find rewarding (surely it is in the same spirit of exploration that your father no doubt enjoyed in the hobby) is to "peruse" interesting/useful components/chips, including modern ones, and think of interesting things to do with them. It's kind of the reverse of the traditional "I want to make _____" and then choose components and circuits to fulfill that need. It is akin to playing aimlessly, and it is rife with discovery and learning. I have become inspired more than once by learning about a feature or capability that I was unaware was available.

Best of luck, and happy tinkering.

[AnyNameWillDo]

Understood.

With your motivations made clear, one thing you may find rewarding (surely it is in the same spirit of exploration that your father no doubt enjoyed in the hobby) is to "peruse" interesting/useful components/chips, including modern ones, and think of interesting things to do with them. It's kind of the reverse of the traditional "I want to make _____" and then choose components and circuits to fulfill that need. It is akin to playing aimlessly, and it is rife with discovery and learning. I have become inspired more than once by learning about a feature or capability that I was unaware was available.

Best of luck, and happy tinkering.

Precisely how I am looking at it currently -- well, both ways, to some extent. Looking for interesting components and then finding interesting projects to make out of them, as well as looking up common projects and getting the parts needed. So doing it from both directions to get a sense of things. Otherwise it's tough when you're a beginner and you have no clue what capabilities are out there, as you said.