Author Topic: TQFP32 Programming Socket  (Read 2338 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.


Offline ogden

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3217
  • Country: lv
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2018, 06:48:11 am »
These are just 38.53USD from aliexpress, are these reliable ? can these be programmed with an Arduino via the 6Pin ISP ?

Dunno about reliability of those, but supposedly they shall work well for light (hobbyist) use :)

Arduino is not ISP programmer. You need AVRISP:

http://www.microchip.com/developmenttools/productdetails.aspx?partno=atavrisp2

There are loads of clones and "cheap" ISP programmers on eBay, search for "USBASP", "USBISP".
 

Offline Signal32

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 234
  • Country: us
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2018, 07:00:16 am »
Take a look at https://www.aliexpress.com/item/-/32718280509.html
Yes, you should be able to program an Arduino ATMEGA32 with that socket + ISP though I'm not sure how many other external components you'll need.
 

Offline agehall

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 264
  • Country: se
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2018, 07:53:33 am »
Arduino is not ISP programmer. You need AVRISP:

No. Arduino can act as an ISP just fine. Just burn the ArduinoISP sketch and you have an stk500v1 emulator in the Arduino. Granted I'd very much prefer a proper programmer, but an Arduino works just fine.

There is even a version of the ArduinoISP that provides a clock output from the Arduino so that you don't need a crystal while programming.
 

Online anishkgt

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 759
  • Country: qa
    • George Hobby
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2018, 10:51:13 am »
Thank you all for the suggestions.

The arduino UNO R3 has a feature for programming external Atmega chips. I need TQFP32 package and i guess this would be ideal
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/M48-ADP-ATmega48-ATmega88-ATmega168-mega48-mega88-TQFP32-AVR-Programming-Adapter-Test-Socket-Freeshipping/474874544.html?spm=a2g0s.13010208.99999999.262.QhJJpu


 

Online NorthGuy

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2080
  • Country: ca
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2018, 05:05:08 am »
Instead of programming in the socket, it might be beneficial to program directly on the board. You will solder your chip on to the board and will have to connect it for testing anyway. Why not to combine the testing with programming?
 

Offline TomS_

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 500
  • Country: gb
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2018, 05:43:01 am »
Instead of programming in the socket, it might be beneficial to program directly on the board. You will solder your chip on to the board and will have to connect it for testing anyway. Why not to combine the testing with programming?
^^^

This. If you are designing a board, add a programming header along side the MCU. You will thank yourself for it later.

Otherwise, if you program it off-board, what are you going to do when its soldered to the board and you need to change what your code does/fix a bug/etc?

By all means, use something like this programming adapter if you want to, for e.g. play around with different MCUs while you figure out which one is right for your application.
 

Offline phil from seattle

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 504
  • Country: us
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2018, 10:05:52 pm »
Ditto that. It's crazy to invest in off board programming of surface mount chips. 

Also, invest in a decent programmer if you are going to do more than a couple of chips. (If you're looking at the above socket, you sure seem to be.) While the ArduinoISP sketch works fine, it's better to have a "real" programmer that goes to an ISP header rather than a bunch of jumpers plugged into the arduino's headers. You will have enough random wires on your boards while debugging, don't make it any harder. 

An AVRISP can be had for cheap or you can build one with an Arduino Nano for a few quid (and use the ArduinoISP sketch). But an Atmel ICE is a better way to go since you will get debugging. More expensive but less than $100. Note that Atmel/Microchip is moving away from the 4 wire ISP interface.  The new UPDI one wire interface is really nice.
 

Offline JoeN

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 990
  • Country: us
  • We Buy Trannies By The Truckload
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2018, 07:09:58 pm »
Ditto that. It's crazy to invest in off board programming of surface mount chips. 

The more common ones are actually very cheap.  That Aliexpress model is more expensive than it needs to be.  See:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/QFP32-TQFP32-FQFP32-PQFP32-TO-DIP32-DIP28-IC-test-socket-programmer/281803147211
https://www.ebay.com/itm/LQFP44-TQFP44-to-DIP40-adapter-IC-CHIP-atmega16-atmega32-AVR-socket-programmer/202119579643

I think the setup is more for gang programming, though, it is pretty easy to just program on the target.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2018, 07:12:08 pm by JoeN »
Have You Been Triggered Today?
 

Offline cstratton

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 51
  • Country: us
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2018, 07:31:17 pm »
You absolutely need a solution for on-board (re)programming.  An ISP header footprint can support a header for prototyping, and then you can hit the same holes with pogo pins for production.  Or you can use something smaller like tag-connect.   I've often wondered about edge fingers for this purpose.

The key point is that often the programming and testing is left as an afterthought, only being considered after the board design is done such that you end up needing to pick up a hodgepodge of signals from different places and connector styles, have few holes you can use for alignment fixturing and have odd protrusions the fixtures need to avoid.  Better than you include solutions for all of that in the initial design.

If you do get to the point of firmware stability where you can rely on pre-programming before installation, the supplier or assembly house can do it.  Manually taking chips out of packaging, loading them into that jig, then putting them back in pick and place compatible trays in proper orientation isn't something you really want to take on when industry is already setup to handle that.
 

Online SiliconWizard

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 5439
  • Country: fr
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2018, 07:50:00 pm »
The key point is that often the programming and testing is left as an afterthought, only being considered after the board design is done such that you end up needing to pick up a hodgepodge of signals from different places and connector styles, have few holes you can use for alignment fixturing and have odd protrusions the fixtures need to avoid.  Better than you include solutions for all of that in the initial design.

Absolutely agree with that.
You also have to keep in mind that even if the design is functional and reasonably bug-free on some development board, there may be new issues that only arise with the final board for various reasons. So that would be a pain to debug. You're not going to unsolder/resolder the chip everytime you want to test some firmware modification...

If you do get to the point of firmware stability where you can rely on pre-programming before installation, the supplier or assembly house can do it.  Manually taking chips out of packaging, loading them into that jig, then putting them back in pick and place compatible trays in proper orientation isn't something you really want to take on when industry is already setup to handle that.

And even when you get to the point of stability, whenever you'll need to update it for any reason (product evolution, customer request, rare bugs), you'd be back to square one.

Pre-programmed chips from suppliers are usually only used for very high volumes and most often with OTP chips rather than Flash-based for cost and/or tamper-resistance reasons.

 

Offline cowasaki

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 527
  • Country: gb
Re: TQFP32 Programming Socket
« Reply #11 on: February 05, 2018, 11:21:39 am »
Something like this:  http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CHIP-PROGRAMMER-SOCKET-TQFP32-QFP32-LQFP32-TO-DIP28-adapter-socket/272259450337?hash=item3f63ed85e1:g:atgAAOSwGjpXTTZR  would do vastly cheaper.  You could recreate the more expensive board as a temporary measure using a prototyping board or in 15 minutes build a more permanent thing by getting a 32 pin ZIFF and soldering it to strip board then adding the connections for the 2x3 header etc and labelling that socket plus you could add a second 2x3 connected to the pins for 328 etc.  If you use a 40pin ZIFF you could optionally add a program socket for 664/1284p etc as well...

EDIT: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Test-Socket-Programming-Adapter-Conversion-Block-For-0-5m-TQFP64-QFP64-LQFP64-IC/263095902661?_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D49895%26meid%3D792944fa021f440ca8f02a890632cfe2%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D272259450337%26itm%3D263095902661&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851  This is even cheaper and would make a decent start to a multi-programmer board.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2018, 11:24:50 am by cowasaki »
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf